Three Steps to be Faithful to the Bible

[The Nice Centurion]

Some things are made clear in the Bible that most christians prefer to Avoid like Plague to aknowledge.

But to be really faithful to the bible is reverse to pick and choose.

So I found out that . . .

1) Bible faithful christians must believe in Flat Earth.

2) Bible faithful christians must be Geocentrists (Sun orbits the Earth).

3) Bible faithful christians must identify themselves as Advocates for Genocide.
I present my post from another thread for explanation.

[Replying to Athetotheist in post #1]
I want to enter this debate by presenting William Lane Craigs apologetic for the Caanaite Genocide.

That W.L.C. even identifies himself as an apologist for Genocide was reason enough for Richard Dawkins to refuse debating him on stage.
https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... lane-craig

But why take the lives of innocent children? The terrible totality of the destruction was undoubtedly related to the prohibition of assimilation to pagan nations on Israel's part. In commanding complete destruction of the Canaanites, the Lord says, 'You shall not intermarry with them, giving your daughters to their sons, or taking their daughters for your sons, for they would turn away your sons from following me, to serve other gods' (Deut 7.3-4). […] God knew that if these Canaanite children were allowed to live, they would spell the undoing of Israel. […] Moreover, if we believe, as I do, that God's grace is extended to those who die in infancy or as small children, the death of these children was actually their salvation. We are so wedded to an earthly, naturalistic perspective that we forget that those who die are happy to quit this earth for heaven's incomparable joy. Therefore, God does these children no wrong in taking their lives."

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So whom does God wrong in commanding the destruction of the Canaanites? Not the Canaanite adults, for they were corrupt and deserving of judgment. Not the children, for they inherit eternal life. So who is wronged? Ironically, I think the most difficult part of this whole debate is the apparent wrong done to the Israeli [sic] soldiers themselves. Can you imagine what it would be like to have to break into some house and kill a terrified woman and her children? The brutalising effect on these Israeli [sic] soldiers is disturbing."

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"I have come to appreciate as a result of a closer reading of the biblical text that God's command to Israel was not primarily to exterminate the Canaanites but to drive them out of the land.[…] Canaan was being given over to Israel, whom God had now brought out of Egypt. If the Canaanite tribes, seeing the armies of Israel, had simply chosen to flee, no one would have been killed at all. There was no command to pursue and hunt down the Canaanite peoples.
It is therefore completely misleading to characterise God's command to Israel as a command to commit genocide. Rather it was first and foremost a command to drive the tribes out of the land and to occupy it. Only those who remained behind were to be utterly exterminated. No one had to die in this whole affair."

By some it is seen as an Outrage that Dawkins refuses to give Genocide Advocacy some dignity here.
Them see this as a declarement of bancruptcy for New Atheism. Brights against Genocide they consider disrespectful.
https://amp-theguardian-com.cdn.ampproj ... lane-craig

Am I right If no, then why not

[TRANSPONDER]

Lane Craig or not, I find that one has to give the Bible a pass, NT or old.

Faithfulness (I mean belief, not accuracy) requires the Bibvle must be made to look good, even if it means denying what it means or even (as has been seen) what it says.

Science is denied, at need, history is denied, at need, morals (as we have right now) is denied, at need, and of course, reason is denied, at frequent need.

To take the genocide of Canaan, it is so obvious, clumsy on dumb, in fact to excuse it as the norm for the day.

Duhhh, as they say. Yes, it was and the writers said what the Israelites did or said they did (I think the history is actually different) and it becomes like normal (flawed) human behavior where a tribe grabs what it wants and appeals to a god (name your own) as justification. Such a 'that's how it was, back then' may get the Hebrews off the hook as just doing what everyone else did, but it scuppers the claim that the tribal god they had was (or is) good, by modern standards.

It's the Faithbased Fail for the Bible, from Slavery excuses (when not trying to evade that it is slavery) o Lane Craig's frankly shocking (though not unusual) excuse for the Flood as 'they were all wicked'.

The bottom line, as always, is - that may do for the Faithful to close their eyes to unwelcome aspects of the Bible, but it will by no means do with anyone who has not thrown their reasoning, understanding and morals in the trash in favor of Blind faith - at least, once we goddless have gently removed from their eyes the wool that Bible - apologists regularly try to pull over. them

[Mae von H]

Some things are made clear in the Bible that most christians prefer to Avoid like Plague to aknowledge.

But to be really faithful to the bible is reverse to pick and choose.

So I found out that . . .

1) Bible faithful christians must believe in Flat Earth.

Absolutely nonsense.

2) Bible faithful christians must be Geocentrists (Sun orbits the Earth).

Absolutely nonsense.

3) Bible faithful christians must identify themselves as Advocates for Genocide.
I present my post from another thread for explanation.

Insulting as well as nonsense.

Am I right If no, then why not

You’re totally wrong. Why? Because we are the ones to say what we must believe not you.

Otherwise, cutting and pasting is a pretty way poor way to present an argument. Shows a lack of ability to think and articulate thoughts.

[Mae von H]

[Replying to TRANSPONDER in post #2]

One thinks of Matthew 5:11. I would encourage every believer here, both of you, to read that verse and realize this is it and take comfort. When atheists ignore us, that promised blessing is not granted.

[TRANSPONDER]

That depends upon whether one is taking Christian faith (name your own ) as the yardstick or evidence and reason (rather than the person making the post) as what we should 'Believe' (take it that the Bible says).

For just one example, the creation took a week. 6 days.

One can either do science denial (Genesis literalism) or deny what the Bible says (Interpretation). and fit it to the science and claims the Bible contains science. It is a Fraud, either way.

The latter fraud works by taking the latest estimate of the age of the universe (may be 25 billion, now, but it ain't 7 days) dividing into 7 and calling each one 'a day'. Never mind that the Bible says light and dark, morning and evening.

I know and could do it myself, one could simply have God produce a cosmic effect of 1.5 billion years of cosmic light and 3.5 billion years of the light switched off, and mislead Moses, in a vision, into thinking that this was the same as night and day produced by the sun which was made by God as an afterthought to mark the light and dark, and since the sun glowed, God could switch the Cosmic Effect off (thanks 1213, I couldn't have done it without you ).

Thing is, this may work for some Believers (not all) by crediting any excuse or none, and declaring the Bible true. But those with reason, will know this has to be wrong. They may shrug it off and say 'That's wrong (or metaphor) but the rest is right. or they may say (deconversion stories show this all the time) If that's wrong..what else is wrong? Sun standing still? Jonah in the whale? Walls of Jericho?

They may dip into the arguments (Fatal) and see the claims and even the excuses don't work, and the slide down the slippery slope starts.

The OT may be dismissed as wrong, frankly, but the NT, well that was eyewitness testimony, wasn't it? Well...let's look at the nativities, first.

Bottom line. One has to opt for denial/Faith rather than open -minded questioning or one is doomed, as believer, anyway.

[The Nice Centurion]

Some things are made clear in the Bible that most christians prefer to Avoid like Plague to aknowledge.

But to be really faithful to the bible is reverse to pick and choose.

So I found out that . . .

1) Bible faithful christians must believe in Flat Earth.

Absolutely nonsense.

2) Bible faithful christians must be Geocentrists (Sun orbits the Earth).

Absolutely nonsense.

3) Bible faithful christians must identify themselves as Advocates for Genocide.
I present my post from another thread for explanation.

Insulting as well as nonsense.

Its all in the bible.
I take it, you are either calling (parts of) the bible nonsense or else you are just not a bible faihful believer.

Am I right If no, then why not

You’re totally wrong. Why? Because we are the ones to say what we must believe not you.

Otherwise, cutting and pasting is a pretty way poor way to present an argument. Shows a lack of ability to think and articulate thoughts.

Why should I not cut and paste my own text from elsewhere, I already made my point to present my same argument here also?
Did you even look at it?
Your critic shoots its own foot!

[The Nice Centurion]

Lane Craig or not, I find that one has to give the Bible a pass, NT or old.

Whattt? What one? What do you try to articulate with this nonunderstandable sentence?
Could you please learn from Lane Craig as your role model when it comes to speaking in words that can be commonly understood?

Faithfulness (I mean belief, not accuracy) requires the Bibvle must be made to look good, even if it means denying what it means or even (as has been seen) what it says.

No christian would walk with you here. You are unreasonable.
Bible faithful = faithful to the bible. Not deny that and deny this.

Science is denied, at need, history is denied, at need, morals (as we have right now) is denied, at need, and of course, reason is denied, at frequent need.

To take the genocide of Canaan, it is so obvious, clumsy on dumb, in fact to excuse it as the norm for the day.

Duhhh, as they say. Yes, it was and the writers said what the Israelites did or said they did (I think the history is actually different) and it becomes like normal (flawed) human behavior where a tribe grabs what it wants and appeals to a god (name your own) as justification. Such a 'that's how it was, back then' may get the Hebrews off the hook as just doing what everyone else did, but it scuppers the claim that the tribal god they had was (or is) good, by modern standards.

It's the Faithbased Fail for the Bible, from Slavery excuses (when not trying to evade that it is slavery) o Lane Craig's frankly shocking (though not unusual) excuse for the Flood as 'they were all wicked'.

The bottom line, as always, is - that may do for the Faithful to close their eyes to unwelcome aspects of the Bible, but it will by no means do with anyone who has not thrown their reasoning, understanding and morals in the trash in favor of Blind faith - at least, once we goddless have gently removed from their eyes the wool that Bible - apologists regularly try to pull over. them

It is reverse to faithful, if one closes eyes and denies what the bible says;
In this case that is: Flat Earth, Geocentrism, Genocide Advocacy.

[Mae von H]

Some things are made clear in the Bible that most christians prefer to Avoid like Plague to aknowledge.

But to be really faithful to the bible is reverse to pick and choose.

So I found out that . . .

1) Bible faithful christians must believe in Flat Earth.

Absolutely nonsense.

2) Bible faithful christians must be Geocentrists (Sun orbits the Earth).

Absolutely nonsense.

3) Bible faithful christians must identify themselves as Advocates for Genocide.
I present my post from another thread for explanation.

Insulting as well as nonsense.

It’s all in the bible.

No it’s not. So please provide verses like „the earth is flat.” You’ve got a straw man argument.

I take it, you are either calling (parts of) the bible nonsense or else you are just not a bible faihful believer.

No it’s not there and you haven’t established it is.

Am I right If no, then why not

You’re totally wrong. Why? Because we are the ones to say what we must believe not you.

Otherwise, cutting and pasting is a pretty way poor way to present an argument. Shows a lack of ability to think and articulate thoughts.

Why should I not cut and paste my own text from elsewhere, I already made my point to present my same argument here also?
Did you even look at it?
Your critic shoots its own foot!

You cut and pasted from Craig. That’s not you by a long shot.

[The Nice Centurion]

[Replying to Mae von H in post #8]
So you are not a bible faithful christian!

I wonder what else in the bible you just skip and choose to ignore.

And why should I not be so fair and give the other side (Craig) a voice?
Better a christian presents the argument, than me possibly strawmanning try to present the view of the christians.

A bible faithful christian has to advocate genocide that happens on a flat earth orbited by the sun.

Because its in the bible

[Mae von H]

[Replying to Mae von H in post #8]
So you are not a bible faithful christian!


I wonder what else in the bible you just skip and choose to ignore.

Classic True Scotsman fallacy. I won’t fall for that trap. You can rest assured we will not tell you that you’re no true atheist.

And why should I not be so fair and give the other side (Craig) a voice?

He’s not here. It’s unfair.

Better a christian presents the argument, than me possibly strawmanning try to present the view of the christians.

You guys strawman enough with people writing their thoughts. You guys employ a number of fallacies.

A bible faithful christian has to advocate genocide that happens on a flat earth orbited by the sun.

No more than atheists have to advocate killing the genetically inferior to preserve the survival of humans.

Because its in the bible

You can’t show me anywhere in the Bible where this is but you wickedly mock and malign and misrepresent christians and the Bible. Unfortunately for you, I see through it all.