In a recent topic ---- > here (viewtopic.php?t=38559&start=60), I posed the following question:
"when one reads this Verse, was the punishment commanded by the consensus of humans, or, god himself?"
Placing this into context, the interlocutor argues that God's moral don't change, but the assigned punishment does --- for whatever reason (undefined).... The above question has yet to be answered or addressed by my debate opponent. So I thought I would offer it here.
For debate:
1) Let's suppose God's morals do not change. Okay, great... Then why in the heck does god command that a priest's daughter is to be burned to death, if she loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father, with NO caveats?
2) If there exists caveats, why are they not mentioned?
3) Was this command ultimately issued/inspired by God, or humans? And how do you know?
4) Exactly when and WHY does this command no longer apply? Or is it still applied by God?
5) How can you distinguish if any passages, at all, are inspired by any god?
Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
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Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #1In case anyone is wondering... The avatar quote states the following:
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #141I am not going to watch a six minute video. Maybe you can just type your point.POI wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:00 pmI had to add a second response here.... It is people like you, for which videos like this have been made:AquinasForGod wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 5:14 pm I am sure this comes down to your atheistic interpretation of some OT verse.
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #142You presenting a 2 hour video in a post. But yea, okayAquinasForGod wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:08 pmI am not going to watch a six minute video. Maybe you can just type your point.POI wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:00 pmI had to add a second response here.... It is people like you, for which videos like this have been made:AquinasForGod wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 5:14 pm I am sure this comes down to your atheistic interpretation of some OT verse.
The point is simple.... If it sounds "bad", then you are taking it out of context. If it sounds "good", it's okay.
In case anyone is wondering... The avatar quote states the following:
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #143That cannot be true. There are interpretations that I think sound good, but I know them to be incorrect because they don't make sense contextually. There are ideas I think sound very bad like hell, yet it seems to be what Jesus taught.POI wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:13 pmYou presenting a 2 hour video in a post. But yea, okayAquinasForGod wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:08 pmI am not going to watch a six minute video. Maybe you can just type your point.POI wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:00 pmI had to add a second response here.... It is people like you, for which videos like this have been made:AquinasForGod wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 5:14 pm I am sure this comes down to your atheistic interpretation of some OT verse.
The point is simple.... If it sounds "bad", then you are taking it out of context. If it sounds "good", it's okay.
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #144Does this mean you have a 'strong inclination' against Jesus's concept of hell?AquinasForGod wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:19 pm That cannot be true. There are interpretations that I think sound good, but I know them to be incorrect because they don't make sense contextually. There are ideas I think sound very bad like hell, yet it seems to be what Jesus taught.
Also, when YHWH sanctioned 'rape', in what context was this necessary and/or "good"? Or was this "bad" too?
In case anyone is wondering... The avatar quote states the following:
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #145[Replying to AquinasForGod in post #143]
Funny how the omnipotent one can create and fine-tune a universe to umpteen decimal places for life to exist, but can't apply the same level of skill to the instruction manual he passed down for that life.
Funny how the omnipotent one can create and fine-tune a universe to umpteen decimal places for life to exist, but can't apply the same level of skill to the instruction manual he passed down for that life.
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #146I am not sure what is the point if you keep making the mistake of misrepresenting my view of strong inclination, which is a priori knowledge. That actually answers your question, btw.POI wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:34 pmDoes this mean you have a 'strong inclination' against Jesus's concept of hell?AquinasForGod wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:19 pm That cannot be true. There are interpretations that I think sound good, but I know them to be incorrect because they don't make sense contextually. There are ideas I think sound very bad like hell, yet it seems to be what Jesus taught.
Also, when YHWH sanctioned 'rape', in what context was this necessary and/or "good"? Or was this "bad" too?
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #147The whole bible is not an instruction manual. The instructions are pretty clear and easy to understand. Check out the catechism.brunumb wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:38 pm [Replying to AquinasForGod in post #143]
Funny how the omnipotent one can create and fine-tune a universe to umpteen decimal places for life to exist, but can't apply the same level of skill to the instruction manual he passed down for that life.
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #148I'll pass. Made up stuff about other made up stuff doesn't sound very compelling.
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #149You've issued responses, sure. But what question(s) have you answered exactly, and how so? (i.e.)AquinasForGod wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 11:19 pmI am not sure what is the point if you keep making the mistake of misrepresenting my view of strong inclination, which is a priori knowledge. That actually answers your question, btw.POI wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:34 pmDoes this mean you have a 'strong inclination' against Jesus's concept of hell?AquinasForGod wrote: ↑Sat Dec 03, 2022 6:19 pm That cannot be true. There are interpretations that I think sound good, but I know them to be incorrect because they don't make sense contextually. There are ideas I think sound very bad like hell, yet it seems to be what Jesus taught.
Also, when YHWH sanctioned 'rape', in what context was this necessary and/or "good"? Or was this "bad" too?
1) Have you demonstrated why the statement "rape is wrong" is any more of an objective statement than stating "eating warm feces is very yucky"? You can deduce both without ever having to actually experience both.
2) Have you demonstrated <THE> mechanism, which creates a clear <STANDARD> for (morals), any more than one can demonstrate <THE> mechanism, which creates a clear <STANDARD> for (economics)? Please stop calling this a false analogy. The point of this question is to demonstrate that you can no more apply <A STANDARD> to morals, than you can of other topics, like economics. If you think you can, let's hear it. Because you have not yet...
3) Have you informed us about how your deep passions and hatred for the topic of 'rape' actually parallels the Bible-God's position about 'rape'? The Bible-God does not seem to share your passion -- (a priori or other). On the contrary, God seems to hate gay sex. Do you detest it as much as He apparently does? Thus far, you have only accused me of having some 'atheistic agenda'. Well, I can just as easily accuse you of some bias or agenda, when reading the exact same passages
So far, I'd say you have not actually ANSWERED the (3) questions, which are still pending. But sure, you have issued responses
Last edited by POI on Sun Dec 04, 2022 12:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
In case anyone is wondering... The avatar quote states the following:
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."
- POI
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Re: Theists, Some Vexing Follow-up Questions?.?.?
Post #150The beauty of 'religion', is that Catholics, and all other countess denominations, get to make up whatever they want --- and it cannot be falsified. Case/point... "Well, evolutionary biology is a thing. This must mean when Genesis was written, Adam only became Adam when God decided to plop a 'soul' into a neanderthal/other."
In case anyone is wondering... The avatar quote states the following:
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."
"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."