Forced EVs

[nobspeople]

Many countries are moving to no internal combustion engine (ICE) car sales by XYZ date. California is moving to that as is Canada.
As the price of many homes are too high for many people (that's if they can find one and if they win the bidding war), this means many won't have a reliable place (ie garage) to charge their EV.

4.6 million new apartments are needed in the USA by 2030
https://www.naahq.org/news-publications ... ir%20needs.

Somewhere between 4% & 24% live in apartments in the USA (state dependent)
https://www.statista.com/statistics/798 ... state-usa/

This means 76%-94% live in houses, but how many of those houses have garages? And how many of those garages have access to electricity for charging?

I'm all for saving the environment, but what about those that don't have access to means to charge EVs? Is this the death of the road trip? In the USA, most employers don't give their employees 3-4 weeks vacation per year. If it takes you two days to get from New York to Miami, then two days to get back, that's half your week's vacation gone.

For discussion:
At this time, is the forced removal of ICE, replacing them with EVs, too soon?
Is there something else behind this other than saving the planet?
Is the charging infrastructure ready for this?
What about those who, when the time comes, have no place to charge their EVs?

[thomasdixon]

Do not charge—exchange instead

There is a better and easier way to get your car battery charged.
Just exchange your discharged battery with a charged one.
Just like in a car wash, drive between the rails, stop when the red light comes on and sit while your discharged battery is exchanged
with a charged one.
It will take you less time than you spend filling a car with gas

Car batteries
EV’s made practical
I think there is a second solution to the recharging problem.
Instead of spending hours recharging your car battery, why not just exchange the battery pack with a recharged one?
The current gas service stations could dig up the huge fuel tanks and replace this space with automated racks of charged battery packs.
The car drives into a narrow space like today’s drive-through car washing stations.
I think this would be a simple solution to a huge problem.
The turnaround time should be about as long as it took to fill the tank of a conventional car gas tank.

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BREAKING: In the early hours of the morning, Extinction Rebellion UK and groups in the Just Stop Oil Coalition have blocked 10 major oil facilities across the UK. We will continue to block the sites until the UK Government agrees to end all new fossil fuel investments immediately

The author, a regular contributor to New York Times Magazine and Harper's speculates on the role of oil in dominating the world's economy for the last century and the coming scenario that will result when the well runs dry.
The End of Oil: On the Edge of a Perilous New World: Roberts, Paul: 9780618239771: Amazon.com: Books

Summary Table as of 2017
Oil Reserves
1,650,585,140,000 barrels
Oil Consumption
35,442,913,090
barrels per year
97,103,871 barrels per day
Reserves/Consumption
47 (years left)
https://www.worldometers.info/oil/
The above data was published in 2017.

EV's will be the new norm.,..,.,.,.,.,.,.
Or so it seems
(:-

[oldbadger]

The answer for folks without garages, for distance travel, for general us has not been produced yet, but a 90% EV fitted with an ICE just for recharging might answer, because all local travel, city and town travel etc could be travelled as an EV. Hybrids are not 90% EVs.

I think there is a second solution to the recharging problem.
Instead of spending hours recharging your car battery, why not just exchange the battery pack with a recharged one?
The current gas service stations could dig up the huge fuel tanks and replace this space with automated racks of charged battery packs.
The car drives into a narrow space like todays drive-through car washing stations.
I think this would be a simple solution to a huge problem.
The turnaround time should be about as long as it took to fill the tank of a conventional car gas tank.

I have a small EV scooter with 40 mile range and it is powered by two 60volt 20amp hour batteries, the combined weight of these is half a hundredweight.

A average sized EV car needs a range of 200 miles or more and ten times more power, and the batteries will be weighing about one ton ( I guess), they are also stored in different spaces to spread their load. So any battery fast-changing facility would be rather complex.
But there is a worse problem. People might run their lithiums to the very last % of charge which damages them, and they might leave a heavily discharge lithium overnight with intent to change it next day on way to work, and that damages them.
But there is a worse problem...... my scooter battery cost £1300 ($1500?) and a car battery might cost £10-13,000. There's no way I would swap my batteries over for strange ones because if they are coming to 'end-of-life' I might get stuck with them.

So it's best for careful owners not to swap anything over at all.

[thomasdixon]

A average sized EV car needs a range of 200 miles or more and ten times more power, and the batteries will be weighing about one ton ( I guess)

My guess is far less but just like you, it is a guess.

they are also stored in different spaces to spread their load. So any battery fast-changing facility would be rather complex.
There is nothing more than de-complexing problem. The solution is, you do not charge your battery, you exchange it.

But there is a worse problem. People might run their lithium to the very last % of charge which damages them, and they might leave a heavily discharge lithium overnight with intent to change it next day on way to work, and that damages them.
Three (3) things could possibly fix this problem.
(1) Warning notice that the buyer must sign when purchasing the battery/EV.
(2) A sensor monitors the life of the battery and a warning light comes on when it senses a problem.
(3) _______________________

But there is a worse problem...... my scooter battery cost £1300 ($1500?) and a car battery might cost £10-13,000.
You are speaking of apples and oranges. Price is based on supply and demand. When the fossil fuel industry has no oil to produce gasoline (35-40 years from today =/- 10) this debate will become mute.
No animosity intended or implies
Btw good discussion
thanks for joining in

[oldbadger]

My guess is far less but just like you, it is a guess.

A Tesla battery weighs about 3/4 ton. it is the entire floor of the vehicle and built up of units about the same size as my EV scooter batteries.

Three (3) things could possibly fix this problem.
(1) Warning notice that the buyer must sign when purchasing the battery/EV.
(2) A sensor monitors the life of the battery and a warning light comes on when it senses a problem.
(3) _______________________

If buyers could be encouraged to sign contracts with such warning notices, then fine, but if that reduces sales for those models then you could bet on a fast U-turn about that.

You are speaking of apples and oranges. Price is based on supply and demand. When the fossil fuel industry has no oil to produce gasoline (35-40 years from today =/- 10) this debate will become mute.
No animosity intended or implies
Btw good discussion
thanks for joining in

When IC engines are only allowed in emergency or security vehicles, maybe EVs for distance travel will be hire-cars, like the EV mopeds that can be hired for city travel where I live....they are activated by mobile phone and can be left anywhere in city limits. Expand that in to EVhire-cars and longer distance travel might be easier in the future.

Personal vehicles might be better off within 100 miles of home.

I have an Artisan ev2000r 'vespa' scooter with a max range of 50 miles and since I can travel to two seaside towns plus an inland city and back home ..all in one journey of thirty miles, that is why I chose that EV. If I want to go 50 miles to London then I use train or coach.

[oldbadger]

My guess is far less but just like you, it is a guess.

A Tesla battery weighs about 3/4 ton. it is the entire floor of the vehicle and built up of units about the same size as my EV scooter batteries.

Three (3) things could possibly fix this problem.
(1) Warning notice that the buyer must sign when purchasing the battery/EV.
(2) A sensor monitors the life of the battery and a warning light comes on when it senses a problem.
(3) _______________________

If buyers could be encouraged to sign contracts with such warning notices, then fine, but if that reduces sales for those models then you could bet on a fast U-turn about that.

You are speaking of apples and oranges. Price is based on supply and demand. When the fossil fuel industry has no oil to produce gasoline (35-40 years from today =/- 10) this debate will become mute.
No animosity intended or implies
Btw good discussion
thanks for joining in

When IC engines are only allowed in emergency or security vehicles, maybe EVs for distance travel will be hire-cars, like the EV mopeds that can be hired for city travel where I live....they are activated by mobile phone and can be left anywhere in city limits. Expand that in to EVhire-cars and longer distance travel might be easier in the future.

Personal vehicles might be better off within 100 miles of home.

I have an Artisan ev2000r 'vespa' scooter with a max range of 50 miles and since I can travel to two seaside towns plus an inland city and back home ..all in one journey of thirty miles, that is why I chose that EV. If I want to go 50 miles to London then I use train or coach.

[thomasdixon]

A Tesla battery weighs about 3/4 ton. it is the entire floor of the vehicle and built up of units about the same size as my EV scooter batteries.

A standard car's gas tank is about (12 gallons) and weighs (6.1) X 12 = 73.2 pounds.
Your point is well taken.
Guess we are doomed!!!

[thomasdixon]

Then on second thought, all we need to do to hold that extra weight ls larger, stronger tires.
But, then again, tires are made out of rubber & the rubber comes from still fuels.
Yes, we are doomed!!!!!!

[thomasdixon]

Human laugh
https://tinyurl.com/2s428w4b
https://tinyurl.com/45nfzps8

[thomasdixon]

I have an Artisan ev2000r 'vespa' scooter with a max range of 50 miles and since I can travel to two seaside towns plus an inland city and back home ..all in one journey of thirty miles, that is why I chose that EV. If I want to go 50 miles to London then I use train or coach.

What's the latest on fuel cells
I think the space station is getting its power from fuel cells.

[oldbadger]

What's the latest on fuel cells
I think the space station is getting its power from fuel cells.

Dreadful, thomas..... really not good. The link below tells of a bunch of Teslas in a multi combustion. I recently watched a TV program about motorway crashes and an EV fire was so bad that the fire-brigade couldn't control it until it had been low-loaded to a yard and dropped in to a huge skip full of water. The most lithiums fires reported around here are caused by (probably) kids fiddling with their EV scoots' batteries.

Like I say, I do like my artisan but if we get an EV car it will be one of the old G-Wiz vehicles with brushed motors, 30 miles range and lead-acid batteries. We only drive very short distances anyway.


www.yahoo.com
Electric Vehicles Spontaneously Combust In Florida After Hurricane Ian
Recent reports spark serious concern over vehicle safety following saltwater flooding.
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com