Why Don't All Christians get Ashes Smeared on their Foreheads?

[Tcg]

.



Many years ago, a friend and I were driving down the main street of a small town and noticed a few people walking around with ashes in the shape of a killing device on their foreheads. As we continued, we saw more on more with this peculiar adornment. We eventually found the source of these folks which was a rather large Christian church they were pouring out of.

Both of us had been very active Christians at one time in our lives and yet had never seen this behavior. We later learned that this was related to Ash Wednesday.

What is the significance of this activity and why don't all Christians participate?


Tcg

[bjs1]

...commemorate the sacrifices ....

[Replying to Tcg in post #1]
It commemorates the day that Jesus, according the Gospels, announced to his disciples that he was going to Jerusalem and that when he arrived he would be executed

I don't see any claim on bjs1's part that either he or anyone else knows the day involved. ....

Tcg

Thank you for your observation Tcg, that was very helpful. I will wait and see if bjs has any further input, but do appreciate your taking the time to comment.

Kind regards,

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

I don't have much to add to what Tcg wrote. Ash Wednesday commemorates the event, not the date. This is clearly so since the date of Ash Wednesday changes. The date of Ash Wednesday is based on Easter, and most Christians in the West celebrate Easter based on the date of Passover, which was designed to be slightly different each year.

[JehovahsWitness]

I don't have much to add to what Tcg wrote. Ash Wednesday commemorates the event, not the date. ...

Thank you, yes ... I was slightly confused by the mention of commemorating {quote} "The day".

It commemorates the day that Jesus, according the Gospels, announced to his disciples that he was going to Jerusalem and that when he arrived he would be executed

I took it that meant commemorating an event on the same the day it happened (ie it happened on a Wednesday) . Since we cannot assertain from the gospel accounts either the day of the week (or the date) Jesus announced to his disciples that he was going to Jerusalem, the only thing is to pick a date or day and commemorate the event accordingly.

- If you commemorate an event on the same date: it will fall on the same day of the month but not the same day of the week
- If you commemorate an event on the same the day it will fall on the same day of the week but not the same date

Thanks ,


JW

[Masterblaster]

Hello

People are heading off on tangents with this. I referred to this as quasi-pagan, and that was being nice to modern Christianity.
Look at this...

"The simple standard definition of Easter is that it is the first Sunday after the full Moon that occurs on or after the spring equinox. If the full Moon falls on a Sunday then Easter is the next Sunday".

This is a matter for the moon and the Druids and the Irish St Patrick. Go to the Dark Ages and explore Ireland, the Land of Saints and Scholars and the cradle for a rekindled doctrine with a pagan backbone.
Even in a leap year, you go from a Wed to a Sun, and get 5×7+5=40= Jesus in the desert, and the 40 day Lenten fast starting on Ash Wednesday.

We talk about Easter being early this year. Christmas was planted straight on top of the Winter Solstice, Halloween on an Equinox, (All Saints and All Souls Days), implanted into the old pagan rituals of Samhain, etc.The irish love Halliween and the more skeletons ,the better. It is a pagan dance for them.
Fascinating stuff.

Irish Druidism was taken over by Christian missionaries seeking refuge from the Collapse of an Empire, they had the wisdom to plant their theology in the existing pagan practices and the result was a match made in Heaven. This core of Christian belief was used to recolonize a Europe that was described as Dark.
Welcome to quasi-paganism(Catholicism)
Thanks

[bjs1]

Hello

People are heading off on tangents with this. I referred to this as quasi-pagan, and that was being nice to modern Christianity.
Look at this...

"The simple standard definition of Easter is that it is the first Sunday after the full Moon that occurs on or after the spring equinox. If the full Moon falls on a Sunday then Easter is the next Sunday".

This is a matter for the moon and the Druids and the Irish St Patrick. Go to the Dark Ages and explore Ireland, the Land of Saints and Scholars and the cradle for a rekindled doctrine with a pagan backbone.
Even in a leap year, you go from a Wed to a Sun, and get 5×7+5=40= Jesus in the desert, and the 40 day Lenten fast starting on Ash Wednesday.

We talk about Easter being early this year. Christmas was planted straight on top of the Winter Solstice, Halloween on an Equinox, (All Saints and All Souls Days), implanted into the old pagan rituals of Samhain, etc.The irish love Halliween and the more skeletons ,the better. It is a pagan dance for them.
Fascinating stuff.

Irish Druidism was taken over by Christian missionaries seeking refuge from the Collapse of an Empire, they had the wisdom to plant their theology in the existing pagan practices and the result was a match made in Heaven. This core of Christian belief was used to recolonize a Europe that was described as Dark.
Welcome to quasi-paganism(Catholicism)
Thanks

This standard actually goes back to the Jewish Passover, long before St. Patrick or the Middle Ages.

"The [Passover] dates are usually determined by the 15th day of the month of Nisan, which is on the first night of a full moon after the Spring equinox."
https://www.cleveland.com/data/2022/04/ ... ere%20else.

Christian used this system, moving the date to the following Sunday because the Gospels say that Jesus rose from the dead on the first day of the week.

It has nothing to do with Paganism.

[Masterblaster]

Hello bjs1

You say that this has nothing to do with paganism....the jury is out on this. I disagree.

The Jews want it, the Christians want it. The truth is that the moon has it. It was there before them all.
What better time to have resurrection than when green shoots emerge from the ground. Imagine eating Christmas Turkey in Australia on Dec 25th. That would be Yuk! One man's gravy is another man's sun cream.

From wiki...."The ecclesiastical historian Socrates Scholasticus attributes the observance of Easter by the church to the perpetuation of pre-Christian custom, "just as many other customs have been established", stating that neither Jesus nor his Apostles enjoined the keeping of this or any other festival. Although he describes the details of the Easter celebration as deriving from local custom, he insists the feast itself is universally observed."

[JehovahsWitness]

The Jews want it, the Christians want it. The truth is that the moon has it....

I cannot comment on "Ash Wednesday" my understanding is those that practice this ceremony have picked a Wednesday in relation to the Passover (I'm not clear if it's a Wednesday beforeor after the Jewish passover). There is no scriptural premise for the ceremony.

The Jewish Pssover (and by consequence the Christian memorial of Christ death) are in direct relation to the Lunar calender. Mainline Christians and modern day Jews do not stick religiously to the original lunar date but it still is RELATED to the original lunar calender . Jehovah's Witnesses choose to stick religiously to the date regardless of which day of the week that falls.


JW

[Masterblaster]

Hello

Do not underestimate St Patrick or the influence of the Irish mission....again wiki

"Saint Patrick (Latin: Patricius; Irish: Pádraig [ˈpˠɑːɾˠɪɟ] or [ˈpˠaːd̪ˠɾˠəɟ]; Welsh: Padrig) was a fifth-century Romano-British Christian missionary and bishop in Ireland. Known as the "Apostle of Ireland", he is the primary patron saint of Ireland, the other patron saints being Brigid of Kildare and Columba. Patrick was never formally canonised,[2] having lived before the current laws of the Catholic Church in these matters. Nevertheless, he is venerated as a saint in the Catholic Church, the Lutheran Church, the Church of Ireland (part of the Anglican Communion), and in the Eastern Orthodox Church, where he is regarded as equal-to-the-apostles and Enlightener of Ireland."

If you consider that this 5th Century missionary who embraced pagan culture( read his story), lived during the formative years of Catholic theology ( revision of Nicea), you might be able to catch my drift.
How many Irish signatures are there on the Declaration, how many Presidents preach Irishness, how many Dublins in the US?...Irish paganism is a very pervasive thing.

[Masterblaster]

Hello

Christianity and Judaism have been disassociating themselves ,within their scriptures,from their pagan origins, for millennia. I remember well the Israelites demonising their nemeses, the shape shifting , baby devouring Amalekites..... ' we are better than that'

It would be nice to say that formal Christianity or Catholicism, as it is affectionately known as, is from pure stock, ie that it grew from the Christ roots and as such, is fresh and different. Sorry to burst your bubble but to suggest this would require a re-writing of history. Do not reduce yourself to meddling in editing wiki material.

At best Catholicism is quasi-pagan and at worst it comes from a different continent , a different environment and a different psyche . This is the basis of the Mary ( female) devotion and much more.

Ireland is the most Catholic pagan country in the world. They tie pieces of cloth on holy bushes, they have banshees, holy mountains, they light fires, they haven't smelt the Sinai desert of Judaism, since their honeymoon in Tunisia. I love it.

[Masterblaster]

Hello
Paganism is rooted in nature and natural cycles. It eminates from an even older primitiveness that is alluded to in Genesis 1. This is the root-stem of theological truth. I have been attempting to emphasize this fact on my nature thread where all are welcome to pick out holes within it's logic.
Theology will never remove it's pagan past and it will probably never re-embrace it either.

A rabbit in headlights is hard to predict.

Thanks

[JehovahsWitness]

Christianity and Judaism have been disassociating themselves ,within their scriptures,from their pagan origins, for millennia.

IS JUDAISM ROOTED IN PAGANISM?


Paganism is generally a term used to designate those religions that do not worship the God of Abraham. Pagan worship of the God of Abraham is therefore an oxymoron. The only reliable record we have of the history of Abraham is in the Hebrew bible, which has no record of him worshipping nature or engaging in any other idolatrous practises* . Although Abrahams descendents are recorded as adoptjng various pagan practise during various periods, there is no record of these departures being approved by Jehovah (YHWH) the God of Abraham. The biblical Israelites were prohibited absolutely by their law from worshipping nature.

* The biblical records does indicate Abrahams father was associated with pagan idolatry but it seems he later joined his son in pure worship

Given the above it is inaccurate to suggest biblical Judaism had {quote} "pagan origins" . Any association it subsequently had would be a departure from the worship of the God of Abraham. Worshipping of creatures, trees or even the planet itself ( and any theology that God can literally be found inside of his creation) is not a reflection of the worship of Abraham but a corruption and a defilement thereof.


Jesus of Nazareth, the founder of Christianity was a worshipper of the God of Abraham and encouraged his followers to do the same. Any subsequent departure from the religious traditions of the Jews did not allow for "nature worship" (idolatry).

JW