Calmer now, or more sneaky?

[Menotu]

Read the Old Testament and it seems God is just about constantly mad or upset about someone or something (which is odd since he should have seen whatever he's mad at coming but that's another topic).
Smite this
Drown that
Get angry at them
Tempt him
That was God's MO in the Old Testament.
But in more recent times (last few hundred years or so) God's eventfulness seems strangely absent.
Or is it?
Maybe he's had a personality change (that would be nice, eh?) and he's killing people in more sneaky ways.
Instead of floods, fireballs, massive plagues, he's using people, microbs, bacteria, human stupidity...even animals...to do his slaughtering.

So is God absent these days, or being more sneaky with how he takes care of business?
If he's absent, why?
If he's being a sneaky snake, why?
Or is he here as prevalent as ever, but we're just not 'seeing' him?

[Elijah John]

[Replying to post 1 by Menotu]

When the OT was written it was a more primitive time. And superstitious. The Ancients attributed natural phenomena to the retribution of God. And sometimes projected their own barbarism to His orders.

[Tired of the Nonsense]

Read the Old Testament and it seems God is just about constantly mad or upset about someone or something (which is odd since he should have seen whatever he's mad at coming but that's another topic).
Smite this
Drown that
Get angry at them
Tempt him
That was God's MO in the Old Testament.
But in more recent times (last few hundred years or so) God's eventfulness seems strangely absent.
Or is it?
Maybe he's had a personality change (that would be nice, eh?) and he's killing people in more sneaky ways.
Instead of floods, fireballs, massive plagues, he's using people, microbs, bacteria, human stupidity...even animals...to do his slaughtering.

So is God absent these days, or being more sneaky with how he takes care of business?
If he's absent, why?
If he's being a sneaky snake, why?
Or is he here as prevalent as ever, but we're just not 'seeing' him?

The God of the OT was psychotic. Apparently He has been institutionalized.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 1 by Menotu]

IS GOD SNEAKY?

Sneaky can be defined as someone who is secretuve, decietful, ... someone that slyly acts in a way that hides knowledge of that which may be harmful or embarrassing to himself or others.

No I don't belive that is a fitting descriptiin of YHWH (Jehovah) the God of the bible. He is always honest, indeed the bible says "God cannot lie" and described as the God of truth. The bible narrative shows God from the beginning as acting openly, he has always clearly indicated what he expected of his creation. Even after Adam and Eve disobeyed Him, seperated from humanity by their inhereted sin, God explained how the problem would be remedied and stayed close to those that sought him (compsre Genesis 3:15; Jam 4:8).

Jehovah is never acted in a way that brings anything but blessings to his creation, so "sneaky" is imo as far as one could get from a descriotiin of JEHOVAH. It is however a fitting descriotion of the "god if this world" namely Satan the devil (Genesis 3:1, 2 Corinthians 4:4).






JW

Is God more killer than kind?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 154#959154

Is God sneaky? [This post]
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 97#1003797

[Diagoras]

[Replying to post 1 by Menotu]

IS GOD SNEAKY?

Sneaky can be defined as someone who is secretuve, decietful, ... someone that slyly acts in a way that hides knowledge of that which may be harmful or embarrassing to himself or others.

No I don't belive that is a fitting descriptiin of YHWH (Jehovah) the God of the bible. He is always honest, indeed the bible says "God cannot lie" and described as the God of truth. The bible narrative shows God from the beginning as acting openly, he has always clearly indicated what he expected of his creation. Even after Adam and Eve disobeyed Him, seperated from humanity by their inhereted sin, God explained how the problem would be remedied and stayed close to those that sought him (compsre Genesis 3:15; Jam 4:8).

Jehovah is never acted in a way that brings anything but blessings to his creation, so "sneaky" is imo as far as one could get from a descriotiin of JEHOVAH. It is however a fitting descriotion of the "god if this world" namely Satan the devil (Genesis 3:1, 2 Corinthians 4:4).

So, clearly indicating to Abraham that he wished Isaac to be sacrificed? No, that was just a test... And how about Job? God was hardly acting openly with him, was he?

Sending a flood to kill off every wicked person (and all the animals) - where was the explanation of what he expected before he did that?

Probably plenty of other good examples that I cant bring to mind immediately that disprove your claim of an open, honest god.

Another point: You quote Genesis 3:1 as describing Satan, but theres considerable evidence to show that the serpent in Genesis was never identified as Satan. A lot of misconceptions surround Satan, as I posted in TDD on the subject.

[JehovahsWitness]

So, clearly indicating to Abraham that he wished Isaac to be sacrificed? No, that was just a test...

Yes, God was clear about that; do you think Abraham didnt understand what God was requesting of him? Did God fail to clearly and openly communicate the request?

[JehovahsWitness]

God from the beginning as acting openly, he has always clearly indicated what he expected of his creation.

... how about Job? God was hardly acting openly with him, was he?

God didn't act with Job at all, at least during his test, that was the whole point. Satan pointed out that God had blessed and protected Job and challenenged him (Jehovah) to refrain from acting (interacting) with him (Job).

God wasn't requesting anything of Job. That said he clearly expected Job to keep his integrity and Job evidently understood this.


JW

[JehovahsWitness]

Sending a flood to kill off every wicked person (and all the animals) - where was the explanation of what he expected before he did that?

Probably in the words of Noah when he preached to them*.


* when I said his creation I was referring to his intelligent creation as in humans (I probably should have made that clear: my bad). Animals simply follow their instincts and God doesnt hold them to the same standards as humans or request they make moral choices.

JW

[JehovahsWitness]

Another point: You quote Genesis 3:1 as describing Satan

Did I say Genesis 3:1 was describing Satan?

Probably plenty of ... good examples that I cant bring to mind immediately that disprove your claim of an open, honest god.

No there are not.




JW

[Tcg]

Jehovah is never acted in a way that brings anything but blessings to his creation, so "sneaky" is imo as far as one could get from a descriotiin of JEHOVAH.

JW

These words of YHWH recorded in Malachi 2 paint a very different picture:

• 2 And now, O priests, this command is for you. 2 If you will not listen, if you will not take it to heart to give honor to my name, says the Lord of hosts, then I will send the curse upon you and I will curse your blessings. Indeed, I have already cursed them, because you do not lay it to heart. 3 Behold, I will rebuke your offspring, and spread dung on your faces, the dung of your offerings, and you shall be taken away with it."

This is of course not the only example that contradicts your claim. Here is another. This one from Genesis 3:

• 14 The Lord God said to the serpent,
  Because you have done this,
  cursed are you above all livestock
  and above all beasts of the field;
  on your belly you shall go,
  and dust you shall eat
  all the days of your life.
  15 I will put enmity between you and the woman,
  and between your offspring and her offspring;
  he shall bruise your head,
  and you shall bruise his heel.

Tcg