Is atheism a religion?

[Nilloc James]

In many places I have seen theists claim atheism is just as much as a religion as any existing one.

Question for debate:
Is atheism a religion?


MY view is summarized by this quote:

Calling Atheism a religion is like calling bald a hair color. - Don Hirschberg

But I want to know other peoples opinions.

[Mr Miyagi]

but you could say the same for it being a religion: it is a belief in no God.

No, it is a lack of a belief in a god.

This isn't semantics, the phrasing is important to not blur the lines.

technically, in my opinion, what you are describing here jaysin is agnosticism. The important difference being that although both agnostics and atheists do not believe in god, atheists believe that there is no god. technically agnostics do not have a "belief" that god does not exist. they are open to the theoretical possibility that he may.

So a simple lack of belief is more of an agnostic trait.

[Galphanore]

but you could say the same for it being a religion: it is a belief in no God.

No, it is a lack of a belief in a god.

This isn't semantics, the phrasing is important to not blur the lines.

technically, in my opinion, what you are describing here jaysin is agnosticism. The important difference being that although both agnostics and atheists do not believe in god, atheists believe that there is no god. technically agnostics do not have a "belief" that god does not exist. they are open to the theoretical possibility that he may.

So a simple lack of belief is more of an agnostic trait.

No. Atheism is the absence of a belief in god or gods. Agnosticism is the beleif that it Is impossible to know whether or not god exists. The two are not mutually exclusive, nor even answers to the same question. If someone asks if I believe in god, the answer is No. That is atheism. If someone asks if I know if god can exist, that answer is also No. That is agnosticism. Your misperception is a common one though.

[Mr Miyagi]

but you could say the same for it being a religion: it is a belief in no God.

No, it is a lack of a belief in a god.

This isn't semantics, the phrasing is important to not blur the lines.

technically, in my opinion, what you are describing here jaysin is agnosticism. The important difference being that although both agnostics and atheists do not believe in god, atheists believe that there is no god. technically agnostics do not have a "belief" that god does not exist. they are open to the theoretical possibility that he may.

So a simple lack of belief is more of an agnostic trait.

No. Atheism is the absence of a belief in god or gods. Agnosticism is the beleif that it Is impossible to know whether or not god exists. The two are not mutually exclusive, nor even answers to the same question. If someone asks if I believe in god, the answer is No. That is atheism. If someone asks if I know if god can exist, that answer is also No. That is agnosticism. Your misperception is a common one though.

oh I see. thanks

But if you are agnostic, and somebody asks you 'is it possible to know that god doesn't exist', the the answer would also also be no. Thereby you are open to the possibility that he may exist. So having an agnostic belief is in contrast to an atheistic believe in the total absence of a god

[Galphanore]

but you could say the same for it being a religion: it is a belief in no God.

No, it is a lack of a belief in a god.

This isn't semantics, the phrasing is important to not blur the lines.

technically, in my opinion, what you are describing here jaysin is agnosticism. The important difference being that although both agnostics and atheists do not believe in god, atheists believe that there is no god. technically agnostics do not have a "belief" that god does not exist. they are open to the theoretical possibility that he may.

So a simple lack of belief is more of an agnostic trait.

No. Atheism is the absence of a belief in god or gods. Agnosticism is the beleif that it Is impossible to know whether or not god exists. The two are not mutually exclusive, nor even answers to the same question. If someone asks if I believe in god, the answer is No. That is atheism. If someone asks if I know if god can exist, that answer is also No. That is agnosticism. Your misperception is a common one though.

oh I see. thanks

But if you are agnostic, and somebody asks you 'is it possible to know that god doesn't exist', the the answer would also also be no. Thereby you are open to the possibility that he may exist. So having an agnostic belief is in contrast to an atheistic believe in the total absence of a god

Being open to the possibility doesn't prevent you from being an atheist. All an atheist is is someone who doesn't believe in god, it is not required that they also believe god cannot possibly exist.

[Mr Miyagi]

but you could say the same for it being a religion: it is a belief in no God.

No, it is a lack of a belief in a god.

This isn't semantics, the phrasing is important to not blur the lines.

technically, in my opinion, what you are describing here jaysin is agnosticism. The important difference being that although both agnostics and atheists do not believe in god, atheists believe that there is no god. technically agnostics do not have a "belief" that god does not exist. they are open to the theoretical possibility that he may.

So a simple lack of belief is more of an agnostic trait.

No. Atheism is the absence of a belief in god or gods. Agnosticism is the beleif that it Is impossible to know whether or not god exists. The two are not mutually exclusive, nor even answers to the same question. If someone asks if I believe in god, the answer is No. That is atheism. If someone asks if I know if god can exist, that answer is also No. That is agnosticism. Your misperception is a common one though.

oh I see. thanks

But if you are agnostic, and somebody asks you 'is it possible to know that god doesn't exist', the the answer would also also be no. Thereby you are open to the possibility that he may exist. So having an agnostic belief is in contrast to an atheistic believe in the total absence of a god

Being open to the possibility doesn't prevent you from being an atheist. All an atheist is is someone who doesn't believe in god, it is not required that they also believe god cannot possibly exist.

Forgive me if i am being stupid or pedantic (because that may very well be the case), but if you say I totally believe 100% that god does not exist, you cannot also say that there is a possibility that he might!

the thing with agnosticsm is that it is the belief that we cannot know. And that applies to both sides of the coin. We cannot know that there is a God, but also we cannot know for sure that there isn't a god (i.e. atheism)

[Galphanore]

but you could say the same for it being a religion: it is a belief in no God.

No, it is a lack of a belief in a god.

This isn't semantics, the phrasing is important to not blur the lines.

technically, in my opinion, what you are describing here jaysin is agnosticism. The important difference being that although both agnostics and atheists do not believe in god, atheists believe that there is no god. technically agnostics do not have a "belief" that god does not exist. they are open to the theoretical possibility that he may.

So a simple lack of belief is more of an agnostic trait.

No. Atheism is the absence of a belief in god or gods. Agnosticism is the beleif that it Is impossible to know whether or not god exists. The two are not mutually exclusive, nor even answers to the same question. If someone asks if I believe in god, the answer is No. That is atheism. If someone asks if I know if god can exist, that answer is also No. That is agnosticism. Your misperception is a common one though.

oh I see. thanks

But if you are agnostic, and somebody asks you 'is it possible to know that god doesn't exist', the the answer would also also be no. Thereby you are open to the possibility that he may exist. So having an agnostic belief is in contrast to an atheistic believe in the total absence of a god

Being open to the possibility doesn't prevent you from being an atheist. All an atheist is is someone who doesn't believe in god, it is not required that they also believe god cannot possibly exist.

Forgive me if i am being stupid or pedantic (because that may very well be the case), but if you say I totally believe 100% that god does not exist, you cannot also say that there is a possibility that he might!

In that you are correct. Where you are wrong is in the claim that an atheist is someone who believes "100% that god does not exist". That is not the case. An atheist is just someone who doesn't believe in god. It is possible to both not believe in something and not believe that it is impossible for that same thing to exist. For instance, I do not believe there is a teacup orbiting the sun at L3, but I also do not believe that it is impossible that there could be such a thing. The same is true of gods. I do not believe in any of the many human gods, but I also do not believe that I have evidence that can show that they cannot exist.

the thing with agnosticsm is that it is the belief that we cannot know. And that applies to both sides of the coin. We cannot know that there is a God, but also we cannot know for sure that there isn't a god (i.e. atheism)

Correct. Why do you assume that means that agnosticism and atheism mutually exclusive? Belief does not require complete certainty, only a reasonable amount. Belief also isn't a choice, you cannot simply decide one day that you believe in god. Instead, your beliefs are the result of your understanding of the world based on experience. So, it is possible to think yourself rational and, at the same time, believe in something completely irrational. That's what the terms attempt to show. Atheism is the state of no belief, theism is the state of belief. Agnosticism is the state of "No Knowledge", Gnosticism is the state of Knowledge.

A Gnostic Atheist is someone who does not believe in any gods and believes that they have evidence that proves that, an Agnostic Atheist is someone who does not believe in any gods but has no evidence that the gods cannot exist. A Gnostic Theist is someone who believes in a god or gods and thinks they have evidence that prove their existence, an Agnostic Theist is someone who believes in a god or gods but does not think they have evidence that proves objectively their existence.

Atheism and agnosticism are not on a line of belief, ending with theism. It's more of a crossed chart :

[center][/center]

And in this case, I think I'm the one being pedantic; this subject is just a pet peeve of mine.

[Mr Miyagi]

Ah I see. Well in that case I'm atheist. never knew that!!!lol cheers

[bernee51]

but you could say the same for it being a religion: it is a belief in no God.

No, it is a lack of a belief in a god.

This isn't semantics, the phrasing is important to not blur the lines.

technically, in my opinion, what you are describing here jaysin is agnosticism. The important difference being that although both agnostics and atheists do not believe in god, atheists believe that there is no god. technically agnostics do not have a "belief" that god does not exist. they are open to the theoretical possibility that he may.

So a simple lack of belief is more of an agnostic trait.

No. Atheism is the absence of a belief in god or gods. Agnosticism is the beleif that it Is impossible to know whether or not god exists. The two are not mutually exclusive, nor even answers to the same question. If someone asks if I believe in god, the answer is No. That is atheism. If someone asks if I know if god can exist, that answer is also No. That is agnosticism. Your misperception is a common one though.

oh I see. thanks

But if you are agnostic, and somebody asks you 'is it possible to know that god doesn't exist', the the answer would also also be no. Thereby you are open to the possibility that he may exist. So having an agnostic belief is in contrast to an atheistic believe in the total absence of a god

Being open to the possibility doesn't prevent you from being an atheist. All an atheist is is someone who doesn't believe in god, it is not required that they also believe god cannot possibly exist.

Forgive me if i am being stupid or pedantic (because that may very well be the case), but if you say I totally believe 100% that god does not exist, you cannot also say that there is a possibility that he might!

the thing with agnosticsm is that it is the belief that we cannot know. And that applies to both sides of the coin. We cannot know that there is a God, but also we cannot know for sure that there isn't a god (i.e. atheism)

Two statements, both reflect atheism, but only the first is necessary if one is an atheist, the second is 'optional.

I do not believe in gods.

I do not believe god exists.

They are not identical.

The first deals with belief, the second with existence.

[d.thomas]

I honestly pity the religious that refer to atheism as a religion. They obviously have no concept of what it means to be free of religion.

[Goat]

oh I see. thanks

But if you are agnostic, and somebody asks you 'is it possible to know that god doesn't exist', the the answer would also also be no. Thereby you are open to the possibility that he may exist. So having an agnostic belief is in contrast to an atheistic believe in the total absence of a god

I suspect that the ones that are not open to God not existing at all are very small. However, just because someone acknowledges the possibility of their being wrong doesn't mean that they believe they are wrong.

Even Dawkings, one of the most strident voices in promoting atheism acknowledges it is all based on evidence, or lack there of.