Jesus, a mess of his own making?

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Thomas123
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Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #1

Post by Thomas123 »

This guy may have sailed, 'too close to the wind'!
Unintentionally, he has created a monster

A Caring God

By pushing, the attentive shepherd, the child-friendly approachability, the forgiving father, the benevolent master, etc, themes,.......what has he done???

He has created hope and refuge in a caring God. The basis for a Caring God, in any way that is not merely allegorical, in nature is farcical and presumptuous, imho.

God is like these things but not these things.

This new fledgling Caring God is not the Biblical Yahweh,..I do not think it is even Allah(not sure).
This is what the Sanhedrin instinctively knew!
Jesus had instigated a new God!

We have been stuck with this montage, ever since!

Correct me if I am wrong!

Thanks!

Thomas123
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Re: Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #2

Post by Thomas123 »

Trust me.....a Caring God is everyone's worst nightmare. The concept is an anathema to the concept of free will. They are incompatible,....figure this one out!
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Miles
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Re: Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #3

Post by Miles »

Thomas123 wrote: Tue Feb 14, 2023 7:24 am This guy may have sailed, 'too close to the wind'!
Unintentionally, he has created a monster

A Caring God

By pushing, the attentive shepherd, the child-friendly approachability, the forgiving father, the benevolent master, etc, themes,.......what has he done???

He has created hope and refuge in a caring God. The basis for a Caring God, in any way that is not merely allegorical, in nature is farcical and presumptuous, imho.

God is like these things but not these things.

This new fledgling Caring God is not the Biblical Yahweh,..I do not think it is even Allah(not sure).
This is what the Sanhedrin instinctively knew!
Jesus had instigated a new God!

We have been stuck with this montage, ever since!

Correct me if I am wrong!

Thanks!
Not sure where you're coming from, but just to point out, in several places the Old Testament does present a caring god. Is this not good?

Deuteronomy 3:22
Do not be afraid of them; the LORD your God himself will fight for you.

Deuteronomy 31:7-8
"Be strong and courageous ... The LORD himself goes before you and will be with you; he will never leave you nor forsake you. Do not be afraid; do not be discouraged."

Joshua 1:9
Have I not commanded you? Be strong and courageous. Do not be afraid; do not be discouraged, for the LORD your God will be with you wherever you go.

Isaiah 49:13
Shout for joy, you heavens; rejoice, you earth; burst into song, you mountains! For the LORD comforts his people and will have compassion on his afflicted ones.

Jeremiah 1:8
"Do not be afraid of them, for I am with you and will rescue you," declares the LORD.

Lamentations 3:25
The LORD is good to those whose hope is in him, to the one who seeks him.

You also say "God is like these things but not these things." In what manner is he like them but not them? This needs clarification.

And in what way is god "new" and fledgling"? And why is he not the "Biblical Yahweh"? Whatever that entails.

And what are the characteristics of the new god Jesus instigated?


.

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Re: Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #4

Post by Thomas123 »

Thanks Miles, great questions that I will give time to.
I like your Isaiah 49 quote. Here is another.

Isaiah 49 :3
"He said to me, “You are my servant,
Israel, in whom I will display my splendor.”

A quick thought to keep this thing going. You might agree that Yahweh is a rather strict and stern parent God. He has adopted the Israelites for purpose. He cares little for a universal resolution to things. What is he doing? The Jews claim discovery rights on this God, almost like a patent on the first iron implement. Many of your quotes express the confidence of having this God back up that by definition no one else has.

I'll be back ,Miles but not very soon!
Thanks!

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Re: Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #5

Post by Thomas123 »

This is Yahweh, Miles!
Exodus 15:6 ESV
Your right hand, O Lord, glorious in power, your right hand, O Lord, shatters the enemy.
Job 26:14 ESV
Behold, these are but the outskirts of his ways, and how small a whisper do we hear of him! But the thunder of his power who can understand?”
Psalm 145:3 ESV
Great is the Lord, and greatly to be praised, and his greatness is unsearchable.
Psalm 96:4 ESV
For great is the Lord, and greatly to be praised; he is to be feared above all gods.
Isaiah 26:4 ESV
Trust in the Lord forever, for the Lord God is an everlasting rock.
Jeremiah 32:27 ESV
“Behold, I am the Lord, the God of all flesh. Is anything too hard for me?

etc, etc,etc....impersonal is the least of it!

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Re: Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #6

Post by Thomas123 »

Isaiah 10 has me considering that this move towards a caring God is earlier, and that Jesus tips it over the edge....leave it with me!

"Though the mountains be shaken
and the hills be removed,
yet my unfailing love for you will not be shaken
nor my covenant of peace be removed,”
says the Lord, who has compassion on you
.

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Re: Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #7

Post by Thomas123 »

It's the Father/Son thing, Miles. That's the tipping point,....look at this.

EXODUS 4: 22 Then say to Pharaoh, ‘This is what the Lord says: Israel is my firstborn son, 23 and I told you, “Let my son go, so he may worship me.” But you refused to let him go; so I will kill your firstborn son.’”

God is like a father to these tribes...., but not in the way the NT sells Jesus. The 'wonder and awe' lines are irrevocably blurred, and are being replaced by a meddling old fool. Too much for the Sanhedrin to stomach, apparently.
By the end of the NT, by way of an acquaintance of some kind we seem to have caught this tiger Yahweh ,by the tail

Whenever you stand praying, forgive, if you have anything against anyone, so that your Father who is in heaven will also forgive you your transgressions. (Mark 11:25)

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Re: Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #8

Post by Thomas123 »

What looks like a good thing, is actually a regression! This is like selling whiskey to Indians...shelter for the downtrodden within a non existent Caring God.

The swashbuckling, metaphorically moody, Yahweh of the OT is easily and reasonably equatable with natural phenomena and the vagaries of fortune, akin to the old volcano gods, but better.

This Christian God is so far removed from this metaphorical concept that it is 'something completely new'. It cannot possibly exist!

If you want a Caring God, then ...make it yourself! We now know this God"s plan, based it on a put-together, origin myth . We know what He is going to do, we know how He is going to do it. We know why he is going to do it and we think that we can have direct influence with Him through faith. These are Yahweh elements , regigged beyond recognition.

37 Jesus said unto him, “‘Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.’38 This is the first and great commandment.39 And the second is like unto it: ‘Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.’

This is the advice of the Jesus Guy , best advice ever given, imho, Let God love you in a God way......do good things and hopefully, good things will happen, no promises or gimmicks. Enjoy the ride!
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Re: Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #9

Post by Thomas123 »

God doesn't care!

God doesn't not-care!

Surely this elusive commodity, objectivity, must play a part here, if only as a foil to human subjectivity.

Preachers,....leave this God alone!

I welcome thoughts and opinions on all this!

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Re: Jesus, a mess of his own making?

Post #10

Post by Thomas123 »

Our Father

Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be
thy name. Thy kingdom come, thy will be done,
on earth, as it is in heaven. Give us this day our
daily bread and forgive us our trespasses as we
forgive those who trespass against us; and lead us
not into temptation, but deliver us from evil
.

You have a Cosmic God, you have dualism, you have humility before this God...all good, .....and mixed in with all this is, the presumptiousness of suggesting that this place is a fixerupper, and that He will get round to doing this soon, and make it like His place???

Is this benignly sincere or is it contrived?
I'm not sure!
What do you think?

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