Is revivalism Biblical?

[Ross]

From the earliest Christianity to Catholicism, its related branches, and the subsequent Dark Ages, there have been many revivalisms. Including Protestantism, Unitarianism, Mormonism, The Millerites, Second Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses, Charismatic Pentecostalism and more. Excuse me if I have missed out your own faith.
But is there any Biblical support for a revivalist true Christian revolution or restoration; or are we all in an unholy doctrinal soup? And does the Almighty have a true church today?

[Ross]

As my post was titled 'Biblical', I would suggest Biblical responses and quotations rather than personal opinions.

[onewithhim]

From the earliest Christianity to Catholicism, its related branches, and the subsequent Dark Ages, there have been many revivalisms. Including Protestantism, Unitarianism, Mormonism, The Millerites, Second Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses, Charismatic Pentecostalism and more. Excuse me if I have missed out your own faith.
But is there any Biblical support for a revivalist true Christian revolution or restoration; or are we all in an unholy doctrinal soup? And does the Almighty have a true church today?

Yes, there is Biblical support for the revival of the true faith in the end times. The book of Daniel, for one example, speaks clearly on the subject.

"During that time Michael will stand up, the great prince who is standing in behalf of the sons of your people. And there will certainly occur a time of distress such as has not been made to occur since there came to be a nation until that time. And during that time your people will escape, every one who is found written down in the book. And there will be many of those asleep in the ground of dust who will wake up....And the ones having insight will shine like the brightness of the expanse; and those who are bringing the many to righteousness, like the stars to time indefinite, even forever. And as for you, O Daniel, make secret the words and seal up the book, until the time of the end. Many will rove about, and the true knowledge will become abundant. And [Gabriel] went on to say: 'Go, Daniel, because the words are made secret and sealed up until the time of the end..'" (Daniel 12:1-4, 9)

It is being said that there will be a long period that there would not be the true understanding, but then in the time of the end, there would be clear understanding and the true faith would be apparent. "No wicked ones at all will understand, but the ones having insight will understand." (verse 10b)

[Ross]

Thank you for your response onewithinhim.

Firstly, the Book of Daniel was written in the 6th century before Christianity, so the time period spoken about was from then, not from the apparent apostasy or dissolution of the true Christian churches.
A closer look at the Chapter of Daniel referred to reveals the following:

Verses 1,2,
"at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.

Verse 9,
"He replied, “Go your way, Daniel, because the words are rolled up and sealed until the time of the end."

Verse 13
“As for you, go your way till the end. You will rest, and then at the end of the days you will rise to receive your allotted inheritance.”

It cannot be denied that Daniel is speaking about and links the time of the end with the resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous. This time has not yet arrived. It is future.

Where is justification in the NT please for the institutionalization of modern day faith organizations that claim their existence and ordination is from God, all forms of Protestantism included?

[onewithhim]

Thank you for your response onewithinhim.

Firstly, the Book of Daniel was written in the 6th century before Christianity, so the time period spoken about was from then, not from the apparent apostasy or dissolution of the true Christian churches.
A closer look at the Chapter of Daniel referred to reveals the following:

Verses 1,2,
"at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered. Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.

Verse 9,
"He replied, “Go your way, Daniel, because the words are rolled up and sealed until the time of the end."

Verse 13
“As for you, go your way till the end. You will rest, and then at the end of the days you will rise to receive your allotted inheritance.”

It cannot be denied that Daniel is speaking about and links the time of the end with the resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous. This time has not yet arrived. It is future.

Where is justification in the NT please for the institutionalization of modern day faith organizations that claim their existence and ordination is from God, all forms of Protestantism included?

In ch.13 of Matthew, Jesus indicated that a long period of time would occur when the true faith was overpowered, if you will, by false "sons of the Kingdom." This would go on until the "harvest season" when Jesus will tell the reapers, 'First collect the weeds [false sons of the kingdom] and bind them in bundles to burn them up, then go gathering the wheat [true sons of the kingdom] into my storehouse.' This would all happen at "harvest time," or, a conclusion of a system of things---the last days. "At that time the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun in the kingdom of their Father." (Matt.13:43)

That shows that the true faith will become evident in the last days. It has indeed turned out that way, when the true sons of the Kingdom started getting back into the correct line of thinking that Jesus and his apostles taught, around 1879. Which group is true? All we have to do is compare the teachings of the different groups with what Jesus taught, and what his disciples wrote.

[Ross]

In ch.13 of Matthew, Jesus indicated that a long period of time would occur when the true faith was overpowered, if you will, by false "sons of the Kingdom." This would go on until the "harvest season" when Jesus will tell the reapers, 'First collect the weeds [false sons of the kingdom] and bind them in bundles to burn them up, then go gathering the wheat [true sons of the kingdom] into my storehouse.' This would all happen at "harvest time," or, a conclusion of a system of things---the last days. "At that time the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun in the kingdom of their Father." (Matt.13:43)

That shows that the true faith will become evident in the last days. It has indeed turned out that way, when the true sons of the Kingdom started getting back into the correct line of thinking that Jesus and his apostles taught, around 1879. Which group is true? All we have to do is compare the teachings of the different groups with what Jesus taught, and what his disciples wrote.

In ch.13 of Matthew, Jesus indicated that a long period of time would occur when the true faith was overpowered

Now we are getting somewhere.

Here is the parable

The Parable of the Weeds
Matthew 13: 24-30
Jesus told them another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. But while everyone was sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away. When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared.“The owner’s servants came to him and said, ‘Sir, didn’t you sow good seed in your field? Where then did the weeds come from?’“‘An enemy did this,’ he replied.“The servants asked him, ‘Do you want us to go and pull them up?’ “‘No,’ he answered, ‘because while you are pulling the weeds, you may uproot the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’”
The Parable of the Weeds Explained
Matthew 13: 36-43
Then he left the crowd and went into the house. His disciples came to him and said, “Explain to us the parable of the weeds in the field.” He answered, “The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the people of the kingdom. The weeds are the people of the evil one, and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels. “As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Whoever has ears, let them hear.

So you are correct that the true Christian church that the Jesus began and the Apostles established would be 'overpowered' as you put it, or infested with weeds or false Christians along with true Christians throughout the ages and centuries.

Your mistake however is that the "end of the age" which your New World Bible incorrectly translates as "a conclusion of a system of things" has not yet arrived, because it states: "They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
This is a reference to judgement day.

This very parable invalidates the institutions of Catholicism, Protestantism, The Church of England, Unitarianism, Mormonism, Jehovah's Witnesses, Pentecostalism, modern day evangelical revivalism and everything else that is a man made organized form of an attempt to copy or re-establish true Christianity, or at least; to claim that there is any God given ordination to such.

I am open to correction if anyone can show me otherwise from the scriptures.

[Zoeya_cqel]

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[onewithhim]

In ch.13 of Matthew, Jesus indicated that a long period of time would occur when the true faith was overpowered, if you will, by false "sons of the Kingdom." This would go on until the "harvest season" when Jesus will tell the reapers, 'First collect the weeds [false sons of the kingdom] and bind them in bundles to burn them up, then go gathering the wheat [true sons of the kingdom] into my storehouse.' This would all happen at "harvest time," or, a conclusion of a system of things---the last days. "At that time the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun in the kingdom of their Father." (Matt.13:43)

That shows that the true faith will become evident in the last days. It has indeed turned out that way, when the true sons of the Kingdom started getting back into the correct line of thinking that Jesus and his apostles taught, around 1879. Which group is true? All we have to do is compare the teachings of the different groups with what Jesus taught, and what his disciples wrote.

In ch.13 of Matthew, Jesus indicated that a long period of time would occur when the true faith was overpowered

Now we are getting somewhere.

Here is the parable

The Parable of the Weeds
Matthew 13: 24-30
Jesus told them another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. But while everyone was sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away. When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared.“The owner’s servants came to him and said, ‘Sir, didn’t you sow good seed in your field? Where then did the weeds come from?’“‘An enemy did this,’ he replied.“The servants asked him, ‘Do you want us to go and pull them up?’ “‘No,’ he answered, ‘because while you are pulling the weeds, you may uproot the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’”
The Parable of the Weeds Explained
Matthew 13: 36-43
Then he left the crowd and went into the house. His disciples came to him and said, “Explain to us the parable of the weeds in the field.” He answered, “The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the people of the kingdom. The weeds are the people of the evil one, and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels. “As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Whoever has ears, let them hear.

So you are correct that the true Christian church that the Jesus began and the Apostles established would be 'overpowered' as you put it, or infested with weeds or false Christians along with true Christians throughout the ages and centuries.

Your mistake however is that the "end of the age" which your New World Bible incorrectly translates as "a conclusion of a system of things" has not yet arrived, because it states: "They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
This is a reference to judgement day.

This very parable invalidates the institutions of Catholicism, Protestantism, The Church of England, Unitarianism, Mormonism, Jehovah's Witnesses, Pentecostalism, modern day evangelical revivalism and everything else that is a man made organized form of an attempt to copy or re-establish true Christianity, or at least; to claim that there is any God given ordination to such.

I am open to correction if anyone can show me otherwise from the scriptures.

I don't understand why you don't accept my reasoning on the matter with Matthew 13. It shows that there will be a revival of true Christianity in the last days. Jehovah's Witnesses are that prophecied revival of true Christianity. All the others can be shown to be the weeds.

[Ross]

I don't understand why you don't accept my reasoning on the matter with Matthew 13. It shows that there will be a revival of true Christianity in the last days. Jehovah's Witnesses are that prophecied revival of true Christianity. All the others can be shown to be the weeds.

Jehovah's Witnesses have interpreted sections of the Bible to align to the modern day history of their movement for the last 140 years or so, with multiple adjustments, and some very embarrassing claims and mistakes which the passing of time has exposed.

The parable does not align to the claims you make in many respects. Here are a few:


“As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Whoever has ears, let them hear."

The weeds are burned in fire. This is Judgement and has not yet arrived.

The weeds come out of Gods Kingdom. Jehovah's Witnesses claim the reverse, that the wheat comes out of Christendom.

The wording aligns with multiple other Biblical texts which refer to the Judgement of the righteous and the unrighteous, a future time.

[Ross]

I did not intend this to be yet another discussion with Jehovah's Witnesses about their doctrine.
And I am somewhat surprised at the otherwise silence here.
Perhaps I have touched on a subject that is not acceptable?