meaning of clouds

dio9 · Post by **dio9** » Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:27 am

Dan. 7:13 "As I watched in the night visions, I saw one like a human being coming with the clouds of heaven. And he came to the Ancient One and was presented before him."

Do you think this inspired the idea meeting the lord in the air on the last days?
Clouds are really used as a metaphor .
Jeremiah used clouds to describe the coming of the king of Assyria, 4:13 "Look! He comes up like clouds, his chariots like the whirlwind; his horses are swifter than eagles" woe to us, for we are ruined!"

Monta · Post by **Monta** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 8:09 am

dio9 wrote:
As he said many times, if you have eyes to see.
Jesus was wrapped in so much obscuring cloud , a poor man coming from Galilee, to Jerusalem , he didn't look like Christ to those without the eyes to see. Why even his disciples didn't know who he was. That was almost perfect obscurity.
I wonder if we Christians will be able to see him if he comes again in the same way.

As you said, if you have eyes to see.
Dosciples had problems seeing and understanding untill the end.
That is the spiritual growth we go through but I still doubt anyone could ever see God as He is in Himself and live, as the Bible says.
When He does appear to people, He restricts His Light and Love intensity to the bearable degree.
We know this as the Lord has appeared countless times throughout history.

dio9 · Post by **dio9** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 8:24 am

[Replying to post 11 by Monta]

When Jacob returned from Haran and embraced Esau , Jacob said I see the face of God in my brother. That's what the bible says.

onewithhim · Post by **onewithhim** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 5:08 pm

dio9 wrote: [Replying to post 11 by Monta]

When Jacob returned from Haran and embraced Esau , Jacob said I see the face of God in my brother. That's what the bible says.

Yeah, so you know he is not talking about the literal face of God. It had to do with, possibly, a spiritual attribute that he thought Esau had developed.

.

dio9 · Post by **dio9** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 7:22 am

[Replying to post 13 by onewithhim]

of course man cannot be God but God can be man. Our God acts in history. We can see God at work in our relationships. That would be with our spiritual eyes. The ones Jesus was talking about. Remember, the people he was speaking to has physical senses but seemed to lack the spiritual accompaniment.

Monta · Post by **Monta** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 8:51 am

onewithhim wrote:
dio9 wrote: [Replying to post 11 by Monta]

When Jacob returned from Haran and embraced Esau , Jacob said I see the face of God in my brother. That's what the bible says.
Yeah, so you know he is not talking about the literal face of God. It had to do with, possibly, a spiritual attribute that he thought Esau had developed.

.

Same as we say to our children, you are angel*

onewithhim · Post by **onewithhim** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 2:20 pm

dio9 wrote: [Replying to post 9 by Monta]

This presents a problem , there are many who have and still do expect to see him come riding the clouds like his father's chariot.
What happens when they can't actually see him as he is hidden like God wrapped in cloud.
If Jesus comes in a cloud without understanding
Will we believe in him?
As he said many times, if you have eyes to see.
Jesus was wrapped in so much obscuring cloud , a poor man coming from Galilee, to Jerusalem , he didn't look like Christ to those without the eyes to see. Why even his disciples didn't know who he was. That was almost perfect obscurity.
I wonder if we Christians will be able to see him if he comes again in the same way.

Everyone WILL understand. That is what the scripture means when it says "every "eye" will see him. The whole world will absolutely know what is happening and who is doing it and why. We don't know how Jesus will accomplish this, but he will. Yes, he did say "if you have eyes to see," and he meant "if you can UNDERSTAND."

Did you notice that he was caught up, out of sight of their view in the cloud? That is how he will come back. His being invisible and working from the heavens will not cause any problems or debilitate him in any way.

.

onewithhim · Post by **onewithhim** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 2:27 pm

dio9 wrote: [Replying to post 13 by onewithhim]

of course man cannot be God but God can be man. Our God acts in history. We can see God at work in our relationships. That would be with our spiritual eyes. The ones Jesus was talking about. Remember, the people he was speaking to has physical senses but seemed to lack the spiritual accompaniment.

No, dio, God cannot be man. Jehovah is greater than the vast universe. Look up into the night sky and imagine God being greater than those stars that you can see.....never mind the ones you can't see because they are too far away. That is why Jehovah sent His Son to the earth, because Jesus could become a man. If God came down himself, what would happen to the universe while he was a zygote in Mary's uterus? What would have happened to everything while he was three days dead? No, God cannot come down here. He has to keep everything alive and working.

But your other sentiments are agreeable. Jesus definitely was referring to people's spiritual acuity.

onewithhim · Post by **onewithhim** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 2:29 pm

Monta wrote:
onewithhim wrote:
dio9 wrote: [Replying to post 11 by Monta]

When Jacob returned from Haran and embraced Esau , Jacob said I see the face of God in my brother. That's what the bible says.
Yeah, so you know he is not talking about the literal face of God. It had to do with, possibly, a spiritual attribute that he thought Esau had developed.

.
Same as we say to our children, you are angel*

Exactly!

dio9 · Post by **dio9** » Wed Dec 28, 2016 9:25 pm

[Replying to post 17 by onewithhim]

what ? you don't believe God became man IN Jesus? Are you aware of what John said about people who said Jesus Christ did not come in the flesh? God can became man, he did .

Monta · Post by **Monta** » Thu Dec 29, 2016 1:37 am

dio9 wrote: [Replying to post 17 by onewithhim]

what ? you don't believe God became man IN Jesus? Are you aware of what John said about people who said Jesus Christ did not come in the flesh? God can became man, he did .

Quite right. We seem to give God physical attributes of time/space as in who would run the universe...
I like one thologian's description 'Christ put on humanity like a garment'
while his divinity was not limited in any way.