Jesus, a mess of his own making?

[Thomas123]

This guy may have sailed, 'too close to the wind'!
Unintentionally, he has created a monster

A Caring God

By pushing, the attentive shepherd, the child-friendly approachability, the forgiving father, the benevolent master, etc, themes,.......what has he done???

He has created hope and refuge in a caring God. The basis for a Caring God, in any way that is not merely allegorical, in nature is farcical and presumptuous, imho.

God is like these things but not these things.

This new fledgling Caring God is not the Biblical Yahweh,..I do not think it is even Allah(not sure).
This is what the Sanhedrin instinctively knew!
Jesus had instigated a new God!

We have been stuck with this montage, ever since!

Correct me if I am wrong!

Thanks!

[Thomas123]

I agree with your last point, oldbadger ,but this is a 'Pandora's box, Genie in a bottle' scenario. Was his approach incorrect, was his instruction too unrefined , was he overexposed ,...unintentionally perhaps, but....
We have what we have ,... Pauline Christianity.
Did Jesus make a mess of things? That's the OP.
Thanks

[oldbadger]

I agree with your last point, oldbadger ,but this is a 'Pandora's box, Genie in a bottle' scenario. Was his approach incorrect, was his instruction too unrefined , was he overexposed ,...unintentionally perhaps, but....
We have what we have ,... Pauline Christianity.
Did Jesus make a mess of things? That's the OP.
Thanks

No.... Jesus didn't make the 'Christianity' mess, Thomas.
Jesus never heard of the word, he spoke Eastern Aramaic, his whole campaign was a return of the OT laws but without any of those that supported the Temple or its corrupted greedy priesthood. The Baptist felt the same way.

How his name and the mumbo-jumbo beliefs of Christianity got started is down to such as folks like Paul.

The author/s of G-John wrote that junk about 70 years after Jesus, a more realistic account is shown in G-Mark once the Christian additions have been weeded out. Most Christians are so wrapped up with the junk in G-John that they cannot even tell you what Jesus actually did.

But don't worry......... Christianity is slowly falling away and the majority of folks where I live don't take much notice of all this, maybe America will follow in time?

[1213]

Thanks 1213,

Isaiah 9:
"For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."
Isaiah 11
6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.
Isaiah 12
5 Sing unto the Lord; for he hath done excellent things: this is known in all the earth.

Please explain this to me,1213, as you see it! I am confused!

Why are you confused?

Interesting thing is, translations I have say:

...his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace...
Isa. 9:6

Bible tells God has given his name to Jesus. And obviously God's name can be called "Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace".

I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, keep them through your name which you have given me, that they may be one, even as we are. While I was with them in the world, I kept them in your name. Those whom you have given me I have kept. None of them is lost, except the son of destruction, that the Scripture might be fulfilled.
John 17:11-12

[Thomas123]

Please help my continued confusion about Isaiah, Chapters 8-13, 1213!

Let us assume that this is the messianic Christ Prophecy.,.

(1).there are two babies babies born in it.

Isaiah 8:3
And I went unto the prophetess; and she conceived, and bare a son. Then said the Lord to me, Call his name Mahershalalhashbaz

This hardly means that Isaiah had sex with a witch??? Surely she conceives prophecy, and not a physical baby?1213

(2)......These Chapters are filled with the politics of the time. This is a strange context in which to introduce ,the 'Prince of Peace'.

(3) The lion lying down with the lamb perhaps suggests a time of peace, but if it does...
---the messianic Christ didn't produce peace
---He didn't solve Israel's political woes either.
---can we accept His remit as Saviour,(articulated by Isaiah,in these chapters), to have been a complete failure?

What am I missing here, 1213?

[1213]

...
This hardly means that Isaiah had sex with a witch??? Surely she conceives prophecy, and not a physical baby?1213
...

I don't see how it could mean Isaiah would have had sex with a witch. However, I don't also see how it would mean not a physical baby.

(3) The lion lying down with the lamb perhaps suggests a time of peace, but if it does...
---the messianic Christ didn't produce peace
---He didn't solve Israel's political woes either.
---can we accept His remit as Saviour,(articulated by Isaiah,in these chapters), to have been a complete failure?

Jesus brought peace:

Peace I leave with you. My peace I give to you; not as the world gives, give I to you. Don’t let your heart be troubled, neither let it be fearful.
John 14:27

And I think God's kingdom has everlasting peace, it is just probably not what you think it is.

Being asked by the Pharisees when the Kingdom of God would come, he answered them, “The Kingdom of God doesn’t come with observation; neither will they say, ‘Look, here!’ or, ‘Look, there!’ for behold, the Kingdom of God is within you.”
Luke 17:20-21

In my opinion Jesus was very successful, did exactly what God had ordered him to do.

But, maybe I don't understand correctly what is your problem, because I don't see any problem in Isaiah.

[Thomas123]

Isaiah 8:3
And I went unto the prophetess; and she conceived, and bare a son. Then said the Lord to me, Call his name Mahershalalhashbaz
1213
I don't see how it could mean Isaiah would have had sex with a witch. However, I don't also see how it would mean not a physical baby.
Thomas1213
Isaiah had sex with the Prophetess, and she had a baby and God gave him the 17 letter name.

Isaiah was this guys genetic father.

Correct, 1213???

Had he any other kids?

[oldbadger]

Jesus brought peace:

Peace I leave with you. My peace I give to you; not as the world gives, give I to you. Don’t let your heart be troubled, neither let it be fearful.
John 14:27

And I think God's kingdom has everlasting peace, it is just probably not what you think it is.

Matthew {10:34} Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. {10:35} For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. {10:36} And a man’s foes [shall be] they of his own household.

[1213]

Jesus brought peace:

Peace I leave with you. My peace I give to you; not as the world gives, give I to you. Don’t let your heart be troubled, neither let it be fearful.
John 14:27

And I think God's kingdom has everlasting peace, it is just probably not what you think it is.

Matthew {10:34} Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. {10:35} For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. {10:36} And a man’s foes [shall be] they of his own household.

Disciples of Jesus can have peace, even if others don't.

[1213]

Isaiah 8:3
And I went unto the prophetess; and she conceived, and bare a son. Then said the Lord to me, Call his name Mahershalalhashbaz
1213
I don't see how it could mean Isaiah would have had sex with a witch. However, I don't also see how it would mean not a physical baby.
Thomas1213
Isaiah had sex with the Prophetess, and she had a baby and God gave him the 17 letter name.

Isaiah was this guys genetic father.

Correct, 1213???

Had he any other kids?

By what I see, Isaiah was not necessary the father. It is not directly said in the scripture. And at the moment I don't know did he have any other kids.

[oldbadger]

Jesus brought peace:

Peace I leave with you. My peace I give to you; not as the world gives, give I to you. Don’t let your heart be troubled, neither let it be fearful.
John 14:27

And I think God's kingdom has everlasting peace, it is just probably not what you think it is.

Matthew {10:34} Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. {10:35} For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. {10:36} And a man’s foes [shall be] they of his own household.

Disciples of Jesus can have peace, even if others don't.

Oh no!...... Not again!
Christians only, eh? Or is it just another glaring contradiction?
But, in any case, are you telling us that all Christian disciples have enjoyed peace through their lives?