Jehovah's Witnesses and the Trinity Part 1

[SiNcE_1985]

.

No excuses, Jesus is God.

We are gonna deal with these Trinity-Proof texts, one by one....using Jehovah's Witnesses (JW's) own New World's Translation, while I use the New King James Version (NKJV)...and we are gonna expose their faulty NWT, as needed.

For this thread, we will examine the following three books and verses..

Isa 40:3 – Mark 1:1-8 – Malachi 3:1

Lets begin with Isa 40:3..

Isa 40:3
NKJV Isa 40:3 ”The voice of one crying in the wilderness: “Prepare the way of the Lord; Make straight in the desert A highway for our God.
NWT Isa 40:3 A voice of one calling out in the wilderness: “Clear up* the way of Jehovah! Make a straight highway through the desert for our God.

Now, as you can see, in comparison, both the NKJV and the NWT reads the same.

It is commanded that a clear path is made for God (Lord, Jehovah), because he is coming through!!

Ok, now, lets look at Malachi 3:1..

NKJV Mal 3:1 “Behold, I send My messenger, And he will prepare the way before Me.
And the Lord, whom you seek, Will suddenly come to His temple, Even the Messenger of the covenant, In whom you delight. Behold, He is coming,” Says the Lord of hosts.

NWT Mal 3:1  “Look! I am sending my messenger, and he will clear up* a way before me. And suddenly the true Lord, whom you are seeking, will come to his temple; and the messenger of the covenant will come, in whom you take delight. Look! He will certainly come,” says Jehovah of armies.

Virtually the same message, the Lord is coming...and the path is being cleared for him.

The significance? This is a prophecy of the coming of Jesus....and this messenger who clears the path for him, is John the Baptist.

How do we know?

Because, in Mark 1:1-8...

1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God. 2 As it is written in [a]the Prophets:

“Behold, I send My messenger before Your face,
Who will prepare Your way before You.”
3 “The voice of one crying in the wilderness:
‘Prepare the way of the Lord;
Make His paths straight.’ ”

4 John came baptizing in the wilderness and preaching a baptism of repentance for the remission of sins. 7 And he preached, saying, “There comes One after me who is mightier than I, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to stoop down and loose. 8 I indeed baptized you with water, but He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.”

The implication is simple, Jesus is God.

Even in JW's own NWT Bible, it is said that the path (Isa 40:3) is being made clear for Jehovah/God.

The author of Mark connects the subject of the cleared path in the book of Isaiah (who is identified as Jehovah/God), to the subject of the path in his own book (who is identified as Jesus).

This is irrefutable evidence of the fact that; Jesus is God.

Anyone who has beef with this, let me know.

[face2face]

By the time the Trinity and its formula were fully developed, the true Gospel had long been corrupted by the religious leaders of the age.

At the Council of Chalcedon in A.D. 451, the church formally declared the doctrine of the hypostatic union—an attempt to define how divinity and humanity were supposedly united in Jesus Christ, making him both fully divine and fully human.

So, what do Christians call something that cannot be defined or explained?

The Hypostatic Union is considered a mysterium stricte dictum—a mystery of faith, meaning it could not be known before its revelation, and even after its revelation, its inner possibility cannot be logically proven: "The reality of which could not be known before its revelation, and the inner possibility of which cannot positively be proved even after its revelation." —Ludwig Ott, Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma (St. Louis: Bischöfliches Seminar St. Willibald, Copyright Baronius Press, 1957), 152.

Even many honest theologians acknowledge that this doctrine cannot be found in the Bible and is simply something to be believed rather than proven.

The extent to which people will go to deceive themselves is truly astounding.

F2F

I just wondered why this two simple logic cannot be addressed?
Honest answers of these questions without twisting the logic, these will nail the issues you raised.
I believe someone had said, it's very hard to support the would be distorted reasons Biblically.

1. Jesus as in the form of a servant, is He man or not?
2. Jesus as in the form of God, is He God or not? Why an honest answer to the first question cannot be applied to the second? Why and explain.

1. Jesus as the Son of Man as His mother is human. Is he man or not?
2. Jesus as the Son of God as His Father is God. Is He God or not? Why an honest answer to the first question cannot be applied to the second? Why and explain.

Why is Isaiah 49:5 crucial for answering these questions?

Isaiah 49:5: "And now the Lord says, he who formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob back to him; and that Israel might be gathered to him, for I am honored in the sight of the Lord, and my God has become my strength."

Could you clarify why you think Paul's mind was focused on the servant prophecies in Isaiah, and in what sense did God form Jesus—was it in nature, or in his character, mind and thinking?

Also, regarding the PDF document I sent you, does Philippians emphasize nature, or thinking (mind = servant)?

If you agree with Paul's premise that God shaped the character of His Son in a similar way to all His servants, then, considering that Christ shares in our nature and has learned the Scriptures and developed God's character, is Jesus able to ask the same of us who share in his nature?

Yes or no?

F2F

Isaiah 49:5, proves the no. 1 question, but does not answer the number 2. It's the Father's words addressing His Son, now become incarnate for the redemption of mankind," that formed me from the womb," this refers to the human nature of Christ formed in the womb of Mary by the Holy Ghost.

You just quote Isaiah here, I don't see apostle Paul's premise. Yes, Jesus as being in the likeness of man, experience all what human undergoes, feel hungry, tired, etc., tempted but overcame. Truly man in nature.
Sorry, if you mean my no. 1 question as apostle Paul's premise? Yes, human nature.

Regarding the PDF you've sent, I've just lightly examined it, because as you've said, "it very difficult to have a Bible-based conversation on the subject." To me it means unBiblical.

Jesus is God from the beginning, and has not on anyway just developed God's character. (John 1:18)

But still you have not answered those two simple similar phrases by honest logic.

It seems you’re not interested in exploring the foundation of Paul’s thoughts in Philippians.

An example....I've led you to Isaiah, but you want to lead me to your manmade creeds. Forcing your own interpretation on the Word of God will not lead you to His Wisdom! I can see that I'm trying to guide you towards the truth, but the introduction of terms like "incarnation" and other dogma language has left you stuck, confined by the creeds.

If you have the time, I encourage you to study the foundation of Paul’s thoughts from Isaiah. This will require you to open your Bible and read the Servant Prophecies, which will help you better understand and discuss the answers to your questions. Clearly, the Trinity cannot provide that insight for you.

When you are ready let me know.

F2F

[Capbook]

By the time the Trinity and its formula were fully developed, the true Gospel had long been corrupted by the religious leaders of the age.

At the Council of Chalcedon in A.D. 451, the church formally declared the doctrine of the hypostatic union—an attempt to define how divinity and humanity were supposedly united in Jesus Christ, making him both fully divine and fully human.

So, what do Christians call something that cannot be defined or explained?

The Hypostatic Union is considered a mysterium stricte dictum—a mystery of faith, meaning it could not be known before its revelation, and even after its revelation, its inner possibility cannot be logically proven: "The reality of which could not be known before its revelation, and the inner possibility of which cannot positively be proved even after its revelation." —Ludwig Ott, Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma (St. Louis: Bischöfliches Seminar St. Willibald, Copyright Baronius Press, 1957), 152.

Even many honest theologians acknowledge that this doctrine cannot be found in the Bible and is simply something to be believed rather than proven.

The extent to which people will go to deceive themselves is truly astounding.

F2F

I just wondered why this two simple logic cannot be addressed?
Honest answers of these questions without twisting the logic, these will nail the issues you raised.
I believe someone had said, it's very hard to support the would be distorted reasons Biblically.

1. Jesus as in the form of a servant, is He man or not?
2. Jesus as in the form of God, is He God or not? Why an honest answer to the first question cannot be applied to the second? Why and explain.

1. Jesus as the Son of Man as His mother is human. Is he man or not?
2. Jesus as the Son of God as His Father is God. Is He God or not? Why an honest answer to the first question cannot be applied to the second? Why and explain.

Why is Isaiah 49:5 crucial for answering these questions?

Isaiah 49:5: "And now the Lord says, he who formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob back to him; and that Israel might be gathered to him, for I am honored in the sight of the Lord, and my God has become my strength."

Could you clarify why you think Paul's mind was focused on the servant prophecies in Isaiah, and in what sense did God form Jesus—was it in nature, or in his character, mind and thinking?

Also, regarding the PDF document I sent you, does Philippians emphasize nature, or thinking (mind = servant)?

If you agree with Paul's premise that God shaped the character of His Son in a similar way to all His servants, then, considering that Christ shares in our nature and has learned the Scriptures and developed God's character, is Jesus able to ask the same of us who share in his nature?

Yes or no?

F2F

Isaiah 49:5, proves the no. 1 question, but does not answer the number 2. It's the Father's words addressing His Son, now become incarnate for the redemption of mankind," that formed me from the womb," this refers to the human nature of Christ formed in the womb of Mary by the Holy Ghost.

You just quote Isaiah here, I don't see apostle Paul's premise. Yes, Jesus as being in the likeness of man, experience all what human undergoes, feel hungry, tired, etc., tempted but overcame. Truly man in nature.
Sorry, if you mean my no. 1 question as apostle Paul's premise? Yes, human nature.

Regarding the PDF you've sent, I've just lightly examined it, because as you've said, "it very difficult to have a Bible-based conversation on the subject." To me it means unBiblical.

Jesus is God from the beginning, and has not on anyway just developed God's character. (John 1:18)

But still you have not answered those two simple similar phrases by honest logic.

It seems you’re not interested in exploring the foundation of Paul’s thoughts in Philippians.

An example....I've led you to Isaiah, but you want to lead me to your manmade creeds. Forcing your own interpretation on the Word of God will not lead you to His Wisdom! I can see that I'm trying to guide you towards the truth, but the introduction of terms like "incarnation" and other dogma language has left you stuck, confined by the creeds.

If you have the time, I encourage you to study the foundation of Paul’s thoughts from Isaiah. This will require you to open your Bible and read the Servant Prophecies, which will help you better understand and discuss the answers to your questions. Clearly, the Trinity cannot provide that insight for you.

When you are ready let me know.

F2F

I believe you misunderstand Paul's thoughts.
Easy to honestly answer the no.1 question, and I believe on what you've said, (correct me if am wrong) that, "it's very difficult to have a Bible-based conversation on the subject." I believe referring to no.2 question.
The bible is clear, Jesus is God. (John 1:18)
He was in the beginning with the Father, and God was the Word.(John 1:1)
The Word became flesh and dwelt among us. Human in nature. (John 1:14)
For in Jesus dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. God in nature.(Col 2:9)
These are not my words, these are Bible verses and Bible lexicon.
Would apostle Paul dispute those texts? He wrote Colossians.

(Col 2:9) Louw and Nida Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament defined word "Godhead" with Strong No.2320, in Greek "theotes" as the nature or state of being God, divine nature, divine being, etc.

NT:2320 theotes
a 'God,' 12.1) the nature or state of being God - 'deity, divine nature, divine being.
(from Greek-English Lexicon Based on Semantic Domain. Copyright © 1988 United Bible Societies, New York. Used by permission.)

[face2face]

I just wondered why this two simple logic cannot be addressed?
Honest answers of these questions without twisting the logic, these will nail the issues you raised.
I believe someone had said, it's very hard to support the would be distorted reasons Biblically.

1. Jesus as in the form of a servant, is He man or not?
2. Jesus as in the form of God, is He God or not? Why an honest answer to the first question cannot be applied to the second? Why and explain.

1. Jesus as the Son of Man as His mother is human. Is he man or not?
2. Jesus as the Son of God as His Father is God. Is He God or not? Why an honest answer to the first question cannot be applied to the second? Why and explain.

Why is Isaiah 49:5 crucial for answering these questions?

Isaiah 49:5: "And now the Lord says, he who formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob back to him; and that Israel might be gathered to him, for I am honored in the sight of the Lord, and my God has become my strength."

Could you clarify why you think Paul's mind was focused on the servant prophecies in Isaiah, and in what sense did God form Jesus—was it in nature, or in his character, mind and thinking?

Also, regarding the PDF document I sent you, does Philippians emphasize nature, or thinking (mind = servant)?

If you agree with Paul's premise that God shaped the character of His Son in a similar way to all His servants, then, considering that Christ shares in our nature and has learned the Scriptures and developed God's character, is Jesus able to ask the same of us who share in his nature?

Yes or no?

F2F

Isaiah 49:5, proves the no. 1 question, but does not answer the number 2. It's the Father's words addressing His Son, now become incarnate for the redemption of mankind," that formed me from the womb," this refers to the human nature of Christ formed in the womb of Mary by the Holy Ghost.

You just quote Isaiah here, I don't see apostle Paul's premise. Yes, Jesus as being in the likeness of man, experience all what human undergoes, feel hungry, tired, etc., tempted but overcame. Truly man in nature.
Sorry, if you mean my no. 1 question as apostle Paul's premise? Yes, human nature.

Regarding the PDF you've sent, I've just lightly examined it, because as you've said, "it very difficult to have a Bible-based conversation on the subject." To me it means unBiblical.

Jesus is God from the beginning, and has not on anyway just developed God's character. (John 1:18)

But still you have not answered those two simple similar phrases by honest logic.

It seems you’re not interested in exploring the foundation of Paul’s thoughts in Philippians.

An example....I've led you to Isaiah, but you want to lead me to your manmade creeds. Forcing your own interpretation on the Word of God will not lead you to His Wisdom! I can see that I'm trying to guide you towards the truth, but the introduction of terms like "incarnation" and other dogma language has left you stuck, confined by the creeds.

If you have the time, I encourage you to study the foundation of Paul’s thoughts from Isaiah. This will require you to open your Bible and read the Servant Prophecies, which will help you better understand and discuss the answers to your questions. Clearly, the Trinity cannot provide that insight for you.

When you are ready let me know.

F2F

I believe you misunderstand Paul's thoughts.
Easy to honestly answer the no.1 question, and I believe on what you've said, (correct me if am wrong) that, "it's very difficult to have a Bible-based conversation on the subject." I believe referring to no.2 question.
The bible is clear, Jesus is God. (John 1:18)
He was in the beginning with the Father, and God was the Word.(John 1:1)
The Word became flesh and dwelt among us. Human in nature. (John 1:14)
For in Jesus dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. God in nature.(Col 2:9)
These are not my words, these are Bible verses and Bible lexicon.
Would apostle Paul dispute those texts? He wrote Colossians.

(Col 2:9) Louw and Nida Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament defined word "Godhead" with Strong No.2320, in Greek "theotes" as the nature or state of being God, divine nature, divine being, etc.

NT:2320 theotes
a 'God,' 12.1) the nature or state of being God - 'deity, divine nature, divine being.
(from Greek-English Lexicon Based on Semantic Domain. Copyright © 1988 United Bible Societies, New York. Used by permission.)

Once the creed-based formula takes hold of a believer's mind, it becomes nearly impossible for them to see beyond it – this is something you experience every time you write or read the Bible (sad).

Let me give you an example.

For a moment, let’s assume Jesus is God.

Why would Jesus need to learn? Can your God learn? If you are thinking of God emptying Himself the question is why? Why would he pretend to be something He is not!

“And Jesus grew in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and man.” – Luke 2:52

If we go with your perspective, it makes sense why Jesus would need to grow in favor with man (since he’s the Son of Man), but how does God grow in favor with God? It makes sense for the Son of God would need to grow in favor with God, but it’s impossible for God to need favor from Himself. He is not Self Serving!

Let’s take this a step further.

Why would God remove Wisdom from Himself - grow that wisdom over time but leave out critical information that only God knows?

Matthew 24:36. ESV "But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only"

Can you explain how and why it would be necessary for Jesus to not know this basic information?

In your previous reply, you make bold statements about Jesus being God, but you don't have the God in Jesus to declare Him as such. Instead, you have a servant man, born of a woman, with our condemned nature, one who experienced the sting of sin, which is death, and one who was under the dominion of death throughout his life.

- God cannot be held under deaths dominion in any way shape or form
- God cannot die to sin at all!
- God cannot dwell in anything which is unclean especially not death!
- God cannot be weak!

Let me ask you a question and if you can answer it correctly it will show me you are a genuine seeker of truth.

2 Corinthians 13:4 "For he (Jesus) was crucified in weakness, but lives by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, but we will live with him by the power of God toward you."

Explain in what way do you share in Christs weakness? Explain how that weakness was dealt with on the cross and how it's been dealt with in you.

What I'm doing here Capbook is testing your understanding to see if your god-man theology can reveal the true Christ. I know it cannot, but you need to see that for yourself.

F2F

[face2face]

(Col 2:9) Louw and Nida Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament defined word "Godhead" with Strong No.2320, in Greek "theotes" as the nature or state of being God, divine nature, divine being, etc.

NT:2320 theotes
a 'God,' 12.1) the nature or state of being God - 'deity, divine nature, divine being.
(from Greek-English Lexicon Based on Semantic Domain. Copyright © 1988 United Bible Societies, New York. Used by permission.)

For in him all the fullness of deity lives in bodily form, 2:10 and you have been filled in him, who is the head over every ruler and authority. Col 2:8–10.

Once again, Capbook, you've created another contradiction for yourself.

Who gave Jesus this FULNESS?

Jesus had the Spirit of God without measure (John 3:34). He shared the same mind and purpose as God (John 10:30). However, he also acknowledged that his Father was greater than he (John 10:29; 14:28). It’s clear, then, that while Jesus was a uniquely empowered human being, He was not God.

But again, let's assume I believe in the Trinity, and I'm confronted with this dilemma.

1. God gave Jesus His Spirit without measure (God more powerful)
2. God gave Jesus wisdom (God more powerful)
3. God raises Jesus from the grave (God more powerful)
4. God exalts him to His right-hand side (God more powerful)
5. God fills His Glorified Son with the Fulness of His Glory (God more powerful)

So how do you interpret Col 2:9?

How does Jesus being God have this "fulness", yet still in his glorified state be subject to God?

27. For he "has put everything under his feet." Now when it says that "everything has been put under him," it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

Can you reconcile Col 2:9 with 1 Corinthians 15:27

Having a true understanding who Jesus was and is would enable you to answer this question.

The 3n1 dogma cannot help you

F2F

[face2face]

For others reading this thread here is something to chew on:

It’s worth noting that the word "fullness" comes from the same root as "complete" in Colossians 2:9-10. In other words, this reflects the answer to Jesus' prayer in John 17:23: God is in Jesus, and Jesus is in us.

John 17:23: "I in them and you in me—so that they may be brought to complete unity. Then the world will know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me."

Can you see the problem?

[face2face]

Now let's assume you have seen the issue lets go back to Col 2:9-10

The words "fullness" in verse 9 and "complete" in verse 10 are related.

In this sense, to manifest God is to be like Jesus. Just as Jesus manifested God, so should we.

As Colossians 2:9-10 Verse 9: "For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form, Verse 10: and in Christ you have been brought to fullness. He is the head over every power and authority."

How is Paul using the "πλήρωμα" (plērōma)

Clearly Jesus is not God, as we are not God.

So what's the lesson?

1 Timothy 3:16: "Great indeed, we confess, is the mystery of godliness: He was manifested in the flesh, vindicated (justified or made right) by the Spirit, seen by angels, proclaimed among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory."

This shows that, as Jesus manifested the fullness of God, we are also called to reflect and manifest God's likeness, not in nature, as Jesus and us are sin's flesh (Romans 8:1-3) but in character!

If you apply Trinitarian doctrine to Col 2:9-10 it makes no sense whatsoever!

F2F

[face2face]

When we understand that Jesus sought and obtained the "fullness" of God's character, we will recognize that we need nothing more than what is already taught to us in Scripture.

[Capbook]

Why is Isaiah 49:5 crucial for answering these questions?

Isaiah 49:5: "And now the Lord says, he who formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob back to him; and that Israel might be gathered to him, for I am honored in the sight of the Lord, and my God has become my strength."

Could you clarify why you think Paul's mind was focused on the servant prophecies in Isaiah, and in what sense did God form Jesus—was it in nature, or in his character, mind and thinking?

Also, regarding the PDF document I sent you, does Philippians emphasize nature, or thinking (mind = servant)?

If you agree with Paul's premise that God shaped the character of His Son in a similar way to all His servants, then, considering that Christ shares in our nature and has learned the Scriptures and developed God's character, is Jesus able to ask the same of us who share in his nature?

Yes or no?

F2F

Isaiah 49:5, proves the no. 1 question, but does not answer the number 2. It's the Father's words addressing His Son, now become incarnate for the redemption of mankind," that formed me from the womb," this refers to the human nature of Christ formed in the womb of Mary by the Holy Ghost.

You just quote Isaiah here, I don't see apostle Paul's premise. Yes, Jesus as being in the likeness of man, experience all what human undergoes, feel hungry, tired, etc., tempted but overcame. Truly man in nature.
Sorry, if you mean my no. 1 question as apostle Paul's premise? Yes, human nature.

Regarding the PDF you've sent, I've just lightly examined it, because as you've said, "it very difficult to have a Bible-based conversation on the subject." To me it means unBiblical.

Jesus is God from the beginning, and has not on anyway just developed God's character. (John 1:18)

But still you have not answered those two simple similar phrases by honest logic.

It seems you’re not interested in exploring the foundation of Paul’s thoughts in Philippians.

An example....I've led you to Isaiah, but you want to lead me to your manmade creeds. Forcing your own interpretation on the Word of God will not lead you to His Wisdom! I can see that I'm trying to guide you towards the truth, but the introduction of terms like "incarnation" and other dogma language has left you stuck, confined by the creeds.

If you have the time, I encourage you to study the foundation of Paul’s thoughts from Isaiah. This will require you to open your Bible and read the Servant Prophecies, which will help you better understand and discuss the answers to your questions. Clearly, the Trinity cannot provide that insight for you.

When you are ready let me know.

F2F

I believe you misunderstand Paul's thoughts.
Easy to honestly answer the no.1 question, and I believe on what you've said, (correct me if am wrong) that, "it's very difficult to have a Bible-based conversation on the subject." I believe referring to no.2 question.
The bible is clear, Jesus is God. (John 1:18)
He was in the beginning with the Father, and God was the Word.(John 1:1)
The Word became flesh and dwelt among us. Human in nature. (John 1:14)
For in Jesus dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. God in nature.(Col 2:9)
These are not my words, these are Bible verses and Bible lexicon.
Would apostle Paul dispute those texts? He wrote Colossians.

(Col 2:9) Louw and Nida Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament defined word "Godhead" with Strong No.2320, in Greek "theotes" as the nature or state of being God, divine nature, divine being, etc.

NT:2320 theotes
a 'God,' 12.1) the nature or state of being God - 'deity, divine nature, divine being.
(from Greek-English Lexicon Based on Semantic Domain. Copyright © 1988 United Bible Societies, New York. Used by permission.)

Once the creed-based formula takes hold of a believer's mind, it becomes nearly impossible for them to see beyond it – this is something you experience every time you write or read the Bible (sad).

Let me give you an example.

For a moment, let’s assume Jesus is God.

Why would Jesus need to learn? Can your God learn? If you are thinking of God emptying Himself the question is why? Why would he pretend to be something He is not!

“And Jesus grew in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and man.” – Luke 2:52

If we go with your perspective, it makes sense why Jesus would need to grow in favor with man (since he’s the Son of Man), but how does God grow in favor with God? It makes sense for the Son of God would need to grow in favor with God, but it’s impossible for God to need favor from Himself. He is not Self Serving!

Let’s take this a step further.

Why would God remove Wisdom from Himself - grow that wisdom over time but leave out critical information that only God knows?

Matthew 24:36. ESV "But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only"

Can you explain how and why it would be necessary for Jesus to not know this basic information?

In your previous reply, you make bold statements about Jesus being God, but you don't have the God in Jesus to declare Him as such. Instead, you have a servant man, born of a woman, with our condemned nature, one who experienced the sting of sin, which is death, and one who was under the dominion of death throughout his life.

- God cannot be held under deaths dominion in any way shape or form
- God cannot die to sin at all!
- God cannot dwell in anything which is unclean especially not death!
- God cannot be weak!

Let me ask you a question and if you can answer it correctly it will show me you are a genuine seeker of truth.

2 Corinthians 13:4 "For he (Jesus) was crucified in weakness, but lives by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, but we will live with him by the power of God toward you."

Explain in what way do you share in Christs weakness? Explain how that weakness was dealt with on the cross and how it's been dealt with in you.

What I'm doing here Capbook is testing your understanding to see if your god-man theology can reveal the true Christ. I know it cannot, but you need to see that for yourself.

F2F

All these issues will be proven if you have an honest and explicit answer to the no.2 question I've presented.
But you have not. Sad.

All you've stated as Jesus grew in wisdom, have weaknesses no knowledge of some and etc. - as a Son of man.
As Son of God and God, that doesn't mean that He is the Father.

As to the two nature of Jesus, we might go back to the logic you missed to answer honestly and explicitly.
1. Jesus as the Son of man, as His mother is human. Is He man or not?
2. Jesus as the Son of God, as His Father is God. Is He God or not? Sad to know, no answer yet.

The Bible clearly state that Jesus is the only-begotten God, the only God, God the only Son and etc.(John 1:18)
While opposition are only personal interpretation of the verses but does not say the opposite, "Jesus is not God."

[face2face]

[Replying to Capbook in post #68]

That last reply missed the mark and didn’t address the previous four replies properly.

It seems like you’re losing ground in this discussion, if not already lost it.

Please go back and focus on the exposition, taking care to read it in context and understand Paul’s reasoning. Remember, it’s not about creeds written 300 years later, but the principles that were written centuries before!

F2F

[face2face]

By your own hand you proved not to be a genuine seeker of truth.

2 Corinthians 13:4 "For he (Jesus) was crucified in weakness, but lives by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, but we will live with him by the power of God toward you."

How was Jesus crucified in weakness?
Explain in what way do you share in Christs weakness?
Explain how that weakness was dealt with on the cross and how it's been dealt with in you.

The answers are in the Word if you look

F2F