I received an email today, posted below, and thought it would make a good topic for debate. I cannot vouch for the facts posted therein and it provided no source for the contents. This was one of those emails that people forward to everyone in their address book (which I hate), most of which are urban legend and pure bunk. What do you think?
NETANYAHU AT HIS BEST
Even those who aren’t particularly sympathetic to Israel ’s Benjamin Netanyahu, could get a good measure of satisfaction from this interview with British Television during the retaliation against Hamas’ shelling of Israel .
The interviewer asked him: “How come so many more Palestinians have been killed in this conflict than Israelis?�
Netanyahu: “Are you sure that you want to start asking in that direction?�
Interviewer: Why not?
Netanyahu: “Because in World War II more Germans were killed than British and Americans combined, but there is no doubt in anyone’s mind that the war was caused by Germany ’s aggression. And in response to the German blitz on London , the British wiped out the entire city of Dresden , burning to death more German civilians than the number of people killed in Hiroshima … Moreover, I could remind you that in 1944, when the R.A.F. tried to bomb the Gestapo Headquarters in Copenhagen , some of the bombs missed their target and fell on a Danish children’s hospital, killing 83 little children. Perhaps you have another question?�
Apparently, Benjamin Netanyahu gave another interview and was asked about Israel ’s occupation of Arab lands. His response was, “It’s our land�. The reporter was stunned – read below “It’s our land…� It’s important information since we don’t get fair and accurate reporting from the media and facts tend to get lost in the jumble of daily events.
“Crash Course on the Arab-Israeli Conflict.�
Here are overlooked facts in the current & past Middle East situation:
BRIEF FACTS ON THE ISRAELI CONFLICT TODAY
1. Nationhood and Jerusalem : Israel became a nation in 1312 BC, two thousand (2000) years before the rise of Islam.
2… Arab refugees in Israel began identifying themselves as part of a Palestinian people in 1967, two decades after the establishment of the modern State of Israel.
3. Since the Jewish conquest in 1272 BC, the Jews have had dominion over the land for one thousand (1000) years with a continuous presence in the land for the past 3,300 years.
4. The only Arab dominion since the conquest in 635 lasted no more than 22 years.
5. For over 3,300 years, Jerusalem has been the Jewish capital. Jerusalem has never been the capital of any Arab or Muslim entity. Even when the Jordanians occupied Jerusalem , they never sought to make it their capital, and Arab leaders did not come to visit.
6. Jerusalem is mentioned over 700 times in Tanach, the Jewish Holy Scriptures. Jerusalem is not mentioned even once in the Quran.
7. King David founded the city of Jerusalem . Mohammed never came to Jerusalem .
8. Jews pray facing Jerusalem. Muslims pray with their backs toward Jerusalem .
9. Arab and Jewish Refugees: in 1948 the Arab refugees were encouraged to leave Israel by Arab leaders promising to purge the land of Jews . Sixty-eight percent left (many in fear of retaliation by their own brethren, the Arabs), without ever seeing an Israeli soldier. The ones who stayed were afforded the same peace, civility, and citizenship rights as everyone else.
10. The Jewish refugees were forced to flee from Arab lands due to Arab brutality, persecution and pogroms.
11. The number of Arab refugees who left Israel in 1948 is estimated to be around 630,000. The number of Jewish refugees from Arab lands is estimated to be the same.
12. Arab refugees were INTENTIONALLY not absorbed or integrated into the Arab lands to which they fled, despite the vast Arab territory. Out of the 100,000,000 refugees since World War II, theirs is the only refugee group in the world that has never been absorbed or integrated into their own people’s lands. Jewish refugees were completely absorbed into Israel , a country no larger than the state of New Jersey …
13. The Arab-Israeli Conflict: the Arabs are represented by eight separate nations, not including the Palestinians. There is only one Jewish nation. The Arab nations initiated all five wars and lost. Israel defended itself each time and won.
14. The PLO’s Charter still calls for the destruction of the State of Israel. Israel has given the Palestinians most of the West Bank land, autonomy under the Palestinian Authority, and has supplied them.
15. Under Jordanian rule, Jewish holy sites were desecrated and the Jews were denied access to places of worship. Under Israeli rule, all Muslim and Christian sites have been preserved and made accessible to people of all faiths.
16. The UN Record on Israel and the Arabs: of the 175 Security Council resolutions passed before 1990, 97 were directed against Israel .
17. Of the 690 General Assembly resolutions voted on before 1990, 429 were directed against Israel .
18. The UN was silent while 58 Jerusalem synagogues were destroyed by the Jordanians.
19. The UN was silent while the Jordanians systematically desecrated the ancient Jewish cemetery on the Mount of Olives .
20. The UN was silent while the Jordanians enforced an apartheid-like a policy of preventing Jews from visiting the Temple Mount and the Western Wall.
Questions for debate:
1) Is this revisionist history or merely anti-Arab propaganda?
2) Do Palestinians have a right to the Gaza Strip and the West Bank, or does it rightfully belong to Israel?
Acts 13:48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed.
And here is a list of Arab and Palestinian and Muslim peace organizations dedicated to ending terrorism:
You can't really think I didn't know about these links . The question still stand Israel and Palestine - Whose land is it? And everyone knows Israel out right took the land from the Paletine and you fail to tell the truth . For Some Reson You Expect people to accept your Story over the truth . let me enlighten you about some thing ok Israel have also have an organization that Attack anyone who speak the truth about them and what they're doing . And this is a another know fact . but that a subject for another post . the different between you and I is I can accept the truth no matter what it is , But you can't , You rather see the truth as a lie . but yet you want people to be open minded , When you can't be truthful with yourself . have a nice day ...
Musaa wrote:
You can't really think I didn't know about these links . The question still stand Israel and Palestine - Whose land is it? And everyone knows Israel out right took the land from the Paletine and you fail to tell the truth .
That is a personal attack and an insult, and also entails ignoring and refusing to address multiple posts above.
For Some Reson You Expect people to accept your Story over the truth . let me enlighten you about some thing ok Israel have also have an organization that Attack anyone who speak the truth about them and what they're doing . And this is a another know fact . but that a subject for another post .
No, it's a subject for this one; you have now made a claim, and according to the rules of this forum, you are expected to back it up with facts and rational arguments. Please do so. If you can't prove it, retract it.
the different between you and I is I can accept the truth no matter what it is , But you can't , You rather see the truth as a lie . but yet you want people to be open minded , When you can't be truthful with yourself . have a nice day ...
Another personal attack and insult. You have yet to post anything to back up what you say, and your posts consist largely of ad hominems and baseless insults.
Musaa wrote:
You can't really think I didn't know about these links . The question still stand Israel and Palestine - Whose land is it? And everyone knows Israel out right took the land from the Paletine and you fail to tell the truth . For Some Reson You Expect people to accept your Story over the truth . let me enlighten you about some thing ok Israel have also have an organization that Attack anyone who speak the truth about them and what they're doing . And this is a another know fact . but that a subject for another post . the different between you and I is I can accept the truth no matter what it is , But you can't , You rather see the truth as a lie . but yet you want people to be open minded , When you can't be truthful with yourself . have a nice day ...
Moderator formal warning
These would be considered personal attacks and unsubstantiated comments.
Please make sure you fully review the rules and abide by them.
Also, make sure you quote properly so that people do not confuse what you or others are writing.
Musaa wrote:
You can't really think I didn't know about these links . The question still stand Israel and Palestine - Whose land is it? And everyone knows Israel out right took the land from the Paletine and you fail to tell the truth . For Some Reson You Expect people to accept your Story over the truth . let me enlighten you about some thing ok Israel have also have an organization that Attack anyone who speak the truth about them and what they're doing . And this is a another know fact . but that a subject for another post . the different between you and I is I can accept the truth no matter what it is , But you can't , You rather see the truth as a lie . but yet you want people to be open minded , When you can't be truthful with yourself . have a nice day ...
Moderator formal warning
These would be considered personal attacks and unsubstantiated comments.
Please make sure you fully review the rules and abide by them.
Also, make sure you quote properly so that people do not confuse what you or others are writing.
Oh I see when he / she make personal Attacks On Other in his post it not considered a personal because hew jewish ok . That his / her problem they think they are better then others .
Musaa wrote:
You can't really think I didn't know about these links . The question still stand Israel and Palestine - Whose land is it? And everyone knows Israel out right took the land from the Paletine and you fail to tell the truth . For Some Reson You Expect people to accept your Story over the truth . let me enlighten you about some thing ok Israel have also have an organization that Attack anyone who speak the truth about them and what they're doing . And this is a another know fact . but that a subject for another post . the different between you and I is I can accept the truth no matter what it is , But you can't , You rather see the truth as a lie . but yet you want people to be open minded , When you can't be truthful with yourself . have a nice day ...
Moderator formal warning
These would be considered personal attacks and unsubstantiated comments.
Please make sure you fully review the rules and abide by them.
Also, make sure you quote properly so that people do not confuse what you or others are writing.
Oh I see when he / she make personal Attacks On Other in his post it not considered a personal because hew jewish ok . That his / her problem they think they are better then others .
And the true colors come out at last.
For the record; I have personally attacked no one. I have answered questions and asked questions, posted facts, documented proof of those facts with links to various sources, and nothing more.
Musaa wrote:
You can't really think I didn't know about these links . The question still stand Israel and Palestine - Whose land is it? And everyone knows Israel out right took the land from the Paletine and you fail to tell the truth . For Some Reson You Expect people to accept your Story over the truth . let me enlighten you about some thing ok Israel have also have an organization that Attack anyone who speak the truth about them and what they're doing . And this is a another know fact . but that a subject for another post . the different between you and I is I can accept the truth no matter what it is , But you can't , You rather see the truth as a lie . but yet you want people to be open minded , When you can't be truthful with yourself . have a nice day ...
Moderator formal warning
These would be considered personal attacks and unsubstantiated comments.
Please make sure you fully review the rules and abide by them.
Also, make sure you quote properly so that people do not confuse what you or others are writing.
Oh I see when he / she make personal Attacks On Other in his post it not considered a personal because hew jewish ok . That his / her problem they think they are better then others .
And the true colors come out at last.
For the record; I have personally attacked no one. I have answered questions and asked questions, posted facts, documented proof of those facts with links to various sources, and nothing more.
'Bye now. Have a lovely day.
YOU GOD DAM LIARRRRRRRR YOU LIKE TO THROW ROCKS AND HIDE YOUR HANDS YOU 'RE AND A RAT . BY THE WAY I READ SOME OF YOU POST AND YOU GET A FREE PASS BECAUSE YOUR SOCALLED JEW AND I MEAN SOCALL.
Cnorman; i knows how it is to be stereotyped for the bad reasons; just ignore him.
There is an old saying; when you wrestle with a pig you both get dirty; but the pig enjoys it.
So don't bother with him.
Do the people think that they will be left to say, "We believe" without being put to the test?
We have tested those before them, for GOD must distinguish those who are truthful, and He must expose the liars.
(Quran 29:2-3)
Well, I've seen anti-Semitism, but this takes the cake. Unbelievable.
Acts 13:48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed.
Days After Calling Israeli Blockade of Gaza “A Crime Against Humanity,� UN Human Rights Investigator Richard Falk Detained, Expelled from Israel
The United Nations human rights chief Navi Pillay has accused Israel of “unprecedented and deeply regrettable� treatment of UN human rights investigator Richard Falk. Falk was deported from Israel Monday after being detained at Tel Aviv’s Ben Gurion Airport for twenty hours. Falk’s detention and expulsion came days after he condemned Israel’s blockade of Gaza as a “flagrant and massive violation of international humanitarian law� and “Crime Against Humanity.� We speak to Falk about his detention and expulsion from Israel
Richard Falk, UN special rapporteur on human rights in the Palestinian Territories. He is professor emeritus of international law at Princeton University and the author of more than fifty books on war, human rights and international law, including Achieving Human Rights; Crimes of War: Iraq, with Irene Gendzier; and Israel-Palestine on Record: How the New York Times Misreports Conflict in the Middle East, with Howard Friel.
AMY GOODMAN: The United Nations human rights chief Navi Pillay accused Israel Tuesday of “unprecedented and deeply regrettable� treatment of UN human rights investigator Richard Falk. Falk was deported from Israel Monday after being detained at Tel Aviv’s Ben Gurion Airport for twenty hours. He was appointed the special rapporteur on human rights in the Palestinian territories earlier this year but was denied entry because of what Israel called his “highly politicized views.�
Israeli Foreign Ministry spokesperson Yigal Palmor said Falk “does not try to advance human rights, but instead comes with his conclusions ready and those conclusions are of course extreme methodic criticism of Israel and only of Israel,� he said. Israel’s Foreign Ministry also accused Falk of “legitimizing Hamas terrorism and drawing shameful comparisons to the Holocaust.�
The professor emeritus of international law at Princeton University, Richard Falk, issued a statement last week titled “Gaza: Silence is not an option� that condemned Israel’s blockade of Gaza as a “flagrant and massive violation of international humanitarian law.� He urged the UN to invoke “the agreed norm of a responsibility to protect a civilian population being collectively punished by policies that amount to a Crime Against Humanity." Falk also called for an International Criminal Court investigation of Israeli military and civilian officials for potential prosecution.
Richard Falk is now back at home in California. He joins me now on the telephone.
Welcome to Democracy Now!, Professor Falk. Talk about what happened. When did you try to get into Israel and Gaza?
RICHARD FALK: Amy, it was about three days ago, and I came with a security person and an assistant from Geneva. They had received visas ensuring them entry, which were honored when we arrived at Ben Gurion Airport, and because they received visas and knew that I was coming, we assumed there’d be no problem with my entry, because they had ample indication—in fact, formal notification—of my itinerary. So it remains strange why they didn’t either inform Geneva, where the Human Rights Council and the Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights is located, or just deny them visas, which would have been a signal of their intention. So, somehow or other, it appears that they wanted this incident to occur.
And when I arrived, they questioned me first in the passport area and then led me, after long delays, from one place to another until the representative of the Ministry of Interior denied me entry and placed me in this detention facility prior to being expelled on the plane that took me back here to California.
AMY GOODMAN: And in that twenty-hour period, were they questioning you?
RICHARD FALK: No, they didn’t—oddly, again, they didn’t seem particularly interested in either exploring my views or objecting to them or doing anything substantive. They just put me in this detention facility, which is located, I think, on the periphery of the airport area and is a very coercive little experience, because I was in with five other people in a tiny room where there was barely space to stand, and it was—we were locked in this room and treated not terribly, but unpleasantly. I would put it that way. The others were there for technical infractions of immigration law of one reason or another, and most of them were waiting for lawyers. Actually, we had good camaraderie, so that was one of the sort of pleasant aspects of a generally unpleasant experience.
AMY GOODMAN: Can you talk about what your plan was in getting into Gaza and your response to the Israeli Foreign Ministry spokesperson, Yigal Palmor, saying that you don’t “try to advance human rights, but instead comes with his conclusions ready and those conclusions are of course extreme methodic criticism of Israel and only of Israel" and the Israel Foreign Ministry also accusing you of “legitimizing Hamas terrorism and drawing shameful comparisons to the Holocaust.�
RICHARD FALK: Well, I think they’re all, first of all, distortions of my real views and, secondly, part of a much wider and what I would regard as insidious pattern of trying to shift the attention from their objections to the person, rather than their argument with the facts that are the basis of mine or other people’s assessment of the situation. I think I could stand very well behind the views that are contained in my report and would gladly engage in any kind of discussion of those views. But Israel has been pursuing what I call a politics of opaqueness, trying to make the realities of the occupation as obscure as possible and as speculative as possible. They’ve kept those who are knowledgeable inside Gaza from leaving to attend international conferences—Raji Sourani, for instance, the head of the Human Rights Centre, who had previously been allowed to attend international conferences and is a distinguished recipient of the Kennedy Center’s Human Rights Award. So they’ve tried to keep people in who know something about the reality of the occupation and then try to keep people out, such as myself, who could report credibly on what is happening inside, and shifting that argument then to my qualifications.
Let me come to these issues that you appropriately raised. First of all, I never compared the reality of what is going on in Gaza to the Holocaust. What I did say was that the kinds of collective punishment that are being imposed on the entire people of Gaza have a resemblance to collective punishment that was imposed by the Nazis in Germany and that if this kind of circumstance is allowed to persist, it could produce a holocaust. I never suggested that what was happening was a holocaust. Same thing with the existence of crimes against humanity. I merely tried to characterize the facts as I understood them to involve this kind of massive collective punishment of every man, woman and child, regardless of their activities, as being victimized by a set of policies summarized as a siege or blockade, where some of the effects are now very well established, such as 46 percent of Gazan children are suffering from acute anemia. Very stark reality. More than 80 percent are living under the level of poverty.
So I return to the main point. I think that my whole life has been devoted, I think, to trying to tell the truth about facts that are often unpleasant, unpleasant for me to address. I really have sought, in relation to the Israel-Palestine conflict, peace and justice for both peoples and have always had that view that it was possible, desirable and necessary. And that’s the basis on which I’ve acted throughout this period as special rapporteur for the UN.
AMY GOODMAN: Professor Falk, the New York Times had a piece called “UN Rights Investigator Expelled by Israel,� not exactly what I would call sympathetic to you. I just wanted to read one quote from that article. It says, Richard Falk “has compared Israel’s treatment of the Palestinians to Nazi atrocities and has called for more serious examination of the conspiracy theories surrounding the Sept. 11 attacks. Pointing to discrepancies between the official version of events and other versions, he recently wrote that ‘only willful ignorance can maintain that the 9/11 narrative should be treated as a closed book.’� Your response?
RICHARD FALK: Yeah. Well, that’s part of this whole effort to shift the focus to me and away from the reality and, at the same time, to somehow paint me as some kind of conspiracy person or theorist, which is absolutely untrue. What is true is that I wrote the forward to the original book of David Griffin, a longtime friend of mine, which is the most prominent challenge to the validity of the official version of 9/11, and I continue to hold the view that the 9/11 Commission did not adequately address the difficult questions about what happened on 9/11 that he raised. But I haven’t ever and do not now endorse any kind of conspiracy theory. All I think that is true is that the American people and the world deserve a fuller and more credible investigation of those events.
AMY GOODMAN: In December of 2006, Israel blocked the South African Archbishop and Nobel laureate Desmond Tutu from investigating the killing of nineteen Palestinians in Gaza. He had a UN mandate to head a fact-finding mission to Gaza, like you did, but Israeli officials failed to grant him the necessary travel visas, saying the mission, quote, “advances a biased anti-Israel agenda.�
ARCHBISHOP DESMOND TUTU: We find the lack of cooperation by the Israeli government very distressing, as well as its failure to allow the mission timely passage to Israel. This is a time in our history that neither allows for indifference to the plight of those suffering nor a refusal to search for a solution to the present crisis in the region.
AMY GOODMAN: I asked the Archbishop, Archbishop Tutu, about this when I interviewed him a few weeks ago.
AMY GOODMAN: You were blocked from going into Gaza in 2006, leading a UN delegation there after the killing of a number of Palestinians.
ARCHBISHOP DESMOND TUTU: Yeah.
AMY GOODMAN: What do you think has to be done now with the Middle East specifically, with Israel and the occupation?
ARCHBISHOP DESMOND TUTU: There’s been some very interesting moves with the outgoing prime minister suggesting that Israel has to consider very seriously the proposal of going back to the boundaries of 1967. That’s a very important initiative, if that was taken.
I think that we would have to move very quickly to lifting the embargo. The suffering is unacceptable. It’s totally unacceptable. It doesn’t promote the security of Israel or any other part of that very volatile region.
AMY GOODMAN: That’s Archbishop Desmond Tutu of South Africa just a few weeks ago here in New York. Of course, it was not only Tutu, not only you, Professor Falk, but news organizations writing a letter of protest to the Israeli prime minister—CNN, BBC, Reuters, New York Times, AP—for not being allowed into Gaza. What are you calling for right now, as you return home having been deported from Israel?
RICHARD FALK: Well, mainly, access for myself. I think my resignation would be giving in to Israel’s unreasonable behavior and, as I say, part of this broader pattern that Archbishop Tutu’s exclusion further confirms.
And, incidentally, I didn’t respond to your question about Hamas. That is an absolutely untrue statement. I’ve condemned the firing of rockets at civilians.
AMY GOODMAN: And, Professor Falk, we just have five seconds, so your final comment?
RICHARD FALK: My final comment is that it’s important for the peace of the region that the facts of this occupation are widely known.
AMY GOODMAN: We leave it there. Thank you for joining us.
