How does atheism supply meaning?

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Wootah
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How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #1

Post by Wootah »

Clownboat wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 10:32 am
We are either simply part of the world existing for a brief time, in a massive universe, with death waiting and no purpose and meaninglessness and not in control of anything or we can create something and be something. This is atheism on one end and creation on the other.

It's why I don't believe there are atheists. No one can truly hold that view and I certainly don't think any atheists on this site really drink that cup to the full. I tried. Once. A long time ago.
Obviously, people do hold this view, less the meaningless part that was added to poison the well.
For those that are uncomfortable with said view, there are religious options available to fulfill the need to have purpose supplied to them.

What I can't understand is how it is a struggle for some to find purpose in this life and then seem to project that on to others that don't suffer from such a thing. I personally treat this life as something special and have plenty of purpose, because for all I know, it is the only one we will get. The idea of this life being a test for some other life actually would make this life less meaningful as the next would become the true goal. Therefore, could it be argued that atheism supplies more meaning/value for this life than religions in general? Those that struggle to find purpose without religion would obviously not be able to see this and would then be susceptible making claims like we see above.

"No one can truly hold that view" would therefore simply be a projection.
How does atheism supply meaning?
Proverbs 18:17 The one who states his case first seems right, until the other comes and examines him.

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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #211

Post by brunumb »

Wootah wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 5:14 am Always doing what you want demonstrates less freewill than not doing what you want. IMO...
:? That sounds bonkers to me.
Does anyone else have an opinion on this?
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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #212

Post by Wootah »

brunumb wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 5:54 am
Wootah wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 5:14 am Always doing what you want demonstrates less freewill than not doing what you want. IMO...
:? That sounds bonkers to me.
Does anyone else have an opinion on this?
Freewill topic: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=40517
Proverbs 18:17 The one who states his case first seems right, until the other comes and examines him.

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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #213

Post by brunumb »

Wootah wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 7:22 am
brunumb wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 5:54 am
Wootah wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 5:14 am Always doing what you want demonstrates less freewill than not doing what you want. IMO...
:? That sounds bonkers to me.
Does anyone else have an opinion on this?
Freewill topic: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=40517
Well that was a trip that achieved nothing. I'm guessing you have no sound explanation or justification for that claim. How about showing how "always doing what you want demonstrates less freewill than not doing what you want" works. How does one quantify free will so that it can be described in terms of more or less?
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.

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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #214

Post by TRANSPONDER »

Wootah wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 5:14 am
brunumb wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 1:23 am
Wootah wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 11:38 pm
brunumb wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 6:49 pm
Wootah wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 6:19 am It's like free will, yes if you can flail your arms around you are technically showing free will, but the martial artist that barely moves but is like a coiled spring is showing far more free will than you.
Interesting. Could you please explain how the martial artist is showing more free will than the arm-flailing person.
The free will is demonstrated in the control of motion, not the motion itself.

Is free will demonstrated in eating cake or not eating the cake?
It seems we are down the Wootah rabbit hole again. Never mind.

Any ideas on what meaning you will get from living forever in the afterlife?
You asked.

Eating the cake seems to demonstrate action and so demonstrate free will but not eating the cake demonstrates free will more so because you are overcoming something you want to do. Always doing what you want demonstrates less freewill than not doing what you want. IMO...
No no. Free will (choice making) is the same. Like the ability to choose to punch someone in the face. one can do it fairly lightly or a jaw -breaker. That makes no difference to the decision to do it. Same with eating cake or not. If one decides to eat the cake (or perhaps gives in to the instinctive desire to do it, which could be a contest between instinct and reason) then whether one eats one slice or three is beside the point.
I'm happy to follow the rabbit - hole as I think Wootah will find it leads nowhere but comes to a dead end.

p.s what has all this to do with atheism and meaning. but ok, let's try to get your point clear. You are arguing for varying degrees of Free will (I suppose the choice about the choice - once made, how much of it to do). So what is the argument you are trying to make about free will, Determinism, and a choice - making mechanism with or without a god behind it? i'm assuming you are making an argument about the nature of free will rather than just trying to blow a smoke screen so as to enable an escape.

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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #215

Post by Wootah »

[Replying to brunumb in post #213]

In a new thread so as to not take things off topic.
Proverbs 18:17 The one who states his case first seems right, until the other comes and examines him.

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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #216

Post by TRANSPONDER »

Wootah wrote: Mon Mar 20, 2023 5:30 pm [Replying to brunumb in post #213]

In a new thread so as to not take things off topic.
Kindly address the current points under discussion and do not wriggle and evade. We are wily old birds and will not fall for the Briar Patch ploy.

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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #217

Post by boatsnguitars »

Wootah wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 6:19 am I suspect that if you can do anything you want then everything is meaningless.
So God's life is meaningless? Your words, not mine.
“And do you think that unto such as you
A maggot-minded, starved, fanatic crew
God gave a secret, and denied it me?
Well, well—what matters it? Believe that, too!”
― Omar Khayyâm

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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #218

Post by TRANSPONDER »

boatsnguitars wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 6:52 am
Wootah wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 6:19 am I suspect that if you can do anything you want then everything is meaningless.
So God's life is meaningless? Your words, not mine.
We absolutely do get it - God does or says something, that is an objective Truth and thus everything has meaning and objectivity.

No god, then everything just came to be through random muddle. Where is the meaning?

I absolutely get it. But to me, an individual plan and opinion is no more than a personal opinion, no matter how big and bossy the boss is. To me, working things out for ourselves and devising what's important to us (yes, our own gods and idols, if one must use the terms) is far better than a divine plan and morality, as it would be to a Christian I guess, if Islam was deciding what the plan and morality was.

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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #219

Post by Wootah »

boatsnguitars wrote: Tue Mar 21, 2023 6:52 am
Wootah wrote: Sun Mar 19, 2023 6:19 am I suspect that if you can do anything you want then everything is meaningless.
So God's life is meaningless? Your words, not mine.
I don't believe God can do anything He wants. God cannot lie for example. This is a good thing. In all the ways we sin, God cannot and does not. So yeah, if that is a win in your box you can have it.
Proverbs 18:17 The one who states his case first seems right, until the other comes and examines him.

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Re: How does atheism supply meaning?

Post #220

Post by brunumb »

Wootah wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 2:46 am I don't believe God can do anything He wants. God cannot lie for example.
Do you think that God wants to lie, but can't?
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.

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