It just have to be reasonable

[Eloi]

To believe in God you don't need complicated reasons, or scientific reasons, or being intellectual, or having all the answers in the world. To believe in God, only one reason is needed: to realize reality.

Heb. 3:4 Of course, every house is constructed by someone, but the one who constructed all things is God.

The beauty of the Universe and everything that exists on our planet proves that there is an Intelligent and powerful Creator.

If you found a house in the middle of the desert, would you believe that it was made by itself as a result of sandstorms over trillions of years?

The earth is like a house in the middle of a space desert. It has drinking water, electricity, light, food pantries, indirect music, air conditioning and heating... and even carpets.

Rom. 1:20 For his invisible qualities are clearly seen from the world’s creation onward, because they are perceived by the things made, even his eternal power and Godship, so that they are inexcusable.

Is there any objective reason why this very simplistic reasoning is invalid?

[DrNoGods]

[Replying to LittleNipper in post #19]

Your speculation nor that of anyone else cannot be regarded as fact without personally witnessing the event in question.

I sure hope you are not a crime scene investigator! We don't need to personally witness things to know they happened. Evidence left behind (artifacts, fossils, etc.) can be used to piece together many historical events, even ones long before humans existed on this planet which has been only very briefly in the scheme of things. Did you personally witness Jesus being resurrected? If not, I assume you cannot regard that as a fact (or any other accounts of Jesus, or anyone living prior to your own birth), correct?

[DrNoGods]

[Replying to Eloi in post #20]

Hahahaha, You are in the height of your delirium!

Really? You posted this:

"Have you ever asked an evolutionist when apes began to feel ashamed to have their private parts exposed?"

Besides the fact that "evolutionists" don't study such things, the obvious answer to this question is when apes had evolved sufficiently (ie. into modern humans) to worry about such things. If humans did not evolve from apes, then the answer to your question would be never, since (nonhuman) apes are not ashamed to have their private parts exposed. But since humans did evolve from earlier apes, the question does have an answer which is when that transition took place (and humans were able to make clothes). Your question implies that humans did evolve from apes, which is progress. Glad to see you are finally coming around.

[Eloi]

[Replying to Eloi in post #20]

Hahahaha, You are in the height of your delirium!

Really? You posted this:

"Have you ever asked an evolutionist when apes began to feel ashamed to have their private parts exposed?"

...

And your conclusion was that I "finally realize that humans did indeed evolve from apes".
You should work out you thinking.

[Eloi]

That humans cover their private parts is a demonstration of the existence of human consciousness, and that feature has never been found in animals. If evolutionists believe that humans are transmuted apes, they should show that at some point these apes began to feel ashamed of being naked and began to make clothing to cover themselves.

Covering yourself from the cold is a necessity for every living being that has no natural protection. The shame of being naked has nothing to do with it. Only humans cover their private parts out of shame, and that is even being done by aborigines in many parts of the earth at this very moment.

Again: what would caused an ape to feel and transmit to its offspring the shame of being naked? What myth are they going to invent now? Sort of like Froidian sexual theories? Just saying

[DrNoGods]

[Replying to Eloi in post #23]

And your conclusion was that I "finally realize that humans did indeed evolve from apes".

Your own initial question implied that ... since humans are the only apes that cover their private parts intentionally. Or do you have examples of nonhuman apes who do this, in which case that would answer your question if you have a date for this nonhuman ape's appearence in the fossil record.

[Eloi]

If there is a need for me to explain better:

That humans cover their private parts is a demonstration of the existence of human consciousness, and that feature has never been found in animals. If evolutionists believe that humans are transmuted apes, they should show that at some point these apes began to feel ashamed of being naked and began to make clothing to cover themselves.

Covering yourself from the cold is a necessity for every living being that has no natural protection. The shame of being naked has nothing to do with it. Only humans cover their private parts out of shame, and that is even being done by aborigines in many parts of the earth at this very moment.

Again: what would caused an ape to feel and transmit to its offspring the shame of being naked? What myth are they going to invent now? Sort of like Froidian sexual theories? Just saying

I would never believe in something just because.

[DrNoGods]

[Replying to Eloi in post #24]

If evolutionists believe that humans are transmuted apes, they should show that at some point these apes began to feel ashamed of being naked and began to make clothing to cover themselves.

Wow ... do you really think evolution works that way? Here's a tip ... go read up on evolution of the human brain. There are many easy-to-read web articles on this ... pick one:

https://humanorigins.si.edu/human-chara ... ics/brains

https://www.yourgenome.org/stories/evol ... man-brain/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_the_brain

You'll find that this encephalization process resulted in progressively larger brains (eg. from Homo habilis to Homo sapien), and more structural changes. A result of this was progressively higher intelligence levels, and eventually the ability to engage in abstract thought, art, music and other things humans do. Included in that, somewhere along the line, the idea that exposing ones private parts in public was wrong.

Nonhuman apes don't have sufficiently developed brains to engage in the abstract thoughts that humans do, which is why they don't cover their genitals, or make sophisticated art or music, or build houses, or many of the things more intelligent humans do. This brain development was a long progression over a few million years, and you can just look at Homo erectus to see what they accomplished over the "smartest" nonhuman ape (a lot), while getting nowhere close to what Homo sapiens have accomplished.

The whole evolutionary story of human evolution just makes too much sense doesn't it? It explains the actual fossil record and the human history we actually do see, and shows conclusively that modern humans did not suddenly appear fully formed some 6000 years ago. That story has no support whatsoever from science.

[Eloi]

My question is genuine and makes sense.
Evolutionists pretend that everything a human being is, came out of what an ape was.
You have to prove it, right?

It saddens me that all your comments are full of links without personally explaining something that is being discussed in the forum. I think you do it because you have never internalized the theory, but you only assume it by someone else's imposition or something else.

It is evident to me that evolutionism is supported by sophists, but it is very far from being an objective reality.

[DrNoGods]

[Replying to Eloi in post #28]

Evolutionists pretend that everything a human being is, came out of what an ape was.
You have to prove it, right?

It has been proven. The problem you have is that you completely ignore this 150+ years of scientific effort, analysis of the fossil record, genetics work, anthropology and archeology, etc. and base everything on fictional stories from a 2000+ year old holy book. No matter how much evidence is uncovered to prove humans evolved from a great ape ancestor, you and people like you will never believe it because it is trumped by your belief in the ancient bible stories. It is that simple.

It saddens me that all your comments are full of links without personally explaining something that is being discussed in the forum. I think you do it because you have never internalized the theory, but you only assume it by someone else's imposition or something else.

I do describe things in the links (did you read the 2 paragraphs after the 3 links in post 27?). The links are provided to support the comments, which are not just my personal opinion. To describe everything humans have learned about brain evolution, or evolution in general, would take tens of thousands of posts and pages on this forum which is impractical. Links to articles in encylopedia websites, Wikipedia, etc. give concise summaries, which links to more detailed sources if needed. This is how you support a claim beyond just a personal opinion. But you ignore this huge mountain of educational resources and only support your claims with bible verses (not valid as support in this section of the forum), or one-liner responses like "Sure", "Funny", 'Idoicy", etc.

How about some links to external sources (ie. something besides your personal opinion) besides the bible or a religious organization to support the claim that humans were "created" some 6000 years ago, fully formed and intelligent. What science supports this? Got anything?

[Eloi]

[Replying to Eloi in post #28]

Evolutionists pretend that everything a human being is, came out of what an ape was.
You have to prove it, right?

It has been proven. ...

In your imagination.