What happens to us when we die?

[placebofactor]

The Bible teaches that we mortals consist of a body, a soul, and a spirit.
1 Thessalonians 5:23, “Your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless.”
Hebrews 4:12, For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow,” = man’s flesh.

What happens to the physical body at death?
Ecclesiastes 12:7, “Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was…”
Genesis 3:19, “For dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.”

What Happens to the Spirit at Death?
Ecclesiastes 12:7, “The spirit shall return unto God who gave it.”
Luke 23:46, Jesus said, “Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit.”
James 2:26, “For as the body without the spirit is dead.”

What happens to the soul at death?
Revelation 6:9, “I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain.”
Genesis 35:18, “And it came to pass, as her soul was in departing (for she died).”
Matthew 10:28, “Fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.”

And what distinguishes the soul from the spirit?
The soul and the spirit are distinguished in Scripture as two different aspects of our immaterial nature, closely connected yet serving different functions. The distinction is subtle, but the Bible gives enough clarity to outline their roles. It is our self, our mind, emotions, and will, while the spirit is the part of us that is God-aware and capable of communion with Him. This distinction appears repeatedly.

The soul refers to your individual life and identity. It expresses emotion, desire, personality, and decision-making. It’s the seat of your mind, will, and emotions. It experiences sorrow, joy, despair, longing, and hope. Yet at times, in certain contexts, it will refer to the whole person.

What is the Spirit? It’s the God-conscious part of a person. It’s the faculty that enables worship, intuition, and spiritual understanding. It is the part of us that can be born again and made alive by the Holy Spirit, and it’s where God’s Holy Spirit bears witness with your spirit, Romans 8:16.

Some teach that death is a state of nonexistence, a state of complete unconsciousness, and that the dead cannot do anything, cannot feel anything, and no longer have any thoughts.

Your thoughts.

[William]

[Replying to placebofactor in post #10]

Yes. There is evidence in many places attesting to continuation of the individual human consciousness.

I am often reminded of the revelations book when studying other testimonies from NDE, astral projection, lucid dreaming and chemical induced trips.

I once read the book out loud. When I was a younger lad.

[placebofactor]

[Replying to William in post #11]

The Watchtower teaches that mortals are composed of a physical body, having no soul or spirit. They claim that when the body dies, it returns to the dust of the ground, and nothing remains of that person.
Question: Concerning resurrection, eternity, and judgment, what are the consequences of this teaching?

If someone teaches that we have no soul or spirit and simply cease to exist at death, then that teaching destroys the biblical doctrines of resurrection, eternity, and judgment, because Scripture requires a continuing person whom God raises, judges, and assigns to their everlasting destiny.

The Bible teaches that the same person who dies continues to exist and is later raised. Jesus said, Matthew 22:32, “God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.” Paul then taught that believers who die are, 1 Corinthians 5:8, “Absent from the body… present with the Lord.”

So, if a person ceases to exist, then there is no one left to resurrect. Resurrection then becomes re-creation, not raising the dead. This contradicts 1 Corinthians 15:52, “The dead shall be raised incorruptible.” Therefore, common sense tells us that a non-existent person cannot be “raised,” therefore, Judgment becomes meaningless. So, if nothing remains of a person after death, they cannot appear before God, their works cannot be judged, and accountability is not possible.

But the Jehovah’s Witnesses claim that they will be resurrected because in the mind of God is their DNA. Because they claim they will be resurrected because their DNA exists in the mind of God, let me ask, does that claim match what the Bible teaches? Scripture teaches that a real, conscious person continues after death, not merely a genetic blueprint.

The Scriptures teach a continuing soul and spirit, not just DNA. We are not reduced to physical information. Scripture says, Ecclesiastes 12:7, “The spirit shall return unto God who gave it.”
And Matthew 10:28, “Fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul.” Now, if the soul cannot be killed, then resurrection is not based on DNA stored in God’s mind.
Your thoughts:

[William]

[Replying to placebofactor in post #12]

Your thoughts:

I have expressed these already.

The problems you are focused on are simply surface layers. The real problem with the JW belief system is what I have already mentioned. "Demons all the way down".

[OneJack]

Some teach that death is a state of nonexistence, a state of complete unconsciousness, and that the dead cannot do anything, cannot feel anything, and no longer have any thoughts.

Your thoughts.

Yes, that is confirmed by the scriptures:

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing... (Ecclesiastes 9:5)

A. BIBLICAL ACCOUNT

19. There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20 At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21 and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

22 “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24 So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’

25 “But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26 And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’

27 “He answered, ‘Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my family, 28 for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’

29 “Abraham replied, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.’

30 “‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.’

31 “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.’”

B. GODLICAL ACCOUNT

What happens to people when they die?
***There are two types of death: sudden death and gradual death. When someone is about to die, angels or deceased loved ones come to escort them. They are placed in a certain place until Judgment Day.

[tam]

Peace to you,

[Replying to placebofactor in post #1]

Some teach that death is a state of nonexistence, a state of complete unconsciousness, and that the dead cannot do anything, cannot feel anything, and no longer have any thoughts.

Non-existence and sleep are two very different things.

Sleep is how Christ described Lazarus after he had died. John 11:11
Sleep is also how Paul described death. 1Thess 4:13, 14; 1Corinth 15:51
This is also how death was described to Daniel. Daniel 12:2


A person who sleeps does not cease to exist. The dead are sleeping (they are conscious of nothing)... but they still exist. We are not just these physical/clay vessels. We are spirit (the person we truly are.)

The one who wakes those who are asleep is Christ Jaheshua:

These things said he: and after that he saith to them, Our friend Lazarus is asleep; but I go to waken him up. John 11:11

Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt. Daniel 12:2

Do not be amazed at this, for the hour is coming when all who are in their graves will hear His voice / and come out—those who have done good to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil to the resurrection of judgment. John 5:28, 29


He is the Resurrection and the Life.

**

There are also two resurrections.

The first resurrection is for those who are in Christ who have died (this occurs at His coming, at the start of the thousand years.)
The second resurrection is the resurrection of the dead - for all others who have died (this occurs at the end of the thousand years.)

Rev 20:4-6, 13


Peace again to you!

[OneJack]

[Replying to tam in post #15]

There are also two resurrections.

The first resurrection is for those who are in Christ who have died (this occurs at His coming, at the start of the thousand years.)
The second resurrection is the resurrection of the dead - for all others who have died (this occurs at the end of the thousand years.)

Rev 20:4-6, 13

The Lord taught us the following details of the Judgment Day, to wit:

The events of Judgment will be terrifying. Everything we see in the universe will be destroyed and melt like ice. All planets, including the world, will explode and collapse. Nothing will remain standing, and everything will be destroyed. All creatures that have died, whether human, animal, or any living thing, will be resurrected. Those who are alive when Judgment comes will witness the terrifying fate of all. After a few seconds of resurrection, everyone will die again, including those who were brought back to life from their graves. And everyone will die! Then, all will be judged. Those who are not saved will be cast into a sea of fire, while those who are saved will be in eternal paradise, enjoying peace with God.

[placebofactor]

[Replying to tam in post #15]

There are also two resurrections.

The first resurrection is for those who are in Christ who have died (this occurs at His coming, at the start of the thousand years.)
The second resurrection is the resurrection of the dead - for all others who have died (this occurs at the end of the thousand years.)

Rev 20:4-6, 13

The Lord taught us the following details of the Judgment Day, to wit:

The events of Judgment will be terrifying. Everything we see in the universe will be destroyed and melt like ice. All planets, including the world, will explode and collapse. Nothing will remain standing, and everything will be destroyed. All creatures that have died, whether human, animal, or any living thing, will be resurrected. Those who are alive when Judgment comes will witness the terrifying fate of all. After a few seconds of resurrection, everyone will die again, including those who were brought back to life from their graves. And everyone will die! Then, all will be judged. Those who are not saved will be cast into a sea of fire, while those who are saved will be in eternal paradise, enjoying peace with God.

OneJack, did you get the above information from voices or visions? One thing I do know, you didn't get it from the Bible. You wrote, "After a few seconds of resurrection, everyone will die again, including those who were brought back to life from their graves. And everyone will die![/b] Then, all will be judged."

Normally, I would quote a few verses from the Bible that would bury your words, but no need because you reject the scriptures in every way.

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to tam in post #15]

@tam, consider the possibility that the first resurrection of Revelation 20 is the new birth that God gives all true believers in this life and that, therefore, the "1,000 years" are symbolic for the complete time between Jesus' first and second comings. Furthermore, deceased Christians are reigning with Christ now:

Rev 20:4  Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 
Rev 20:5  The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 
Rev 20:6  Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years. 

The Apostle Paul makes that meaning possible by saying that believers are "raised":

Col 3:1  If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. 

[tam]

Peace to you,

[Replying to tam in post #15]

There are also two resurrections.

The first resurrection is for those who are in Christ who have died (this occurs at His coming, at the start of the thousand years.)
The second resurrection is the resurrection of the dead - for all others who have died (this occurs at the end of the thousand years.)

Rev 20:4-6, 13

The Lord taught us the following details of the Judgment Day, to wit:

The events of Judgment will be terrifying.

Maybe (for some.)

But certainly not for anyone in Christ. Christ tells us not to be afraid, does He not?

Everything we see in the universe will be destroyed and melt like ice. All planets, including the world, will explode and collapse. Nothing will remain standing, and everything will be destroyed.

What would be the point of this?

(Also, melting like ice doesn't sound the same as exploding and collapsing.)

All creatures that have died, whether human, animal, or any living thing, will be resurrected.

Yes, I do know from my Lord that animals are also resurrected.

Those who are alive when Judgment comes will witness the terrifying fate of all. After a few seconds of resurrection, everyone will die again, including those who were brought back to life from their graves. And everyone will die!

This, however, is untrue.

Consider a couple things:

1 - what is the point of being resurrected for a few seconds and then dying again? And where is love in this?
2 - this is not what John saw in the revelation that Christ gave him.
3 - Christ does not teach this. In fact, He teaches that some will never die. John 11:26 I think most (myself included at one point) mistake John 11:26 to be 'metaphorical', but as a dear sister of mine once shared, if we are in Christ and we die, we will yet live (because of the resurrection). And if we are in Christ, and are alive (at His return), we will never die.

“I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in Me will live, even though he dies. 26And everyone who lives and believes in Me will never die. Do you believe this?"

Paul also understood this:

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise. 17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

Then, all will be judged.

This is also incorrect. Not all will be judged.

Christians were already resurrected to Life. There is no judgment for any in Christ because His blood covers us and we are forgiven in Him. There is no judgment and death has no hold on anyone in Christ. Like how death passed over the houses that had the blood of the lamb on them (in Egypt with Israel.) Christ is the true Lamb of God. His blood covers us. He is our High Priest and He intercedes on our behalf. We have forgiveness in Him not because we are good, but because He is the Righteous One and He receives what HE asks for, from His Father.

Those who are not saved will be cast into a sea of fire, while those who are saved will be in eternal paradise, enjoying peace with God.

Yes, but this is the second resurrection. All in Christ received the first resurrection and there is no judgment for these ones.


Peace again.

[tam]

Peace to you Bruce,

[Replying to tam in post #15]

@tam, consider the possibility that the first resurrection of Revelation 20 is the new birth that God gives all true believers in this life and that, therefore, the "1,000 years" are symbolic for the complete time between Jesus' first and second comings. Futhermore, deceased Christians are reigning with Christ now:

Rev 20:4  Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 
Rev 20:5  The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 
Rev 20:6  Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years. 

The Apostle Paul makes that meaning possible by saying that believers are "raised":

Col 3:1  If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. 

I understand that some believe this. However, the Adversary (the one called Satan) has not yet been imprisoned in the Abyss. This is supposed to happen at the start of the thousand years.

He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. 3 He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time.

But Satan is still roaming about on the earth, deceiving the nations.

**

Consider also this verse from your post:

Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 

If the first resurrection of Revelation 20 is the 'new birth that God gives to all believers', why would the verse IN Revelation say that those who were beheaded 'came to life' and reigned for a thousand years.

Wouldn't they have already been alive, if the first resurrection of Revelation 20 is the 'new birth'?


Peace again to you.