God has proved his love for you

[kjw47]

Gods plan = mortals to live in an Eden( Paradise) knowing only good, never sick, never without. To live forever not aging like now. That is what Gods plan began, it is still his plan. He created all things with variety for us to enjoy. His word says, he knew us before our kidneys were formed, he knows the exact number of hairs on our heads. Think about that. God could easily see us as we see little ants scurrying about. The creator of all creation thinks about us individually and wants to be our friend. He sent his son to die on our behalf's. He asks us to use our free will out of love for him to listen to his advice. Which benefits us not him. He gave us his written word. Few have bothered to read it and learn about how merciful and loving he is. His son showed us that side while he was on earth. But he also stands for justice. And those who cant be bothered to learn about him and listen to him are choosing not to enter his kingdom and gain eternal life. His name is YHWH(Jehovah) the only true God.
Will you learn to be his friend?

[Mae von H]

[Replying to Difflugia in post #59]

“The Niphal form is a verbal stem formation in Biblical Hebrew, usually indicated by a נִ prefix before the 1st radical of the verb. (This נ changes in multiple conjugations, see paradigms below.) The Niphal stem is extremely flexible in its use in Biblical Hebrew. Generally speaking, the Niphal stem expresses either passive or reflexive voice; but it can also express middle voice, reciprocal voice, simple action, or even stative action, depending on the context and the specific verb. “


It was the JW “Bible” writer who arbitrarily and against all qualified Bible linguists decided to use the reflective. It was a personal choice of a single man. One among Many changes away from the original languages. Back to the OP.

[onewithhim]

"This is what Jehovah has said, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel: 'I, Jehovah, am your God, the One teaching you to benefit yourself

That must be the JW version, It’s not at all in the Hebrew. Still no promise that God longs for friends. I am sure that those who claim for themselves the honor friendship with God can’t explain Him like real friends can explain each other.

That "must be the JW version"? Why don't you look it up in your Bible and see if your version disagrees. Before you make degrading accusations.

Why do you think I didn’t? I did. No match. looked in the Hebrew too.

Because I quoted from the NASB, not the New World Translation. If your Bible doesn't agree with the NASB, please quote from your Bible what those verses say. I will look forward to you clearing this up by quoting your Bible.

Exactly as I said JW Bible:
17 This is what Jehovah says, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel:+
“I, Jehovah, am your God,
The One teaching you to benefit yourself,*+

This is not what the Hebrew says nor any translation I could find. The Lord never says that He teaches us to (selfishly) benefit YOURSELF. That was the tip off. I knew it was JW when I read that. And it is.

Otherwise you don’t get it. No where does God say He’s lonely and looking for a friend. Those He (not-any man) counted as friends were few and far between. It’s an honor no honest man takes upon himself.

I quoted from, as I said, NOT the New World Translation, but the New American Standard Bible, which has nothing to do with Jehovah's Witnesses. It is not what I wrote in post #41. I asked you to quote your version to show that the NASB doesn't agree with your version of the quotes in post #41.

No you didn’t.

New American Standard Bible
This is what the LORD says, He who is your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: “I am the LORD your God, who teaches you to benefit, Who leads you in the way you should go.

There’s the New American Standard and that is not what you quoted.

Look at my post #41. That is what I'm talking about. Compare THOSE verses with your own Bible. They are all from the NASB.

The one I pointed out was definitely and only the JW version. I checked. No translation would have so changed the Hebrew. That’s how I knew it was JW. This you deny. That you switched to OTHER versions for OTHER verses doesn’t matter.

I did not deny. I put that verse in from the NWT to just set forth a pleading from God to His beloved human creation. That was AFTER my posting of three verses from the NASB in post #41. I asked you to look at your version of the Bible and compare to what the NASB says because you said that I am quoting from the NWT concerning those three verses. I told you I quoted from the NASB and you are lying about what I said or did. You make accusations, not nicely, and yet you expect me not to defend my posts. If you would do as I asked and compare the three verses in post #41 with your Bible, I'm sure you will see that they are essentially the same. They are not, as you say, from the NWT.

Ok, you finally admit you used the JW version for the verse I pinpointed. That thought is NO WHERE in scripture which is how I knew JWs wrote it. I know the history of their production and deviations. Let’s move on.

Then why does the New International Version and the King James Version and the Revised Standard Version, among others, say exactly what I posted from Isaiah 48:17,18, only leaving out the name of God? They are the same as the NWT.

"Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: I am the LORD thy God Which teacheth thee to profit, which leadeth thee by the way that thou shouldest go." (KJV)

"This is what the LORD says---your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: 'I am the LORD your God, who teaches you what is best for you, who directs you in the way you should go.'" (New International Version)

"Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: 'I am the LORD your God, who teaches you to profit, who leads you in the way you should go'" (Revised Standard Version)

How do these verses differ from your version? The NWT has it the same way. What does your version say that is so different?

[onewithhim]

Why do you think I didn’t? I did. No match. looked in the Hebrew too.

Exactly as I said JW Bible:
17 This is what Jehovah says, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel:+
“I, Jehovah, am your God,
The One teaching you to benefit yourself,*+

This is not what the Hebrew says nor any translation I could find. The Lord never says that He teaches us to (selfishly) benefit YOURSELF. That was the tip off. I knew it was JW when I read that. And it is.

What about the Hebrew makes you think that the implied object of the verb isn't "yourself?" In both Hebrew and English, the corresponding verbs are reflexive if there's no object. The phrase "benefit yourself" is awkward and a bit unnecessary, but not meaningfully different. There are plenty of problems with the NWT, but this isn't one of them.

Thank you, but I have to ask, what are the problems with the NWT? I have compared dozens of versions and have come to the conclusion that the NWT is quite accurate.

[Mae von H]

"This is what Jehovah has said, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel: 'I, Jehovah, am your God, the One teaching you to benefit yourself

That must be the JW version, It’s not at all in the Hebrew. Still no promise that God longs for friends. I am sure that those who claim for themselves the honor friendship with God can’t explain Him like real friends can explain each other.

That "must be the JW version"? Why don't you look it up in your Bible and see if your version disagrees. Before you make degrading accusations.

Why do you think I didn’t? I did. No match. looked in the Hebrew too.

Because I quoted from the NASB, not the New World Translation. If your Bible doesn't agree with the NASB, please quote from your Bible what those verses say. I will look forward to you clearing this up by quoting your Bible.

Exactly as I said JW Bible:
17 This is what Jehovah says, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel:+
“I, Jehovah, am your God,
The One teaching you to benefit yourself,*+

This is not what the Hebrew says nor any translation I could find. The Lord never says that He teaches us to (selfishly) benefit YOURSELF. That was the tip off. I knew it was JW when I read that. And it is.

Otherwise you don’t get it. No where does God say He’s lonely and looking for a friend. Those He (not-any man) counted as friends were few and far between. It’s an honor no honest man takes upon himself.

I quoted from, as I said, NOT the New World Translation, but the New American Standard Bible, which has nothing to do with Jehovah's Witnesses. It is not what I wrote in post #41. I asked you to quote your version to show that the NASB doesn't agree with your version of the quotes in post #41.

No you didn’t.

New American Standard Bible
This is what the LORD says, He who is your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: “I am the LORD your God, who teaches you to benefit, Who leads you in the way you should go.

There’s the New American Standard and that is not what you quoted.

Look at my post #41. That is what I'm talking about. Compare THOSE verses with your own Bible. They are all from the NASB.

The one I pointed out was definitely and only the JW version. I checked. No translation would have so changed the Hebrew. That’s how I knew it was JW. This you deny. That you switched to OTHER versions for OTHER verses doesn’t matter.

I did not deny. I put that verse in from the NWT to just set forth a pleading from God to His beloved human creation. That was AFTER my posting of three verses from the NASB in post #41. I asked you to look at your version of the Bible and compare to what the NASB says because you said that I am quoting from the NWT concerning those three verses. I told you I quoted from the NASB and you are lying about what I said or did. You make accusations, not nicely, and yet you expect me not to defend my posts. If you would do as I asked and compare the three verses in post #41 with your Bible, I'm sure you will see that they are essentially the same. They are not, as you say, from the NWT.

Ok, you finally admit you used the JW version for the verse I pinpointed. That thought is NO WHERE in scripture which is how I knew JWs wrote it. I know the history of their production and deviations. Let’s move on.

Then why does the New International Version and the King James Version and the Revised Standard Version, among others, say exactly what I posted from Isaiah 48:17,18, only leaving out the name of God? They are the same as the NWT.

"Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: I am the LORD thy God Which teacheth thee to profit, which leadeth thee by the way that thou shouldest go." (KJV)

"This is what the LORD says---your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: 'I am the LORD your God, who teaches you what is best for you, who directs you in the way you should go.'" (New International Version)

"Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: 'I am the LORD your God, who teaches you to profit, who leads you in the way you should go'" (Revised Standard Version)

How do these verses differ from your version? The NWT has it the same way. What does your version say that is so different?

Not a one of them says “to benefit yourSELF” alone. Not one. Why is this so difficult for you to see? Only the JW uses the false but enticing to the selfishness of man in order to “benefit YOURSELF” alone.

The others do NOT use the reflexive but say “to profit” others too, which is true, “what is best for you” is not great but better than the JW reflexive.

In this case the KJV is best as it clearly says the way that is right, not an appeal to “benefit yourself”-ishness.

[benchwarmer]

[Replying to Difflugia in post #59]

“The Niphal form is a verbal stem formation in Biblical Hebrew, usually indicated by a נִ prefix before the 1st radical of the verb. (This נ changes in multiple conjugations, see paradigms below.) The Niphal stem is extremely flexible in its use in Biblical Hebrew. Generally speaking, the Niphal stem expresses either passive or reflexive voice; but it can also express middle voice, reciprocal voice, simple action, or even stative action, depending on the context and the specific verb. “

It's generally good form to let readers know where you've cut and pasted your material from. In this case:

https://uhg.readthedocs.io/en/latest/stem_niphal.html

Carry on, interesting debate.

[Mae von H]

[Replying to Difflugia in post #59]

“The Niphal form is a verbal stem formation in Biblical Hebrew, usually indicated by a נִ prefix before the 1st radical of the verb. (This נ changes in multiple conjugations, see paradigms below.) The Niphal stem is extremely flexible in its use in Biblical Hebrew. Generally speaking, the Niphal stem expresses either passive or reflexive voice; but it can also express middle voice, reciprocal voice, simple action, or even stative action, depending on the context and the specific verb. “

It's generally good form to let readers know where you've cut and pasted your material from. In this case:

https://uhg.readthedocs.io/en/latest/stem_niphal.html

Carry on, interesting debate.

Anyone can google it, but thanks. Most just put in the link without bothering to copy and paste the pertinent info.

[Mae von H]

Why do you think I didn’t? I did. No match. looked in the Hebrew too.

Exactly as I said JW Bible:
17 This is what Jehovah says, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel:+
“I, Jehovah, am your God,
The One teaching you to benefit yourself,*+

This is not what the Hebrew says nor any translation I could find. The Lord never says that He teaches us to (selfishly) benefit YOURSELF. That was the tip off. I knew it was JW when I read that. And it is.

What about the Hebrew makes you think that the implied object of the verb isn't "yourself?" In both Hebrew and English, the corresponding verbs are reflexive if there's no object. The phrase "benefit yourself" is awkward and a bit unnecessary, but not meaningfully different. There are plenty of problems with the NWT, but this isn't one of them.

Thank you, but I have to ask, what are the problems with the NWT? I have compared dozens of versions and have come to the conclusion that the NWT is quite accurate.

You fail to see the difference between the text saying the Lord will guide you and he will guide you to benefit yourself. I have serious doubts you’ll see the difference. I’ve heard a few scholars on the JW Bible and no one thinks it’s accurate. I’m aware of the particular changes introduced that, for example, deny Christ being the Son of God. It’s the only “bible” I know completely controlled by one organization. But this isn’t the place to debate that.

[Mae von H]

Why do you think I didn’t? I did. No match. looked in the Hebrew too.

Exactly as I said JW Bible:
17 This is what Jehovah says, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel:+
“I, Jehovah, am your God,
The One teaching you to benefit yourself,*+

This is not what the Hebrew says nor any translation I could find. The Lord never says that He teaches us to (selfishly) benefit YOURSELF. That was the tip off. I knew it was JW when I read that. And it is.

What about the Hebrew makes you think that the implied object of the verb isn't "yourself?" In both Hebrew and English, the corresponding verbs are reflexive if there's no object. The phrase "benefit yourself" is awkward and a bit unnecessary, but not meaningfully different. There are plenty of problems with the NWT, but this isn't one of them.

Benefit yourSELF is the opposite of anything else in the real Bible. It’s not awkward, it’s an appeal to selfishness. I saw it immediately and nothing a Bible author would have written and no translator chose that phrasing.

But if one doesn’t want to see the difference, no amount of discussion will open the eyes.

[onewithhim]

"This is what Jehovah has said, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel: 'I, Jehovah, am your God, the One teaching you to benefit yourself

That must be the JW version, It’s not at all in the Hebrew. Still no promise that God longs for friends. I am sure that those who claim for themselves the honor friendship with God can’t explain Him like real friends can explain each other.

That "must be the JW version"? Why don't you look it up in your Bible and see if your version disagrees. Before you make degrading accusations.

Why do you think I didn’t? I did. No match. looked in the Hebrew too.

Because I quoted from the NASB, not the New World Translation. If your Bible doesn't agree with the NASB, please quote from your Bible what those verses say. I will look forward to you clearing this up by quoting your Bible.

Exactly as I said JW Bible:
17 This is what Jehovah says, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel:+
“I, Jehovah, am your God,
The One teaching you to benefit yourself,*+

This is not what the Hebrew says nor any translation I could find. The Lord never says that He teaches us to (selfishly) benefit YOURSELF. That was the tip off. I knew it was JW when I read that. And it is.

Otherwise you don’t get it. No where does God say He’s lonely and looking for a friend. Those He (not-any man) counted as friends were few and far between. It’s an honor no honest man takes upon himself.

I quoted from, as I said, NOT the New World Translation, but the New American Standard Bible, which has nothing to do with Jehovah's Witnesses. It is not what I wrote in post #41. I asked you to quote your version to show that the NASB doesn't agree with your version of the quotes in post #41.

No you didn’t.

New American Standard Bible
This is what the LORD says, He who is your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: “I am the LORD your God, who teaches you to benefit, Who leads you in the way you should go.

There’s the New American Standard and that is not what you quoted.

Look at my post #41. That is what I'm talking about. Compare THOSE verses with your own Bible. They are all from the NASB.

The one I pointed out was definitely and only the JW version. I checked. No translation would have so changed the Hebrew. That’s how I knew it was JW. This you deny. That you switched to OTHER versions for OTHER verses doesn’t matter.

I did not deny. I put that verse in from the NWT to just set forth a pleading from God to His beloved human creation. That was AFTER my posting of three verses from the NASB in post #41. I asked you to look at your version of the Bible and compare to what the NASB says because you said that I am quoting from the NWT concerning those three verses. I told you I quoted from the NASB and you are lying about what I said or did. You make accusations, not nicely, and yet you expect me not to defend my posts. If you would do as I asked and compare the three verses in post #41 with your Bible, I'm sure you will see that they are essentially the same. They are not, as you say, from the NWT.

Ok, you finally admit you used the JW version for the verse I pinpointed. That thought is NO WHERE in scripture which is how I knew JWs wrote it. I know the history of their production and deviations. Let’s move on.

Then why does the New International Version and the King James Version and the Revised Standard Version, among others, say exactly what I posted from Isaiah 48:17,18, only leaving out the name of God? They are the same as the NWT.

"Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: I am the LORD thy God Which teacheth thee to profit, which leadeth thee by the way that thou shouldest go." (KJV)

"This is what the LORD says---your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: 'I am the LORD your God, who teaches you what is best for you, who directs you in the way you should go.'" (New International Version)

"Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: 'I am the LORD your God, who teaches you to profit, who leads you in the way you should go'" (Revised Standard Version)

How do these verses differ from your version? The NWT has it the same way. What does your version say that is so different?

Not a one of them says “to benefit yourSELF” alone. Not one. Why is this so difficult for you to see? Only the JW uses the false but enticing to the selfishness of man in order to “benefit YOURSELF” alone.

That's right, the versions say "you" instead of "yourself." What is the difference? They mean the same thing.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to kjw47 in post #25]

Has He ever told you personally that He loves you or do you just read JW doctrine about it?

Are you an ex baptized JW?
God draws close to those who draw close to him.

That’s a pretty interesting answer. Essentially “join our organization and God will draw near to you.” But you cannot honestly tell me that God has told you He loves you.

I brought that point out because I know that JWs do not experience a personal intimate relationship with God and I wanted to make you hungry. The GB is not watching. Consider this. But I do admit an ex JW choice will be entailed.

What does "an ex JW choice will be entailed" mean?