Genesis has more than one God?

[Confused]

Genesis 3: 21 The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. 22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

This has always bothered me. If there is only one God, and He is the one speaking in this passage, then two things pop out at me.

1) Who is he speaking to?

2) Why does God refer to Adam and Eve becoming one of US? In the plural sense.

[justifyothers]

Genesis 3: 21 The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. 22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

This has always bothered me. If there is only one God, and He is the one speaking in this passage, then two things pop out at me.

1) Who is he speaking to?

2) Why does God refer to Adam and Eve becoming one of US? In the plural sense.

I always assumed it referenced angels/spirits. Although I'm not sure what I think now, but here are some interesting verses:


19 Micaiah continued, "Therefore hear the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne with all the host of heaven standing around him on his right and on his left.

" God (elohim) stands in the divine council (the "adat-el"); he judges among the gods (elohim)." Psalm 82

DEUTERONOMY 32:7 Remember the days of old, consider the years for past ages: ask thy father, and he shall relate to thee, thine elders, and they shall tell thee. 8 When the Most High divided the nations, when He separated the sons of Adam, He set the bounds of the nations according to the number of the angels of God. 9 And His people Jacob became the portion of the Lord, Israel was the line of His inheritance. (Brenton's LXX)

JASHER 9:31 And they built the tower and the city, and they did this thing daily until many days and years were elapsed. 32 And God said to the seventy angels who stood foremost before him...."

JOB 38:4 "Where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth? Tell Me, if you have understanding, 5 Who set its measurements? Since you know. Or who stretched the line on it? 6 On what were its bases sunk? Or who laid its cornerstone, 7 When the morning stars sang together and all the sons of God shouted for joy?" (NASU)


" And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD. " II Kings 21:5

Also, the Book of Enoch is filled with these types of references to divine council and angels surrounding God.

[OnceConvinced]

I haven't gone through this entire thread, due to time restraints, but I think if you believe the bible, there must be other Gods, even if they aren't good ones. One of the 10 commandments says that "Thou shalt serve no other God...". Now at the time this commandment was made, men did serve other gods eg Baal. So if they were not real, why did God see them as a threat? If they weren't really gods, then the commandment would be "Thou shalt not worship anything but God".

Bear in mind that the concept of "Gods" didn't seem to change until the NT with a God being likened to anything you attach too much importance to, eg Money.

[Easyrider]

Genesis 3: 21 The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. 22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

This has always bothered me. If there is only one God, and He is the one speaking in this passage, then two things pop out at me.

1) Who is he speaking to?

2) Why does God refer to Adam and Eve becoming one of US? In the plural sense.

He didn't say Adam was "one of us," but had become "like" one of us, knowing good and evil. That was the qualification.

Here, we see a conversation that is taking place prior to the creation of man. Who is this person or persons with whom God is conversing? First, this 'person' or 'persons' is able to communicate with God in His own realm of timeless eternity. Because man had not yet been created, He was not speaking to someone of earthly intelligence, but someone in the heavenly, supernatural and eternal realm.

Secondly, this person or persons with whom God is communicating apparently has the same kind of creative ability as God ("Let us make"). This clearly implies a cooperative effort between God (Elohim - plural) and the person or persons with whom God is speaking.

And finally, the person or persons with whom God is speaking is comparable, or identical, with God ("Let us make man in our image, after our likeness").

When confronted with this passage, some people often claim that God is speaking with angels. However, this explanation fails to address a number of problems. First, there is no indication found anywhere in the Bible that says angels can create life. Secondly, nowhere is it indicated that angels were ever made in the image and likeness of God. And finally, there is no indication from scripture that mankind was ever made in the likeness of angels.

In Christianity, the "us" is the Trinity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

[Revelations won]

Genesis 3: 21 The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. 22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

This has always bothered me. If there is only one God, and He is the one speaking in this passage, then two things pop out at me.

1) Who is he speaking to?

2) Why does God refer to Adam and Eve becoming one of US? In the plural sense.

Why should one be bothered by the concept that there may be other Gods?

For this earth we have God the Father of us all and Jesus Christ who is also the principle God of the old testament. That adds up to two Gods that oversee this earth.

Obviously they cannot be one and the same, for even Christ so declared that my Father is greater than I.

Also according to the new testament, Christ received not a fullness at first. Thereby
showing that though he were a son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered. And as the scriptures also state that he being made perfect, became the author of eternal salvation unto all who should believe.

It should be very obvious to anyone who carefully studies Christ's great intercessory prayer prior to his crucifixion that the oneness he speaks of is not one in substance, but one in purpose.

Further he did not come to do his will, but the will of the Father.

When he was baptized while he was in the water, the fathers voice was heard out of heaven, thus further showing them to be two separate beings.

According to scripture, Christ was foreordained to become the redeemer of this world. If he were also God the Father as some claim, it would be the epitome of absurdity for a God who had all power might and dominion to ordain himself to have additional power to redeem those whom he created. Give me a break!

Have you ever considered what would have happened if Christ rebelled against the will of the Father as did Lucifer?

Suppose he had refused to perform the atonement in the garden?

What if he rebelled and refused to allow himself to die on the cross?

Would he most assuredly fail to become our redeemer?

Would he have failed to receive the fullness of the Father?

Would he at that point have ceased to be a God?

How is it that so many Christians claim that the cannon of scripture was full with the compilation of the bible and deem to pronounce curses upon anyone who adds to the cannon of scripture or take from the cannon of scripture?

How is it then that 325 years later that they argue and fight in a council and finally dream up a creed called the "trinity" and proclaim it as doctrine when it is clearly not a doctrine which came by revelation from God, but is clearly one of the "doctrines of men"?

If this is proclaimed as a Christian doctrine, then it must by virtue of it's lack of divine authorship, become also a unauthorized addition to the cannon of scripture.

[MikeH]

Genesis 3: 21 The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. 22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

This has always bothered me. If there is only one God, and He is the one speaking in this passage, then two things pop out at me.

1) Who is he speaking to?

2) Why does God refer to Adam and Eve becoming one of US? In the plural sense.

I would say the "us" refers to sentient beings. That is the only difference I can think of pre and post eating of the fruit.

[Revelations won]

Genesis has more than one God


Otseng said:
Jesus existed before the world began, but was not incarnate until he was born on earth.

Jhn 1:1-2 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God.

Jhn 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Col 1:15-17 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

2Ti 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called [us] with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

McCullough said:
You really should have included John 1:14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth.

Easyrider said:

"Then God said, 'Let us make man in our image, in our likeness,
and let have dominion over the fist of the sea, and over the birds
of the air, and over the livestock, and over all the earth."





Confused stated:

I guess I am not smart enough to understand. Are we talking mutiple personality disorder type father and son at the same time? I am not meaning to make light of what you say, but what you say makes no logical sense. If God is one, then how is the the father and the son? That is two.

Melis stated:
I was being sarcastic - but people actually believe this - which is nonsense in my opinion.
For instance:
a) why would god have a son, which is a human? Is god also a human?
b) how can three persons be one person?
c) how can those three persons be gods, if there is only one god?
d) etc., etc...

I guess The Holy Trinity is just a bad invention of NT writers. I mean, by using this type of thinking god can be one, but in millions of persons, which actually insults our intelligence. I can't believe anyone buys this.

Revelations won wrote:
I have two simple questions.

Is Christ God?

If so when did he receive all his glory?

Easy rider said:

He didn't say Adam was "one of us," but had become "like" one of us, knowing good and evil. That was the qualification.

Here, we see a conversation that is taking place prior to the creation of man. Who is this person or persons with whom God is conversing? First, this 'person' or 'persons' is able to communicate with God in His own realm of timeless eternity. Because man had not yet been created, He was not speaking to someone of earthly intelligence, but someone in the heavenly, supernatural and eternal realm.

Secondly, this person or persons with whom God is communicating apparently has the same kind of creative ability as God ("Let us make"). This clearly implies a cooperative effort between God (Elohim - plural) and the person or persons with whom God is speaking.

And finally, the person or persons with whom God is speaking is comparable, or identical, with God ("Let us make man in our image, after our likeness").

When confronted with this passage, some people often claim that God is speaking with angels. However, this explanation fails to address a number of problems. First, there is no indication found anywhere in the Bible that says angels can create life. Secondly, nowhere is it indicated that angels were ever made in the image and likeness of God. And finally, there is no indication from scripture that mankind was ever made in the likeness of angels.

Revelations won wrote:

Why should one be bothered by the concept that there may be other Gods?

For this earth we have God the Father of us all and Jesus Christ who is also the principle God of the old testament. That adds up to two Gods that oversee this earth.

Obviously they cannot be one and the same, for even Christ so declared that my Father is greater than I.

Also according to the new testament, Christ received not a fullness at first. Thereby
showing that though he were a son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered. And as the scriptures also state that he being made perfect, became the author of eternal salvation unto all who should believe.

It should be very obvious to anyone who carefully studies Christ's great intercessory prayer prior to his crucifixion that the oneness he speaks of is not one in substance, but one in purpose.

Further he did not come to do his will, but the will of the Father.

When he was baptized while he was in the water, the fathers voice was heard out of heaven, thus further showing them to be two separate beings.

According to scripture, Christ was foreordained to become the redeemer of this world. If he were also God the Father as some claim, it would be the epitome of absurdity for a God who had all power might and dominion to ordain himself to have additional power to redeem those whom he created. Give me a break!

Have you ever considered what would have happened if Christ rebelled against the will of the Father as did Lucifer?

Suppose he had refused to perform the atonement in the garden?

What if he rebelled and refused to allow himself to die on the cross?

Would he most assuredly fail to become our redeemer?

Would he have failed to receive the fullness of the Father?

Would he at that point have ceased to be a God?

How is it that so many Christians claim that the cannon of scripture was full with the compilation of the bible and deem to pronounce curses upon anyone who adds to the cannon of scripture or take from the cannon of scripture?

How is it then that 325 years later that they argue and fight in a council and finally dream up a creed called the "trinity" and proclaim it as doctrine when it is clearly not a doctrine which came by revelation from God, but is clearly one of the "doctrines of men"?

If this is proclaimed as a Christian doctrine, then it must by virtue of it's lack of divine authorship, become also a unauthorized addition to the cannon of scripture.


In responding to Confusions OP I would refer to the following:

Genesis 1:26 and God said, let us make man in our image, after our likness...

Inasmuch as God is according to the scriptures the father of our spirits, then is it not reasonable that he would like us to become like him?


Genesis 3:22 the man has become one of us, to know good and evil.

When we clearly understand that this mortal probation is but one important step in eternal progression, then it becomes very clear that in God’s wisdom, we needed to learn the difference between good and evil. Else how could the all important principle of eternal principle of agency be fully implemented?

Putting it in a clear perspective, Father wanted us to understand that there must needs be opposition in all things so that we could prove to him that we would “choose the right� under trying circumstances.

For truly His work and Glory is to bring to pass “the eternal life of man�.
Each of us must face this trial of our faith and prove to Father by our choices wether we will choose to follow Christ or Lucifer. As I understand it, none of us is exempt from “the refiners fire�.

Matt. 3:16-17 this is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased

Matt. 17:5 This is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased

The above two witnesses given by God the Father of his son are more powerful and greater than that of man.

Matt. 20:21-23 not mine to give, but...given ....of my Father

As Christ clearly indicated, that choice was the right of the Father only to so choose.

Matt. 26:39 not as I will, but as thou wilt

That should be self explanatory.

Matt: 28:19 baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the....

Here again the Father is differentiated as distinct from the Son.

Luke 1:31-32 shall b e called the Son of the highest: and the Lord

The above appears to be abundantly clear.

John 5:19-26 the son can do nothing....but what he seeth the Father do

This witness of the Son to us is most thought provoking and powerful.

John 8:17-18 the Father that sent me beareth witness of me

Christ’s witness of his Father given here is given in power and clarity.

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

As I understand this verse, they are one in purpose, not one in body.

John 12:28-29 there came a voice from heaven, saying , I have both....

We so observe here that Christ was here on earth, yet we have the Fathers voice from heaven.

John 14:28 for my Father is greater than I

Here we have the confession and powerful witness from Christ himself that his father is greater than he.

John 17:3 that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus

The above clearly states with clarity the difference between the Father and additionally the son.

John 17:20-21 that they my all be one, as thou Father art in me

Here we observe that we should be one in purpose in same manner as he was unified with the Father.

John 20:17 I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God and your God

Here again is a clear distinction between the “Father and the Son.

Acts: 2:33 (29-36) therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and

Here is another clarification indicating their respective separate and distinct beings.

Acts 7:55-56 saw the glory of God and Jesus standing on the right

As Stephen was stoned to death we have this additional witness relating to their identity.

1 Cor. 8:6 (4-6) but to us there is but one God, the father of whom

Pauls testimony is clear and powerful.

Eph. 3:14 I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus

Can there be any misunderstanding in the above?

Heb. 1:1-3 hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, who....

We observe that Christ was to become an heir of all things and that Christ created the worlds under the direction of the Father.

Christ taught that “to know god and and Jesus Christ whom He sent, “was life eternal�. God is not the author of confusion.

God spoke to Adam and Eve in the plural sense because he meant exactly what he said.

The other person God the Father was speaking to was his son Jesus Christ.

There is no confusion in this.

As I observe the only con fusion arises when one adopts the “Trinity� theory.

When we search history, we find that the “trinity� theory is not scripture or revelation, but rather a creation of doctrine by scholars and is enforced by government.

We observe from the old testament that Christ (God the Son) was foreordained to be the redeemer before the foundations of the world were laid. God the father and his son, Jesus Christ are two separate and distinct personages. If this were not so, then it would be ludicrous to have God foreordain himself.

Perhaps one of the most powerful evidences demonstrating their unique separate characters is the fact that there is “one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus�.

If they were one in being, then there would be no need for Christ to be our advocate with the Father.

So, Confused, as I see it confusion only comes into play when one abandons the scriptural “Godhead� and replaces it with the non scriptural “Trinity theory� which itself cannot be clearly reconciled or understood.

best regards, RT

[Willum]

As I've recently discovered, the Torah was only recently written. The Canaan became Sadducee in about 265 BC, without bloodshed, at the command of Pompey the Great, the Sadducee were pagan, also. Before 265 BC the people who would become Jews, worshiped Ba'El (the lord god), and his hosts, of which their storm and battle god, Yahweh, was one:

Yahweh, interestingly, was not a Jewish god originally. Wild, huh!

If you wish to know who the hosts were, and the original story, it was nearly identical to the Sumerian creation story.

[Revelations won]

Is there anyone who would care to challenge my May 21, 2017 post?

If so lets hear your detailed pro or con views.

[Willum]

[Replying to post 78 by Revelations won]

Why should one be bothered by the concept that there may be other Gods?

Yes, if you are worshiping the wrong gods, bad things might happen, the real ones will be mad.

" God (elohim) stands in the divine council (the "adat-el"); he judges among the gods (elohim)." Psalm 82

This is a mis-translation. Elohim is the plural of god.

For this earth we have God the Father of us all and Jesus Christ who is also the principle God of the old testament. That adds up to two Gods that oversee this earth.

Except you are using non-sequitur reasoning: Jesus and Father are not gods of the world, only Jerusalem.
This obviates follow-on questions up until...

It should be very obvious to anyone who carefully studies Christ's great intercessory prayer prior to his crucifixion that the oneness he speaks of is not one in substance, but one in purpose.

I am afraid this does not suggest anything to anyone not already indoctrinated into Christianity. It is completely illogical to myself, having understood both.

Further he did not come to do his will, but the will of the Father.

This is an odd way to show it {click link}.

According to scripture, Christ was foreordained to become the redeemer of this world.

The scripture says lots of things: Not one of them has any impact on my life whether I obey them or not.

Have you ever considered what would have happened if Christ rebelled against the will of the Father as did Lucifer?

Good point, if divinity does change, it completely invalidates the story. You have just, in one question disproved Christianity. That is awesome.
For indeed the only way for it to be successful if forces beyond our comprehension, never change.
Wow!

Suppose he had refused to perform the atonement in the garden?

Suppose God just repaired Adam's mistake in the garden? Allowed them both to perish of natural causes, without children. Then started over.

What if he rebelled and refused to allow himself to die on the cross?

An all-powerful being would have had to find a more logical way of redeeming us.

I think those about answer every other question.

[tam]

Genesis 3: 21 The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. 22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever."

This has always bothered me. If there is only one God, and He is the one speaking in this passage, then two things pop out at me.

1) Who is he speaking to?

2) Why does God refer to Adam and Eve becoming one of US? In the plural sense.

1) He is speaking to His Son. God and His Son = us.

2) {Becoming LIKE one of us, knowing good (life) and bad (death).}

He speaks of this in the plural sense, because He is speaking of Himself and of His Son.



Peace to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy