False Prophecy

[JoeMama]

Matthew said scripture predicted the virgin birth of Jesus:

"She shall bring forth a son, that it might be fulfilled that which was spoken of by Isaiah, saying, Behold, a virgin shall bring forth a son and call his name Emmanuel" (Matthew 1:21-23)

Now look at what scripture said:

"The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son and will call him Immanuel. Before the boy knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right...." (Isaiah 7:14-16)

The Isaiah verse above refers to a child who did not yet know enough to reject the wrong and choose the right, so it could not have been the perfect all-knowing messiah he was referring to.

Matthew was wrong.

[Athetotheist]

Matthew said scripture predicted the virgin birth of Jesus:

"She shall bring forth a son, that it might be fulfilled that which was spoken of by Isaiah, saying, Behold, a virgin shall bring forth a son and call his name Emmanuel" (Matthew 1:21-23)

Now look at what scripture said:

"The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son and will call him Immanuel. Before the boy knows enough to reject the wrong and choose the right...." (Isaiah 7:14-16)

The Isaiah verse above refers to a child who did not yet know enough to reject the wrong and choose the right, so it could not have been the perfect all-knowing messiah he was referring to.

Matthew was wrong.

It actually says, "the young woman has conceived. Isaiah is indicating a woman of marrying age who is already pregnant.

[TRANSPONDER]

It was already understood that this was not a misreading of the Hebrew, but a misunderstanding of the Greek where Bethulah and Almah are both translated with Parthenos. The problem is that Matthew read his OT in Greek. This is also the reason why he (alone of the gospels) has Jesus slap the Sadducees with the 'babes and sucklings' quote from Psalms which is not what the OT says but it is more like how the Septuagint says.

We already know about the Two donkeys over - literal reading of the Zechariah passage, and I posted earlier of the patchwork prophecy of Judas made up of bits of OT. On top of that, Matthew's nativity shows that he interpreted the King of the Jews/Messiah,even as having a Christian connotation which Herod and any other Jew would not have considered. I think the evidence is strong that Matthew was a Greek Christian, very much interested in the OT (and possibly seeing Jesus as a new Moses) but could not read it in Hebrew and indeed didn't understand it as a Hebrew would. Certainly the cherry on top of this feta ice cream Sunday, is the prophecy of the massacre of innocents which relates to Assyria destroying the northern kingdoms and is nothing to do with an Herodian atrocity in Bethlehem which is (historically) highly doubtful anyway.

[JoeMama]

[Replying to Athetotheist in post #2]

I was aware of that. Young woman, versus virgin. Either way, the "reject wrong" argument is not affected.

[1213]

...so it could not have been the perfect all-knowing messiah he was referring to.

Why do you think Jesus should be all knowing?

[TRANSPONDER]

You are making a fair point. I'll see whether you get a response for a bit before I weigh in on this.

[brunumb]

[Replying to JoeMama in post #1]

As Christians are so fond of saying, it's all about the context. When one reads all of Isaiah 7 it is patently clear that it has nothing to do with Jesus at all. It was a sign for Ahaz.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=KJV

[1213]

[Replying to JoeMama in post #1]

As Christians are so fond of saying, it's all about the context. When one reads all of Isaiah 7 it is patently clear that it has nothing to do with Jesus at all. It was a sign for Ahaz.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=KJV

Actually it is said for house of David:

And He said, Hear now, O house of David...
Isa. 7:13

[Athetotheist]

[Replying to JoeMama in post #1]

As Christians are so fond of saying, it's all about the context. When one reads all of Isaiah 7 it is patently clear that it has nothing to do with Jesus at all. It was a sign for Ahaz.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=KJV

Actually it is said for house of David:

And He said, Hear now, O house of David...
Isa. 7:13

Who among the house of David saw Jesus conceived in Mary's womb?

Since Jesus' conception wasn't visible to the house of David, it didn't qualify as a sign to the house of David.

[1213]

....
Who among the house of David saw Jesus conceived in Mary's womb?
...

His family was house of David and they saw Mary's pregnancy.