THE FALSE DOCTRINE OF "THE AGE OF ACCOUNTABILITY"

[Eddie Ramos]

It's interesting that this is another widely held doctrine by Christians, yet no one has ever put forth an actual age from the scriptures where children are not accountable for their sins. The fact is that when God looks at a human being, he looks at their heart and sees either righteousness or unrighteousness. If righteousness, then that means that Christ's atoning work has been applied to your life. At which point he has given that person a new and perfect heart that is free from sin, and has raised their dead soul to eternal life. If God sees unrighteousness in their heart, then it means that Christ's atoning work has not (or not yet) been applied to that individual and that individual is still in his or her sins. This applies from the moment of conception.

Psalm 51:5 (KJV 1900)
Behold, I was shapen in iniquity;
And in sin did my mother conceive me.

Can something conceived in sin be pure and clean in the eyes of God? The Bible says, no.

Job 14:4 (KJV 1900)
Who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean? Not one.

So, how does God view a child conceived and still unsaved? The same way he views a grown up who is still unsaved, as wicked.

Psalm 58:3 (KJV 1900)
The wicked are estranged from the womb:
They go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.

Most will say, "babies can't speak, so this can't be referring to babies". Yet this is parabolic language (as is the whole Bible) which is speaking of the spiritual condition (as viewed by God) of mankind who was yet in his sins.

When the Bible as a whole is taken into acount, it absolutely contradicts and therefore rejects such doctrine of any age of accountability. But why then was it invented? Because it was build upon another false doctrine, the free will doctrine which states that a person must make an informed choice if he is going to accept Christ. And since babies can't do that, they had to find a way to make them exempt. But this goes to show what happpens when someone tries to build upon a crooked foundation, everything else they build on that foundation will also be crooked.

My question for anyone who hold to this doctrine is, can you show me how the scriptures you use to support such doctrine agree witht he above Bible verses provided? Because if we isolate passages from the Bible as a whole, then we can make them say anything we want.

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #108]

The word "torment" is a word in Greek ---basanizo---and is used in the Scriptures a number of times. One example is the sailing of a boat in bad weather....it is a difficult job. We might say that the boat is being prevented from sailing on its chosen course. (Matt.14:24) A word associated with that is basanistes (Matt.18:34) and is translated as jailers in some translations and "tormentors" in others.

The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia (1960, Vol. V, p.2999) said this:

"Probably THE IMPRISONMENT ITSELF WAS REGARDED AS 'TORMENT' and the tormentors need mean nothing but 'jailers.'"

So we have Satan and the demons being "jailed" in a sense, by being put into the symbolic lake of fire. They are thus unable to do anything.

Well, according to the scriptures as inspired by God, they are able to feel tormented.

So the demons will be cut off from their life-course and will be dead,

Once again, they are not "dead" according to the God inspired scriptures:

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing... (Ecclesiastes 9:5)

If they know torment, they do know some thing. So they are not dead.

Not even scream in pain in a lake of fire.

That's comical. Pain exists in the physical world, not the spiritual.

"Dead" means actual death, not being alive somewhere in pain.

But you claimed above that being alive forever in torment was the same as death.

Satan's imprisonment means death. If he is dead, he is not immortal.

Not according to the scriptures quoted above! Not even close.

I'll have to side with God on this one.

<==================================>

Actually, I think the devil's predicament is why God created mortal man as Plan B.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #111]

Unfortunately, I'll have to go the way of putting you on my delete list as well. I'll leave you to mislead all of the innocent people who come here to find answers. It's a pity.

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #111]

Unfortunately, I'll have to go the way of putting you on my delete list as well. I'll leave you to mislead all of the innocent people who come here to find answers. It's a pity.

I'm always going to defend the Word of God.

Perhaps ya'll could form a club.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #111]

Unfortunately, I'll have to go the way of putting you on my delete list as well. I'll leave you to mislead all of the innocent people who come here to find answers. It's a pity.

I'm always going to defend the Word of God.

Perhaps ya'll could form a club.

You are not defending God's Word. You are perverting it. You ignore most of the rebuttals to your unscriptural posts and keep saying the same things without comment on the other posts. No comment on what I researched on harpagmos and basanos. If you even read my posts on those subjects you would know what they mean. It is important to go to the original Greek (and Hebrew) to get the sense of what happened/is happening/will happen. You skip right over many explanations.

[myth-one.com]

You are not defending God's Word. You are perverting it. You ignore most of the rebuttals to your unscriptural posts and keep saying the same things without comment on the other posts.

Let's review one of your recent claims.

<=========================================>

They are thus unable to do anything.

Well, according to the scriptures, spiritual bodied beings cast into the lake of fire are able to feel "tormented"

And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. (Revelation 20:10)

So the demons will be cut off from their life-course and will be dead,

Once again, they are not "dead" according to the God inspired scriptures:

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing... (Ecclesiastes 9:5)

If they know torment, they do know some thing. So they are not dead.

<==================================>

You have dodged this repeatedly.

You claim that every thing cast into the lake of fire dies. The scriptures claim that the devil will be tormented day and night for ever in the lake of fire.

So the devil will be conscious in the lake of fire forever. So not every being cast into the lake of fire will die.

Can you prove your claim above, or will you accuse me of not responding again?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #115]
I haven't dodged anything. I have explained what the lake of fire means and what "torment" means in the New Testament. I explained what the Greek word for "torment" means and how there is a direct link to the demons being "jailed" so that they can't do anything and how that links with death. You keep insisting that "death" doesn't really mean death! You go against the Scriptures constantly. The Bible indicates that death means that a being is actually dead!

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #115]
I haven't dodged anything. I have explained what the lake of fire means and what "torment" means in the New Testament. I explained what the Greek word for "torment" means and how there is a direct link to the demons being "jailed" so that they can't do anything and how that links with death. You keep insisting that "death" doesn't really mean death! You go against the Scriptures constantly. The Bible indicates that death means that a being is actually dead!

Explain how the devil can know torment while he is dead.

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing... (Ecclesiastes 9:5)

[onewithhim]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #115]
I haven't dodged anything. I have explained what the lake of fire means and what "torment" means in the New Testament. I explained what the Greek word for "torment" means and how there is a direct link to the demons being "jailed" so that they can't do anything and how that links with death. You keep insisting that "death" doesn't really mean death! You go against the Scriptures constantly. The Bible indicates that death means that a being is actually dead!

Explain how the devil can know torment while he is dead.

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing... (Ecclesiastes 9:5)

I have explained it ad nauseum. See post # 110., and there are other posts before that. It would be one thing if I never answered you, you would be right in questioning me, but I have explained it, so why ask the same question over and over again?

[2timothy316]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #108]

The word "torment" is a word in Greek ---basanizo---and is used in the Scriptures a number of times. One example is the sailing of a boat in bad weather....it is a difficult job. We might say that the boat is being prevented from sailing on its chosen course. (Matt.14:24) A word associated with that is basanistes (Matt.18:34) and is translated as jailers in some translations and "tormentors" in others.

The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia (1960, Vol. V, p.2999) said this:

"Probably THE IMPRISONMENT ITSELF WAS REGARDED AS 'TORMENT' and the tormentors need mean nothing but 'jailers.'"

So we have Satan and the demons being "jailed" in a sense, by being put into the symbolic lake of fire. They are thus unable to do anything. That is what happens when someone is jailed. Their plans are brought to an end. So the demons will be cut off from their life-course and will be dead, so they won't be able to do anything. Not even scream in pain in a lake of fire. "Dead" means actual death, not being alive somewhere in pain. Satan's imprisonment means death. If he is dead, he is not immortal.

This is correct and the only way that the scripture in Revelation 20:10 is in harmony with the rest of the Bible. Otherwise, Satan is in the book of life without being righteous. This would also mean that eternal life isn't a reward but a punishment. A righteous Satan just cannot be. Thus we have to look elsewhere in the Bible for this word torment and what it means. We find something like the word torment at Matthew 18:34 as OWH has pointed out.

[myth-one.com]

I have explained it ad nauseum.

Yes you have, but never correctly.


And the devil was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

This means the devil was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.