How does it work?
How do we make disciples of men?
How do we carry out our calling?
What IS our calling exactly?
Matthew 28:19-20
"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.
teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you
Let's unpack that last part.
The Body of Christ
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SeaPriestess
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Post #11
I like this:
For as the body is one and has many members, but all the members of that one body, being many, are one body, so also is Christ. 13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body"whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free"and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. 14 For in fact the body is not one member but many.
15 If the foot should say, Because I am not a hand, I am not of the body, is it therefore not of the body? 16 And if the ear should say, Because I am not an eye, I am not of the body, is it therefore not of the body? 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would be the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where would be the smelling? 18 But now God has set the members, each one of them, in the body just as He pleased. 19 And if they were all one member, where would the body be?
20 But now indeed there are many members, yet one body. 21 And the eye cannot say to the hand, I have no need of you; nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. 22 No, much rather, those members of the body which seem to be weaker are necessary. 23 And those members of the body which we think to be less honorable, on these we bestow greater honor; and our unpresentable parts have greater modesty, 24 but our presentable parts have no need. But God composed the body, having given greater honor to that part which lacks it, 25 that there should be no schism in the body, but that the members should have the same care for one another. 26 And if one member suffers, all the members suffer with it; or if one member is honored, all the members rejoice with it.
27 Now you are the body of Christ, and members individually.
For as the body is one and has many members, but all the members of that one body, being many, are one body, so also is Christ. 13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body"whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free"and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. 14 For in fact the body is not one member but many.
15 If the foot should say, Because I am not a hand, I am not of the body, is it therefore not of the body? 16 And if the ear should say, Because I am not an eye, I am not of the body, is it therefore not of the body? 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would be the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where would be the smelling? 18 But now God has set the members, each one of them, in the body just as He pleased. 19 And if they were all one member, where would the body be?
20 But now indeed there are many members, yet one body. 21 And the eye cannot say to the hand, I have no need of you; nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. 22 No, much rather, those members of the body which seem to be weaker are necessary. 23 And those members of the body which we think to be less honorable, on these we bestow greater honor; and our unpresentable parts have greater modesty, 24 but our presentable parts have no need. But God composed the body, having given greater honor to that part which lacks it, 25 that there should be no schism in the body, but that the members should have the same care for one another. 26 And if one member suffers, all the members suffer with it; or if one member is honored, all the members rejoice with it.
27 Now you are the body of Christ, and members individually.
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JehovahsWitness
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Re: The Body of Christ
Post #12SeaPriestess wrote: [Replying to post 9 by JehovahsWitness]
How could you possibly think that quoting Jesus speaking of the 2 greatest commandments is minimalizing, ignoring and disregarding?
The quote was good, but your comment lead me to believe that you think that discussing how love of God is expressed through obedience to his law and instructions is {may I quote you here?} " just blah blah blah blah"{end quote}.
Maybe I misunderstood, if I did I apologise, but "blah blah blah" is usually taken to mean unnecessary and useless verbage. May I ask for the sake of clarity then, WHAT were you refering to when you say "just blah blah blah"?
JW
ps: You didn't actually answer my question, do you feel so inclined?
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
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William
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Post #13
[Replying to post 11 by SeaPriestess]
The best people have is the bible and the history of Christendom, both of which have things in them which contradict those things within them.
I think you were on the right track with the 'love commandments' so we can at least use those to identify actual stories about Jesus where he can clearly be seen to be showing this in his words and behavior. For surely we have some inkling of what it is to Love.?
As to quoting Paul in post #11, again, we can look at that and see if Love can be identified therein. This method can be applied to anything which presents itself in our lives. If that presented shows something other than, then it can be laid aside.
This is an unknown thing. What were these ones 'taught to obey' which can be clearly shown to be actual commands of Jesus?teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you
Let's unpack that last part.
The best people have is the bible and the history of Christendom, both of which have things in them which contradict those things within them.
I think you were on the right track with the 'love commandments' so we can at least use those to identify actual stories about Jesus where he can clearly be seen to be showing this in his words and behavior. For surely we have some inkling of what it is to Love.?
As to quoting Paul in post #11, again, we can look at that and see if Love can be identified therein. This method can be applied to anything which presents itself in our lives. If that presented shows something other than, then it can be laid aside.
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SeaPriestess
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Re: The Body of Christ
Post #14[Replying to post 12 by JehovahsWitness]
I just don't get myself caught up in the details of scripture. That's just me and my path and where God has brought me at this time in my life. I'm not judging you for doing the opposite. If all the minutiae has equal importance in your eyes, if God has clearly made it known to your conscience that he wants you to make sure you are living by all the minutiae then that's between you and God and you need to follow that.
I just don't get myself caught up in the details of scripture. That's just me and my path and where God has brought me at this time in my life. I'm not judging you for doing the opposite. If all the minutiae has equal importance in your eyes, if God has clearly made it known to your conscience that he wants you to make sure you are living by all the minutiae then that's between you and God and you need to follow that.
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SeaPriestess
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No Trinity until the third century. See Arianism, Nicaea
Post #16Matthew 28:19-20
"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.
RESPONSE: Actually, this passage appears to have been added to Matthew's Gospel around the third century.
Five baptisms are described in the New Testament all in the name of Jesus alone. None in the name of a Trinity which did not yet exist.
"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.
RESPONSE: Actually, this passage appears to have been added to Matthew's Gospel around the third century.
Five baptisms are described in the New Testament all in the name of Jesus alone. None in the name of a Trinity which did not yet exist.
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SeaPriestess
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Re: No Trinity until the third century. See Arianism, Nicaea
Post #18RESPONSE:
I read it in the Bible. Wiki has an outline.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptism_i ... e_of_Jesus
Early Christianity Christianity are recorded in the Acts of the Apostles. Acts 2 records the Apostle Peter, on the day of Pentecost, preaching to the crowds to "repent and be baptised in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission (or forgiveness) of sins" (Acts 2:38). Other detailed records of baptisms in the book of Acts show the first Apostles baptising in the name of Jesus.[2][3][4][5] The Apostle Paul also refers to baptism into Christ Jesus.[6][7]
Over time the Trinitarian formula from Matthew 28:19 became popularized. This was further supported by the Didache, which most scholars date to around the year 100.[
1. Acts 8:16
2. Acts 10:48
3. Acts 19:5
4. Acts 22:16
5. Acts 19:1"7
6. Romans 6:3
Jesus wasn't claimed to be divine himself until about 82 AD. The Christians were banned from Jewish synagogues as a result of such "apostasy". See also the gospel of John (c. 95 AD) and the 12 Benediction (Jewish).
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JehovahsWitness
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Re: The Body of Christ
Post #19SeaPriestess wrote: [Replying to post 12 by JehovahsWitness]
I just don't get myself caught up in the details of scripture. That's just me and my path and where God has brought me at this time in my life. I'm not judging you for doing the opposite. If all the minutiae has equal importance in your eyes, if God has clearly made it known to your conscience that he wants you to make sure you are living by all the minutiae then that's between you and God and you need to follow that.
So is 1 Cor 12:12-27 blah, blah blah? What about Matthew 28:19-20 ?
You quoted from both of them ....why?
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
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SeaPriestess
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Re: The Body of Christ
Post #20[Replying to JehovahsWitness]
I quoted 1Corinthians 12 because the concept is worth a discussion about the "body" of believers and what they can contribute and do. I think there is a very narrow mind set we have now, in the church at large, pertaining to this idea of evangelizing. The idea isn't narrow but the application is. Knocking on doors, riding a bike into bad neighbors to talk to folks, striking up conversations with strangers at the mall to ask them what they would say to God if they died tonight...are looked at as the end all, be all of "evangelizing". If you don't do these things, then you're not REALLY doing what you are called to do. I have an issue with this. A big issue. That is all. I think worshipping with singing and music is sort of narrow minded as well. I love music and singing. I've been blessed in those areas. But not all are called to sing or play an instrument and I think it's wrong for there to be such a huge focus on singing songs. I personally love it, but again, for the body of believers, I think its a small part of the body just as this talking to strangers thing. Not all are called to talk to strangers about Jesus.
The Matthew verses referring to obeying what Jesus commands are very clear. Just read Jesus' words and commands. IF, I repeat, IF there are questions about other parts of the NT and how to apply, just check it against Jesus' commandments and they are :love God with heart, soul, strength and mind and love your neighbor as yourself. The end.
I quoted 1Corinthians 12 because the concept is worth a discussion about the "body" of believers and what they can contribute and do. I think there is a very narrow mind set we have now, in the church at large, pertaining to this idea of evangelizing. The idea isn't narrow but the application is. Knocking on doors, riding a bike into bad neighbors to talk to folks, striking up conversations with strangers at the mall to ask them what they would say to God if they died tonight...are looked at as the end all, be all of "evangelizing". If you don't do these things, then you're not REALLY doing what you are called to do. I have an issue with this. A big issue. That is all. I think worshipping with singing and music is sort of narrow minded as well. I love music and singing. I've been blessed in those areas. But not all are called to sing or play an instrument and I think it's wrong for there to be such a huge focus on singing songs. I personally love it, but again, for the body of believers, I think its a small part of the body just as this talking to strangers thing. Not all are called to talk to strangers about Jesus.
The Matthew verses referring to obeying what Jesus commands are very clear. Just read Jesus' words and commands. IF, I repeat, IF there are questions about other parts of the NT and how to apply, just check it against Jesus' commandments and they are :love God with heart, soul, strength and mind and love your neighbor as yourself. The end.
