Christians and Guns

[boatsnguitars]

Every day, 321 people are shot in the United States. Among those:
111 people are shot and killed
210 survive gunshot injuries
95 are intentionally shot by someone else and survive
42 are murdered
65 die from gun suicide
10 survive an attempted gun suicide
1 is killed unintentionally
90 are shot unintentionally and survive
1 is killed by legal intervention*
4 are shot by legal intervention and survive
1 died but the intent was unknown
12 are shot and survive but the intent was unknown

DAILY GUN VIOLENCE IMPACTING CHILDREN AND TEENS (1-17)
Every day, 22 children and teens (1-17) are shot in the United States. Among those:
5 die from gun violence
3 are murdered
17 children and teens survive gunshot injuries
8 are intentionally shot by someone else and survive
2 children and teens either die from gun suicide or survive an attempted gun suicide
8 children and teens are unintentionally shot in instances of family fire — a shooting involving an improperly stored or misused gun found in the home resulting in injury or death

ANNUAL GUN VIOLENCE IMPACTING PEOPLE OF ALL AGES IN THE U.S.
Every year, 117,345 people are shot. Among those:
40,620 people die from gun violence
15,343 are murdered
76,725 people survive gunshot injuries
34,566 are intentionally shot by someone else and survive
23,891 die from gun suicide
3,554 survive an attempted gun suicide
492 killed unintentionally
547 are killed by legal intervention
1,376 are shot by legal intervention and survive
347 die but the intent was unknown
4,471 are shot and survive but the intent is unknown
547 women are killed by their husband or male dating partner**

ANNUAL GUN VIOLENCE IMPACTING CHILDREN AND TEENS (AGES 1-17)
Every year, 7,957 children and teens are shot in the United States. Among those:
1839 children and teens die from gun violence
992 are murdered
6,294 children and teens survive gunshot injuries
2,788 are intentionally shot by someone else and survive
693 die from gun suicide
166 survive an attempted gun suicide
10 are killed by legal intervention
101 are shot by legal intervention and survive
99 are killed unintentionally
2,893 are shot unintentionally and survive
38 die but the intent was unknown
380 are and survive shot but the intent is unknown



WWJD? Nothing?

[Wootah]

Again.......... anybody, including felons, can get a gun in America.
How else do you think that so many villains have guns?

Please walk us through this.
The waitress, that didn't report her tips and has been convicted. Where can she get her gun in America?

Have you ever heard of the black market?

Not tracking the whole conversation but are you arguing bad guys can get guns on the black market but good guys shouldn't be able to get them legally?

[boatsnguitars]

Again.......... anybody, including felons, can get a gun in America.
How else do you think that so many villains have guns?

Please walk us through this.
The waitress, that didn't report her tips and has been convicted. Where can she get her gun in America?

Have you ever heard of the black market?

Not tracking the whole conversation but are you arguing bad guys can get guns on the black market but good guys shouldn't be able to get them legally?

Are you arguing that it's good to avoid paying taxes? That felons are good people? My, that's quite a charge, considering all the Objective Moral Values you guys teach... also, didn't the Bible say we are all sinful (aka, not good)?

BTW, this is another data point for why Theists are bad at moral values.
They would surely argue: "But paying her taxes isn't THAT bad, so in the eyes of me and God (cause I know God, we're tight) she's still Objectively Good and should be able to own a gun!"

That may be the case (that she's good in the eyes of God), but in the eyes of the Law, she isn't a Good or Bad person: she committed an illegal act and must pay the penalty. Law and Order, right?

This is kinda like saying, "Hey he murdered someone - but that doesn't mean he shouldn't be able to take out a loan, vote and walk around free! He's still a Good person in the eyes of God!"

[Wootah]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #72]

I don't understand your point.

[boatsnguitars]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #72]

I don't understand your point.

Thank you for being open about that. It's ok. I sometimes don't understand things, and need to re-read a few times. Like Heidegger.

[oldbadger]

Again.......... anybody, including felons, can get a gun in America.
How else do you think that so many villains have guns?

Please walk us through this.
The waitress, that didn't report her tips and has been convicted. Where can she get her gun in America?

Have you ever heard of the black market?

Not tracking the whole conversation but are you arguing bad guys can get guns on the black market but good guys shouldn't be able to get them legally?

No.
I've been claiming that America is awash with guns, and also that anybody can get hold of a gun there.
That and only that.

As for legislation there, I cannot think of any that would make a difference for generations.

[boatsnguitars]

Again.......... anybody, including felons, can get a gun in America.
How else do you think that so many villains have guns?

Please walk us through this.
The waitress, that didn't report her tips and has been convicted. Where can she get her gun in America?

Have you ever heard of the black market?

Not tracking the whole conversation but are you arguing bad guys can get guns on the black market but good guys shouldn't be able to get them legally?

No.
I've been claiming that America is awash with guns, and also that anybody can get hold of a gun there.
That and only that.

As for legislation there, I cannot think of any that would make a difference for generations.

That's the sad thing. It's the Conservative way: make the problem so bad, there is no fixing it:
Let there be too many guns, and ghost guns, and DIY guns that there can be no law to reign it back in.
Let Global Warming get so bad that nothing can fix it
Let HIV spread so there is no way to stop AIDS (we, luckily beat them on this, but it was close)
Let COVID spread so there is no fixing it (Now we have to live with it forever because people wouldn't stay home and mask up for a few weeks.)
Let cigarette sales flourish so there is little we can do about lung cancer (we're pushing back as much as possible)
Let acid rain flourish until we have no forests left to protect (since they want to cut them all down anyhow) - we fought against this and won.
Hold off Consumer Protection laws for as long as possible to make it hard to put restrictions on life-threatening diet supplements and woo-woo pseudoscience.
Let people suffer without Health Insurance until they die.
Etc.

The COnservative mantra is: Let everything go to pot, because we have to teach personal responsibility. But when people try to make laws - which would show personal responsibility - they get mad. They think each person has to stop COVID, but then tell people Covid isn't real, or HIV< or Climate Change, or gun violence.

[Wootah]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #76]

That sounds like scapegoating. Blaming a boogeyman. Highly religious thought processes.

[boatsnguitars]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #76]

That sounds like scapegoating. Blaming a boogeyman. Highly religious thought processes.

Gosh, I don't want to be religious! That would be the worst.

But, i have to wonder if you are mistaking scapegoating for pointing out the responsible party. That is, if Responsibility is important to you?

[Clownboat]

Please walk us through this.
The waitress, that didn't report her tips and has been convicted. Where can she get her gun in America?

Have you ever heard of the black market?

Clownboat: Anyone can murder and eat babies in the UK.... anyone.
Oldbadger: Please walk us through how this is true.
Clownboat: Have you ever heard of cannibalisms?

Your claim is as true and meaningful as my example.

In reality, felons in America cannot possess a firearm, nor ammo and cannibalism of infants is also illegal in the UK... even though it is awash with babies!

[Clownboat]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #76]

That sounds like scapegoating. Blaming a boogeyman. Highly religious thought processes.

Gosh, I don't want to be religious! That would be the worst.

But, i have to wonder if you are mistaking scapegoating for pointing out the responsible party. That is, if Responsibility is important to you?

Poisoning the well and assuming facts not in evidence... Agree with me, or I'll suggest you don't care about responsibility.

A divided people are easier to rule.
For example, Democrat vs Republican and religious vs non religious.

Guns will remain hard to control in America because democrats and republicans are too busy blaming each other in place of working together. Not because one party is right and the other wrong. That is religious thinking (tribal actually), something humans are prone to due our beginnings and rulers take advantage of this without most citizens even realizing it. What's actually important to most is that their 'tribe' (party, religion, sports team, etc) is seen as right. Us vs Them (which is in fact a highly religious/tribal thought process).