.
Personally I have no interest in the celestial element of the kingdom of Heaven. To me, it's a foreign country. I want to stay right here on earth during Messiah's 1,000 year administration and visit all the places to which I have never gone, do all the things I've never done, and see all the things I've never seen.
The new cosmos won't be constructed till after Messiah's millennial rein on this corrupt earth is over, and the great white throne event wraps. Which is fine with me 'cause there's a lot left to see and do that I won't get around to in this life. I plan on making very good use of those thousand years to tour ever square inch of this planet-- on land and sea.
Can you just imagine having free rein of this planet with an immortal body and perpetual youth, and no fear of war, violence, poisonous snakes, toxic insects, or wild animals!? I can hardly wait. One of the first things I want to do in Messiah's kingdom is hike the triple crown: the Pacific Coast Trail, The Continental Divide Trail, and the Appalachian Trail. Yeah, Cirque of the Towers here I come!!!
People hike the big trails for a variety of personal reasons. Some march thru like soldiers to get it done and chalked up, while other's take their time and savor every minute of the adventure-- all the sights, sounds, smells, and wild things that they encounter along the way: even the dirt, the dust, the bugs, the hazards, and the discomforts. They are in no hurry to get done because if they hurry, they might miss something.
YouTube adventurer Jennifer Mabus (a.k.a. Starburst) is one of those. She even stopped for a while to watch two small lizards battle out a territorial dispute. Hiker trash passing by thought she was nuts and wasting time; but Jennifer was in Nirvana, so to speak.
Well; that's me. I want the whole nine yards. Charging ahead to the end of one of those wonderful trails is just not my idea of a heavenly good time.
• Ps 16:11 . . You will make known to me the path of life; in Your presence is fullness of joy; in Your right hand there are pleasures forever.
_
What I Expect In Heaven
Moderator: Moderators
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #11.
• Isa 2:4 . . Neither shall they learn war any more.
There's roughly 45½ million men and women in a military worldwide.
Globally, defense spending adds up to roughly 1¾ Trillion dollars.
In one of his speeches; former US President John Kennedy said:
“Every man, woman and child lives under a nuclear sword of Damocles, hanging by the slenderest of threads, capable of being cut at any moment by accident or miscalculation or by madness.”
The world has become a powder keg. There's easily enough nukes around the globe that if detonated, would likely send us all back to more primitive times.
In a famous comment, physicist Albert Einstein said:
“I do not know with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.”
In all my 78 years, I have yet to live even one decade free of the fear of war; but I expect to in Messiah's kingdom
• Isa 2:4 . .They shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation
NOTE: US $1 dollar bills are roughly 6.14 inches in length. One trillion of those would make a chain of currency stretching something like 96,906,565 miles, which is nearly three million miles past the average distance to the sun from the earth. (The current national debt is 30x that amount)
_
• Isa 2:4 . . Neither shall they learn war any more.
There's roughly 45½ million men and women in a military worldwide.
Globally, defense spending adds up to roughly 1¾ Trillion dollars.
In one of his speeches; former US President John Kennedy said:
“Every man, woman and child lives under a nuclear sword of Damocles, hanging by the slenderest of threads, capable of being cut at any moment by accident or miscalculation or by madness.”
The world has become a powder keg. There's easily enough nukes around the globe that if detonated, would likely send us all back to more primitive times.
In a famous comment, physicist Albert Einstein said:
“I do not know with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.”
In all my 78 years, I have yet to live even one decade free of the fear of war; but I expect to in Messiah's kingdom
• Isa 2:4 . .They shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation
NOTE: US $1 dollar bills are roughly 6.14 inches in length. One trillion of those would make a chain of currency stretching something like 96,906,565 miles, which is nearly three million miles past the average distance to the sun from the earth. (The current national debt is 30x that amount)
_
Last edited by WebersHome on Sat Jul 16, 2022 12:16 pm, edited 5 times in total.
-
Tcg
- Savant
- Posts: 8495
- Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:01 am
- Location: Third Stone
- Has thanked: 2147 times
- Been thanked: 2295 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #12Tcg wrote: ↑Tue Jul 12, 2022 2:23 pmWhat do you consider an atheist to be? What do you consider an agnostic to be? Why do you consider one worse than the other and why do you consider either bad?WebersHome wrote: ↑Tue Jul 12, 2022 10:47 am .
I would really like to visit Heaven's library where everything that's known and can be known about the cosmos is stored. Carl Sagan would've loved that library because he went to his grave with a lot of unanswered questions. But now they'll never be answered because Carl was, at best, an agnostic, and at worst, an atheist.
_
Tcg
Did you perhaps overlook these questions I asked about your statement concerning Carl Sagan?
Tcg
To be clear: Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods.
- American Atheists
Not believing isn't the same as believing not.
- wiploc
I must assume that knowing is better than not knowing, venturing than not venturing; and that magic and illusion, however rich, however alluring, ultimately weaken the human spirit.
- Irvin D. Yalom
- American Atheists
Not believing isn't the same as believing not.
- wiploc
I must assume that knowing is better than not knowing, venturing than not venturing; and that magic and illusion, however rich, however alluring, ultimately weaken the human spirit.
- Irvin D. Yalom
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #13.
There is a growing concern here in the USA about crime and prison overpopulation.
Well; the good news is: Messiah's kingdom will have no penal systems because He's
going to rule in strict compliance with the law of God wherein there are no prisons.
Fines? Yes. Reparations? Yes. Lashes? Yes. Burning? Yes. Hanging? Yes. Stoning?
Yes. Excommunication? Yes. But jails and prisons? No; confinement will not be an
option. Justice will be swift, punishment will be summary; and there will be no appeals.
People deserving capital punishment will get it that very day; no languishing on a death
row.
• Isa 9:6-7 . . For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government
shall be upon his shoulder . . . Of the increase of his government there shall be no end,
upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with
judgment and with justice.
In our world, only the rich can afford justice. Tort law is especially unfair. Large multi
billion dollar businesses can afford to stretch lawsuits out indefinitely till their less
fortunate opponents are financially ruined trying to keep up. That won't happen in
Messiah's world.
• Ps 72:2-4 . . He shall judge thy people with righteousness, and thy poor with judgment.
He shall judge the poor of the people, he shall save the children of the needy, and shall
break in pieces the oppressor.
In my country, too many judges at the State and Federal levels are political appointees,
resulting in a very large percentage of their opinions reflecting bias. It should be
interesting to see how Messiah goes about regulating the world to keep biased judges
out of its judicial systems. (cf. Psalm 82)
_
There is a growing concern here in the USA about crime and prison overpopulation.
Well; the good news is: Messiah's kingdom will have no penal systems because He's
going to rule in strict compliance with the law of God wherein there are no prisons.
Fines? Yes. Reparations? Yes. Lashes? Yes. Burning? Yes. Hanging? Yes. Stoning?
Yes. Excommunication? Yes. But jails and prisons? No; confinement will not be an
option. Justice will be swift, punishment will be summary; and there will be no appeals.
People deserving capital punishment will get it that very day; no languishing on a death
row.
• Isa 9:6-7 . . For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government
shall be upon his shoulder . . . Of the increase of his government there shall be no end,
upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with
judgment and with justice.
In our world, only the rich can afford justice. Tort law is especially unfair. Large multi
billion dollar businesses can afford to stretch lawsuits out indefinitely till their less
fortunate opponents are financially ruined trying to keep up. That won't happen in
Messiah's world.
• Ps 72:2-4 . . He shall judge thy people with righteousness, and thy poor with judgment.
He shall judge the poor of the people, he shall save the children of the needy, and shall
break in pieces the oppressor.
In my country, too many judges at the State and Federal levels are political appointees,
resulting in a very large percentage of their opinions reflecting bias. It should be
interesting to see how Messiah goes about regulating the world to keep biased judges
out of its judicial systems. (cf. Psalm 82)
_
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #14.
My neighborhood is popular with joggers. Well; one day, as a youthful runner passed by, I noticed how springy their gate was. As they came down on each foot in turn, they rebounded, i.e. bounced.
Well; it hit me that it had been quite a while ago that any of my steps were bouncy. At 78, each time I come down on one of my feet, even when walking, I come to ground with a solid jolt, as if my legs are made of wood; especially since replacing my natural knees with artificial joints. I think it might be time for me to get a pair of those fancy sports shoes that absorb shock. In Messiah's kingdom, I'll be back to normal.
• Mal 4:2 . . For you who revere My name, the sun of righteousness will rise with healing in its wings. And you will go out and leap like calves released from the stall.
• Isa 35:6 . .Then will the lame leap like a deer
_
My neighborhood is popular with joggers. Well; one day, as a youthful runner passed by, I noticed how springy their gate was. As they came down on each foot in turn, they rebounded, i.e. bounced.
Well; it hit me that it had been quite a while ago that any of my steps were bouncy. At 78, each time I come down on one of my feet, even when walking, I come to ground with a solid jolt, as if my legs are made of wood; especially since replacing my natural knees with artificial joints. I think it might be time for me to get a pair of those fancy sports shoes that absorb shock. In Messiah's kingdom, I'll be back to normal.
• Mal 4:2 . . For you who revere My name, the sun of righteousness will rise with healing in its wings. And you will go out and leap like calves released from the stall.
• Isa 35:6 . .Then will the lame leap like a deer
_
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #15.
I was very fortunate to enjoy the early years of my boyhood outdoors in and around the San Diego river back in the decade of the 1950s. Much of those outdoors are all gone now, bulldozed into oblivion to make way for shopping centers, factories, golf courses, and housing tracks. Where once I might encounter, at most, five or six people; are now hundreds.
There's a science fiction fantasy called a holographic environment simulator - a.k.a. Holodeck. With it, folks can re-create and visit historical events. Well; I would really like it if God has something like a Holodeck with which I could go back in time, so to speak, and revisit those 1950's environs as they were when I was a boy before progress erased them forever.
* Speaking of the 1950s; Saturday matinée at the movies cost just 20¢ for kids.
They ran two features, previews of coming attractions, a cartoon, a newsreel, and usually a bit of serial adventure like Flash Gordon. We could stay and watch everything all over again at no additional cost. That 20¢ bought a lot of entertainment.
_
I was very fortunate to enjoy the early years of my boyhood outdoors in and around the San Diego river back in the decade of the 1950s. Much of those outdoors are all gone now, bulldozed into oblivion to make way for shopping centers, factories, golf courses, and housing tracks. Where once I might encounter, at most, five or six people; are now hundreds.
There's a science fiction fantasy called a holographic environment simulator - a.k.a. Holodeck. With it, folks can re-create and visit historical events. Well; I would really like it if God has something like a Holodeck with which I could go back in time, so to speak, and revisit those 1950's environs as they were when I was a boy before progress erased them forever.
* Speaking of the 1950s; Saturday matinée at the movies cost just 20¢ for kids.
They ran two features, previews of coming attractions, a cartoon, a newsreel, and usually a bit of serial adventure like Flash Gordon. We could stay and watch everything all over again at no additional cost. That 20¢ bought a lot of entertainment.
_
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #16.
I think it's normal to feel a bit of anxiety about meeting with Jesus one-on-one because we dread he may be someone with whom we cannot relate. But not so. Jesus was on track to become a high priest. Well, that position has always been men rather than angels for a very good reason: sympathy, empathy, understanding, and compassion.
Angels haven't a clue what it's like to live down here on the earth as a human being. Well; Jesus did it for something like 33 years from childhood to manhood so he's better prepared to sympathize with our lot than are the angels.
The Bible says there is no trial taken you but such as is common to the entire human race (1Cor 10:13). Jesus wasn't shielded from any of those. The Word not only came as a man, but he also lived as a man.
Jesus knows by personal experience what it's like to be unattractive.
"There was nothing beautiful or majestic about his appearance, nothing to attract us to him." (Isa 53:2)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be marginalized.
"He was despised and rejected" (Isa 53:3a)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be blue and depressed.
"A man of sorrows, acquainted with bitterest grief." (Isa 53b)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be shunned.
"We turned our backs on him and looked the other way when he went by." (Isa 53:3a)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be without pity.
"He was despised, and we did not care." (Isa 53:3b)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be physically abused.
"Many who were appalled at him-- his appearance was so disfigured beyond that of any man and his form marred beyond human likeness" (Isa 52:14)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be a victim of injustice.
"He had done no wrong, and he never deceived anyone. But he was buried like a criminal" (Isa 53:9)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be stabbed in the back.
"Even my close friend, whom I trusted, he who shared my bread, has lifted up his heel against me." (Ps 41:9)
Etc.
So then, when we meet with Christ around the table in God's home, I don't expect to meet a stranger to my way of life; no, I fully expect to meet a man who's been around the block a time or two. Not only will he be able to relate to my stories, but I in return will be able to relate to his. Sharing in Christ's glory would have the nature of an entourage if not for the fact that I will have the satisfaction of knowing that Christ, in a manner of speaking, came from the same neighborhood as I to get to where he is today.
_
I think it's normal to feel a bit of anxiety about meeting with Jesus one-on-one because we dread he may be someone with whom we cannot relate. But not so. Jesus was on track to become a high priest. Well, that position has always been men rather than angels for a very good reason: sympathy, empathy, understanding, and compassion.
Angels haven't a clue what it's like to live down here on the earth as a human being. Well; Jesus did it for something like 33 years from childhood to manhood so he's better prepared to sympathize with our lot than are the angels.
The Bible says there is no trial taken you but such as is common to the entire human race (1Cor 10:13). Jesus wasn't shielded from any of those. The Word not only came as a man, but he also lived as a man.
Jesus knows by personal experience what it's like to be unattractive.
"There was nothing beautiful or majestic about his appearance, nothing to attract us to him." (Isa 53:2)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be marginalized.
"He was despised and rejected" (Isa 53:3a)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be blue and depressed.
"A man of sorrows, acquainted with bitterest grief." (Isa 53b)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be shunned.
"We turned our backs on him and looked the other way when he went by." (Isa 53:3a)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be without pity.
"He was despised, and we did not care." (Isa 53:3b)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be physically abused.
"Many who were appalled at him-- his appearance was so disfigured beyond that of any man and his form marred beyond human likeness" (Isa 52:14)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be a victim of injustice.
"He had done no wrong, and he never deceived anyone. But he was buried like a criminal" (Isa 53:9)
He knows by personal experience what it's like to be stabbed in the back.
"Even my close friend, whom I trusted, he who shared my bread, has lifted up his heel against me." (Ps 41:9)
Etc.
So then, when we meet with Christ around the table in God's home, I don't expect to meet a stranger to my way of life; no, I fully expect to meet a man who's been around the block a time or two. Not only will he be able to relate to my stories, but I in return will be able to relate to his. Sharing in Christ's glory would have the nature of an entourage if not for the fact that I will have the satisfaction of knowing that Christ, in a manner of speaking, came from the same neighborhood as I to get to where he is today.
_
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #17.
• Heb 2:5-8 . .The future world we are talking about will not be controlled by angels. For somewhere in the Scriptures it says: What is man that you should think of him, and the son of man that you should care for him?
. . . For a little while you made him lower than the angels, and you crowned him with glory and honor. You gave him authority over all things. Now when it says "all things," it means nothing is left out. But we have not yet seen all of this happen.
• 1Cor 6:2-3 . . Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases? Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!
From the gist of 1Cor 6:1-5 it appears the justice spoken of is relative to tort matters rather than crime-- defined as wrongful acts other than breaches of contract for which relief may be obtained in the form of damages or an injunction; and there are many categories addressing just about every kind of grievance imaginable. Well; I'm familiar with human activities but haven't a clue what angels might have in dispute amongst themselves.
Apparently Messiah intends to delegate quite a bit of his administration's business rather than attempt to do everything himself; but to be honest, I don't feel capable of umpiring even so much as a little league game let alone something like that depicted in 1Kings 3:16-28.
_
• Heb 2:5-8 . .The future world we are talking about will not be controlled by angels. For somewhere in the Scriptures it says: What is man that you should think of him, and the son of man that you should care for him?
. . . For a little while you made him lower than the angels, and you crowned him with glory and honor. You gave him authority over all things. Now when it says "all things," it means nothing is left out. But we have not yet seen all of this happen.
• 1Cor 6:2-3 . . Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases? Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!
From the gist of 1Cor 6:1-5 it appears the justice spoken of is relative to tort matters rather than crime-- defined as wrongful acts other than breaches of contract for which relief may be obtained in the form of damages or an injunction; and there are many categories addressing just about every kind of grievance imaginable. Well; I'm familiar with human activities but haven't a clue what angels might have in dispute amongst themselves.
Apparently Messiah intends to delegate quite a bit of his administration's business rather than attempt to do everything himself; but to be honest, I don't feel capable of umpiring even so much as a little league game let alone something like that depicted in 1Kings 3:16-28.
_
-
Tcg
- Savant
- Posts: 8495
- Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:01 am
- Location: Third Stone
- Has thanked: 2147 times
- Been thanked: 2295 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #18Perhaps you overlooked this again. Do you have any desire to answer questions related to your thread?Tcg wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 12:43 amTcg wrote: ↑Tue Jul 12, 2022 2:23 pmWhat do you consider an atheist to be? What do you consider an agnostic to be? Why do you consider one worse than the other and why do you consider either bad?WebersHome wrote: ↑Tue Jul 12, 2022 10:47 am .
I would really like to visit Heaven's library where everything that's known and can be known about the cosmos is stored. Carl Sagan would've loved that library because he went to his grave with a lot of unanswered questions. But now they'll never be answered because Carl was, at best, an agnostic, and at worst, an atheist.
_
Tcg
Did you perhaps overlook these questions I asked about your statement concerning Carl Sagan?
Tcg
Tcg
To be clear: Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods.
- American Atheists
Not believing isn't the same as believing not.
- wiploc
I must assume that knowing is better than not knowing, venturing than not venturing; and that magic and illusion, however rich, however alluring, ultimately weaken the human spirit.
- Irvin D. Yalom
- American Atheists
Not believing isn't the same as believing not.
- wiploc
I must assume that knowing is better than not knowing, venturing than not venturing; and that magic and illusion, however rich, however alluring, ultimately weaken the human spirit.
- Irvin D. Yalom
-
Difflugia
- Prodigy
- Posts: 3047
- Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:25 am
- Location: Michigan
- Has thanked: 3277 times
- Been thanked: 2023 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #19A monologue is difficult enough if the soapbox was wobbly to begin with.
My pronouns are he, him, and his.
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
Re: What I Expect In Heaven
Post #20.
• 1Cor 13:12 . . Now we see things imperfectly as in a poor mirror, but then we will see everything with perfect clarity. All that I know now is partial and incomplete, but then I will know everything completely, just as God knows me now.
Back then, mirrors were made of metal, and their surface finish wasn't nearly as good as the ones now. People's faces were somewhat distorted too, like those funny mirrors in carnivals. Plus, their reflection was like looking at the world through a dirty window; they could can see themselves alright, but not sharply.
For example; the first time I used the mirror in my bathroom when I got home from cataract surgery, I was startled to see how much I had aged over time without realizing it because now I could see all my wrinkles and blemishes clearly whereas before surgery I couldn't. It was like the operation had suddenly made me 15 years older.
For now the exhortation to "Know Thyself" is virtually impossible, but I think most us prefer not to see the real person that we are in too much detail: at least for now anyway.
_
• 1Cor 13:12 . . Now we see things imperfectly as in a poor mirror, but then we will see everything with perfect clarity. All that I know now is partial and incomplete, but then I will know everything completely, just as God knows me now.
Back then, mirrors were made of metal, and their surface finish wasn't nearly as good as the ones now. People's faces were somewhat distorted too, like those funny mirrors in carnivals. Plus, their reflection was like looking at the world through a dirty window; they could can see themselves alright, but not sharply.
For example; the first time I used the mirror in my bathroom when I got home from cataract surgery, I was startled to see how much I had aged over time without realizing it because now I could see all my wrinkles and blemishes clearly whereas before surgery I couldn't. It was like the operation had suddenly made me 15 years older.
For now the exhortation to "Know Thyself" is virtually impossible, but I think most us prefer not to see the real person that we are in too much detail: at least for now anyway.
_
