Donald Trump Getting Indicted & Arrested

[Zorek]

• 1. Former President Donald Trump took to social media and said he expects to be arrested Tuesday.

• 2. A grand jury has been hearing testimony related to the 2016 payoff to Stormy Daniels, but no public announcements have been made about when or if Trump will actually be indicted.

• 3. Trump cited leaks from the “corrupt” Manhattan district attorney’s office and urged his supporters to protest on his behalf. (CNBC)

• 4. Twitter CEO Elon Musk on Saturday predicted that former President Donald Trump will be re-elected in a "landslide" if he is indicted — or possibly arrested and potentially "handcuffed" — next week.

Question 1: Should Trump be arrested and charged?
Question 2: It has been suggested that a protest could be a part 2 of the Jan 6, 2021 insurrection. Do you agree yes or no and why?
Question 3: Is Elon Musk right in his observation?

[The Barbarian]

Arresting your party’s primary political opponent on something this nebulous is a dangerous. The apparent crime is recording repaying hush money as “legal expenses.”

You're forgetting the case of John Edwards. Indicting, prosecuting, convicting, and even locking up politicians for campaign finance violations is nothing new in US history. The main difference this time around are Trump's implied threats of violence.

Edwards was a US Senator arrested by the US Department of Justice on six felony accounts. If Trump is arrested then it would be a former president arrested by a politician who is a member of the opposing part on single misdemeanor charge with the unlikely possibility of adding a felony charge.

He was indicted for over 30 felonies related to hush money. Same kind of thing Edwards was nailed for.
Donald Trump indicted by Manhattan grand jury on more than 30 counts related to business fraud
https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/30/politics ... index.html

And a former president has no more immunity than you or I do.

The DOJ should absolutely prosecute corrupt politicians,

New York beat DOJ; they got him first.

The differences are striking enough to make the comparison unreasonable.

Calling on his supporters to take action, and threatening the DA and the Judge are things only Trump did. Edwards, when he got caught , took it like a man. But then Edwards is a man.

[The Barbarian]

Question 1: Should Trump be arrested and charged?

If he broke the law, he should. The question remains though regarding the evidence for the crime.

Question 2: It has been suggested that a protest could be a part 2 of the Jan 6, 2021 insurrection. Do you agree yes or no and why?

That can happen if political leaders inflame the situation. Turn it into a dire situation, an injustice. That usually gets people riled up.

Question 3: Is Elon Musk right in his observation?

If Trump is convicted, the legally, he can not be president again. If he is indicted and charges are found to be false and/or politically motivated, then I can see Trump being reelected.

Actually, Trump could run, even if convicted.

[Miles]

Question 1: Should Trump be arrested and charged?

If he broke the law, he should. The question remains though regarding the evidence for the crime.

Question 2: It has been suggested that a protest could be a part 2 of the Jan 6, 2021 insurrection. Do you agree yes or no and why?

That can happen if political leaders inflame the situation. Turn it into a dire situation, an injustice. That usually gets people riled up.

Question 3: Is Elon Musk right in his observation?

If Trump is convicted, the legally, he can not be president again. If he is indicted and charges are found to be false and/or politically motivated, then I can see Trump being reelected.

Actually, Trump could run, even if convicted.

And possibly be elected.

Can convicted felons be president?

There are few requirements to serve as U.S. president. According to the U.S. Constitution, anyone who is at least 35 years old, a natural born citizen of the United States and a U.S. resident for at least 14 years is eligible to be elected president. Because the Constitution does not mention criminal records, a person indicted or convicted of a felony would not be barred from serving in the role so long as he or she meets the other requirements.
source


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[bjs1]

He was indicted for over 30 felonies related to hush money. Same kind of thing Edwards was nailed for.
Donald Trump indicted by Manhattan grand jury on more than 30 counts related to business fraud
https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/30/politics ... index.html

And a former president has no more immunity than you or I do.

The charges were surprisingly like those against Edwards.

Edwards was not nailed for anything. Edwards was acquitted on one count and the others were dropped. This should help demonstrate how difficult such charges are to prove.

The issue is not immunity. The issue is using the justice system as a political weapon. No one gets immunity, but for a politically elected DA to bring charges against his party’s primary opponent then the case needs to be rock solid. Virtually all legal scholars agree that this case is far from rock solid.

The DOJ should absolutely prosecute corrupt politicians,

New York beat DOJ; they got him first.

New York did not beat the DOJ. The DOJ has not made any effort to arrest Trump. This charge came from an elected member of the Democratic Party.

[The Barbarian]

New York did not beat the DOJ. The DOJ has not made any effort to arrest Trump. This charge came from an elected member of the Democratic Party.

Turns out, even black democrat prosecutors have the same rights and duties as any other prosecutor.

[bjs1]

New York did not beat the DOJ. The DOJ has not made any effort to arrest Trump. This charge came from an elected member of the Democratic Party.

Turns out, even black democrat prosecutors have the same rights and duties as any other prosecutor.

This again avoids the issue. No one is questioning the DA’s right to bring charges. The issue is an elected official using his power to prosecute and possibility imprison his political party’s primary antagonist.

Yes, the DA followed the letter of the law. The worst dictators in history usually followed the letter of the law when they imprisoned their political opponents. I am not saying that this DA is near that bad, but he has taken a step in that direction. If this case is anything less than a slam dunk (and it is clearly far less than that), then the DA is using the justice system to attack his party’s political rivals. That is a dangerous precedent to set.

This case, and the failure of other Democrats to speak out against it, makes the Democratic Party appear petty and best and corrupt at worst.

[The Barbarian]

New York did not beat the DOJ. The DOJ has not made any effort to arrest Trump. This charge came from an elected member of the Democratic Party.

Turns out, even black democrat prosecutors have the same rights and duties as any other prosecutor.

This again avoids the issue.

Probably a bad idea for you to bring it up, then.

The issue is an elected official using his power to prosecute and possibility imprison his political party’s primary antagonist.

Don't see anywhere in the law where that gives Trump any sort of immunity. Sorry. And in fact...

Donald Trump threatens to jail Hillary Clinton in second presidential debate
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... ry-clinton

His first AG got in trouble when he told Trump that he couldn't just have Hillary arrested.

Yes, the DA followed the letter of the law. The worst dictators in history usually followed the letter of the law when they imprisoned their political opponents.

That seems unlikely, given that the worst dictators in history had ruled by decree before they ever arrested opponents. But I'd be open to your evidence. What do you have? A jury of citizens found evidence to indicate Trump committed over 30 felonies. Trump's defense seems to be "I was president, so I can't be held accountable." The justice system seems to be reminding him that he's like anyone else, now.

I am not saying that this DA is near that bad, but he has taken a step in that direction.

Well, equality under the law is a basic Constitutional principle.

This case, and the failure of other Democrats to speak out against it, makes the Democratic Party appear petty and best and corrupt at worst.

Obstruction is a thing. The legal thing to do, is let the law take its course. As you probably know, one republican congressman may have already crossed the line on obstruction of justice by trying to interfere in the process of a state court.

'Particularly repugnant': Former prosecutor accuses Jim Jordan of obstruction of justice
https://www.rawstory.com/jim-jordan-obs ... f-justice/

Jordan is not immune from an obstruction charge; his conduct is now being examined. He's already tagged in a lawsuit, and more may be coming.

[Diogenes]

[Replying to bjs1 in post #9]
I disagree with virually every point in this post of bjs1.
Donald J Trump is an inveterate liar and criminal. He attempted a resurrection when he realized he lost the election. Unfortunately a significant number of Americans are so biased and incapable or unwilling to separate truth from lies when the liar espouses beliefs these people agree with. Trump is obviously not a Christian if by 'Christian' we mean a follower of the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth.

In addition to his criminal behavior it's hard to imagine a person who acts in a way more contrary to the Beatitudes of Jesus.
He should be arrested because there is probable cause to believe he has committed numerous crimes and will continue his criminal enterprise if allowed the smallest freedom. The only question is whether he will die before the slow, the very S-L-O-W, wheels of justice grind him into dust.

He is beloved by White 'Christian' Nationalists who essentially are Christian Fascists* who want a phony theocracy with Trump as its ruler, pretending to represent their god. He is accused of serial rape and admitted he is a sexual predator. Their support of Trump is an indictment of the kind of fake 'Christianity' that is purely tribal and selfish and completely divorced from the teachings of Jesus.

A large part of the problem is the absurd and dangerous gun culture in America that has become wedded to Christian Facism, a sub culture well described by the former Gov. Huckabee in "Guns, God, and Gravy." How has Jesus become the poster boy for the NRA? This horrendous and largely poorly educated subculture in the U.S. is anti science and anti truth. They do not care if Trump is a criminal and do not want him convicted of anything. I cannot think of a greater or more reliable test for ignorance, graft, and stupidity, than whether a person supports Donal J. Trump, criminal and would-be dictator who idolizes other dictators like Putin and Kim Jong Un.

A tandem demon in this anti Constitution/anti Christian phenomenon of the far right, is having their very own Propaganda Network, Fox News, fanning the flames of disinformation.
________________________
*Christian fascism is a term which is used to describe a far-right political ideology that denotes an intersection between fascism and Christianity. It is sometimes referred to as "Christofascism", a neologism which was coined in 1970 by the liberation theologian Dorothee Sölle.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_fascism

[bjs1]

[Replying to bjs1 in post #9]
I disagree with virually every point in this post of bjs1.
Donald J Trump is an inveterate liar and criminal. He attempted a resurrection when he realized he lost the election. Unfortunately a significant number of Americans are so biased and incapable or unwilling to separate truth from lies when the liar espouses beliefs these people agree with. Trump is obviously not a Christian if by 'Christian' we mean a follower of the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth.

In addition to his criminal behavior it's hard to imagine a person who acts in a way more contrary to the Beatitudes of Jesus.
He should be arrested because there is probable cause to believe he has committed numerous crimes and will continue his criminal enterprise if allowed the smallest freedom. The only question is whether he will die before the slow, the very S-L-O-W, wheels of justice grind him into dust.

He is beloved by White 'Christian' Nationalists who essentially are Christian Fascists* who want a phony theocracy with Trump as its ruler, pretending to represent their god. He is accused of serial rape and admitted he is a sexual predator. Their support of Trump is an indictment of the kind of fake 'Christianity' that is purely tribal and selfish and completely divorced from the teachings of Jesus.

A large part of the problem is the absurd and dangerous gun culture in America that has become wedded to Christian Facism, a sub culture well described by the former Gov. Huckabee in "Guns, God, and Gravy." How has Jesus become the poster boy for the NRA? This horrendous and largely poorly educated subculture in the U.S. is anti science and anti truth. They do not care if Trump is a criminal and do not want him convicted of anything. I cannot think of a greater or more reliable test for ignorance, graft, and stupidity, than whether a person supports Donal J. Trump, criminal and would-be dictator who idolizes other dictators like Putin and Kim Jong Un.

A tandem demon in this anti Constitution/anti Christian phenomenon of the far right, is having their very own Propaganda Network, Fox News, fanning the flames of disinformation.

Ok, but none of that is the crime he was charged with.

I am not defending Donald Trump. I am defending the rule of law.

You don’t seem to have disagreed with, or even addressed, anything that I wrote.

[Diogenes]

[Replying to bjs1 in post #9]
I disagree with virually every point in this post of bjs1.
Donald J Trump is an inveterate liar and criminal. He attempted a resurrection when he realized he lost the election....

In addition to his criminal behavior it's hard to imagine a person who acts in a way more contrary to the Beatitudes of Jesus.
He should be arrested because there is probable cause to believe he has committed numerous crimes and will continue his criminal enterprise if allowed the smallest freedom. The only question is whether he will die before the slow, the very S-L-O-W, wheels of justice grind him into dust.... He is accused of serial rape and admitted he is a sexual predator. Their support of Trump is an indictment of the kind of fake 'Christianity' that is purely tribal and selfish and completely divorced from the teachings of Jesus.
....

Ok, but none of that is the crime he was charged with.

I am not defending Donald Trump. I am defending the rule of law.

You don’t seem to have disagreed with, or even addressed, anything that I wrote.

OK. You wrote:
Arresting your party’s primary political opponent on something this nebulous is a dangerous.
....
To my mind, to arrest a former president on such a minor charge "

I disagree that the crime he is currently being prosecuted for is either "nebulous" or "minor." I also don't think Trump should get a pass just because he's someone's political opponent. BTW, that is an incorrect statement of fact. Bragg, the prosecutor, is not Trump's political opponent. Biden is, but he is not prosecuting. NY is.

Trump is facing multiple cases, civil and criminal from several different plaintiffs, including The People. The Manhattan charges are serious because they involve fraud on the electorate. Bragg's case was ready, so he filed it. The other cases are proceeding, but it's slow going in part because of Trump's delaying tactics. It's important to remember that neither this prosecution, nor the others, are being coordinated as part of some master prosecution. Trump's decades of criminal behavior has simply caught up with him.