Does Christianity discriminate against women?

[Confused]

From Another thread.

Is there any equality offered to women in Christian scripture? Or are we simply "vessels" to be used to carry the seed of men? Does Christian scripture simply discriminate against women or is there some obscure scripture that offers women something equal to men?

[Peg]

That was interesting information. Thanks. It's not exactly pertinent to the CoJCoLDS, though. Comparing the Strangites to the LDS is a bit like comparing Southern Baptists to Catholicism.

Yeah, the Strangites and the LDS are both Mormons, but rather different sects.

Confused yet?

I can honestly say that each religion has so many denominations and break away sects that if I tried to understand them all, I would likely die before I reviewed half of them.

As this is a Christian site and Christianity is the predominant religion in society today, I guess I just want to know what about this religion attracts women as members? What does it offer us? Perhaps that is a question better posed in a separate thread.

If God pointed mankind in a certain direction and told us that by doing this you will inherit everlasting life, it doesnt matter if you are male or female. God offers the same gift of life to both men and women and christianity is the direction they need to take to benefit from Gods offer.

Yes, but doesn't the idea of eternal life subservient both to God and to men take a little of the glitter off of it?

no, why should it??

children are subservient to their parents while they are young, does that detract from the value of the child or the value of the childs life??

everyone is responsible to someone and there is always someone in a higher position to answer to... im sure you dont think that your life is less meaningful because you have to answer to your government and its governing authorities.

[Peg]

Peg wrote:

If God pointed mankind in a certain direction and told us that by doing this you will inherit everlasting life, it doesnt matter if you are male or female.

...and the direction Jesus pointed us was 'toward each other' and to 'look around at the plight our neighbors'; and the manner in which men have treated women in the name of the BibleGod is both despicable and unsupportable under any notion of equality.

what people may do in the name of someone else is not that persons responsiblity...it is those who carried out the act who committed the wrong, not God.

The way men have treated women IS and STILL is despicable... but its not the God of the bible who is to blame. Men need to look at themselves and their attitudes toward women....thats where the problem lies.

[Flail]

Peg wrote:

If God pointed mankind in a certain direction and told us that by doing this you will inherit everlasting life, it doesnt matter if you are male or female.

...and the direction Jesus pointed us was 'toward each other' and to 'look around at the plight our neighbors'; and the manner in which men have treated women in the name of the BibleGod is both despicable and unsupportable under any notion of equality.

what people may do in the name of someone else is not that persons responsiblity...it is those who carried out the act who committed the wrong, not God.

The way men have treated women IS and STILL is despicable... but its not the God of the bible who is to blame. Men need to look at themselves and their attitudes toward women....thats where the problem lies.

As one who doesn't think we even know what a God would be, let alone if one or more of such beings exist, I do not blame nor do I credit 'God' for anything. Men have used and continue to use indoctrinated notions of the BibleGod to discriminate against women both in Christianity and in Islam; but neither of these religions offer anything that is verifiable, coherent or credible to demonstrate that they have anything whatever to do with a 'God'.

[Cain]

Peg wrote:

If God pointed mankind in a certain direction and told us that by doing this you will inherit everlasting life, it doesnt matter if you are male or female.

...and the direction Jesus pointed us was 'toward each other' and to 'look around at the plight our neighbors'; and the manner in which men have treated women in the name of the BibleGod is both despicable and unsupportable under any notion of equality.

what people may do in the name of someone else is not that persons responsiblity...it is those who carried out the act who committed the wrong, not God.

The way men have treated women IS and STILL is despicable... but its not the God of the bible who is to blame. Men need to look at themselves and their attitudes toward women....thats where the problem lies.

Which bible are you talking about? Because the Christian bible contains the Old Testament and in there you will find some of the most despicable actions towards women, mandated by their god.

[Peg]

Peg wrote:

If God pointed mankind in a certain direction and told us that by doing this you will inherit everlasting life, it doesnt matter if you are male or female.

...and the direction Jesus pointed us was 'toward each other' and to 'look around at the plight our neighbors'; and the manner in which men have treated women in the name of the BibleGod is both despicable and unsupportable under any notion of equality.

what people may do in the name of someone else is not that persons responsiblity...it is those who carried out the act who committed the wrong, not God.

The way men have treated women IS and STILL is despicable... but its not the God of the bible who is to blame. Men need to look at themselves and their attitudes toward women....thats where the problem lies.

Which bible are you talking about? Because the Christian bible contains the Old Testament and in there you will find some of the most despicable actions towards women, mandated by their god.

i hear this all the time, yet when i read the OT I can see it for what it is...its a history of people and how people behaved...its not a record of God telling people to behave that way.

If you look at the mosaic laws you'll see that it upholds the rights of women, it does not promote male domination or aggression against women...unlike the Quran which allows a husband to beat his wife if she is displeasing to him... the mosaic law offered women a measure of protection

but just because the people did not always follow Gods laws doesnt mean that God is the instigator of their bad acts. I know there are some terrible accounts in the bible, but those accounts are in there as a record of mans actions and if you examine the accounts properly, you'll find that they are also a record of Gods anger toward people who carried out certain acts. One account that comes to mind is the concubine woman who was raped by a group of benjaminite men...she died as a result and the bengaminite tribe was severely punished for what had occurred. So people can claim that these horrific incidences are in there because God commanded the act or approved of the act, but the accounts dont read like that at all. They show the opposite which is why i dont take any notice of people who want to claim otherwise. I put it down to their own ignorance regarding the OT.

[Fuzzy Dunlop]

i hear this all the time, yet when i read the OT I can see it for what it is...its a history of people and how people behaved...its not a record of God telling people to behave that way.

So when we read, for example, of God instigating his followers to take genocidal vengeance against the Midianites and this then leads to the virgin girls being taken as the spoils of war by the Israelites (Numbers 31), how are you interpreting this as a good way to treat women?

[Peg]

i hear this all the time, yet when i read the OT I can see it for what it is...its a history of people and how people behaved...its not a record of God telling people to behave that way.

So when we read, for example, of God instigating his followers to take genocidal vengeance against the Midianites and this then leads to the virgin girls being taken as the spoils of war by the Israelites (Numbers 31), how are you interpreting this as a good way to treat women?

those women were spared, they were taken as wives and as wives of hebrew men they had the same rights to law and resources as every other hebrew woman.

The wars and the directives to destroy those nations was because those nations were agressors toward Isreal and they were defying Isreals right to take the land promised to Abraham. Apart from that, the nations that God decreed should be wiped out were vile practicers of human sacrifices and their treatment of their own women was far worse then anything you could imagine. So those virgins who were spared were far better off with Isreal then they were among their own tribes. Its very likely that the virgins were sitting on death row waiting to be sacrificed to their midianite gods.....if you want to stand on the side of the midianites, perhaps you would change your mind if you know a bit more about their savage barbaric treatment of women.

[Fuzzy Dunlop]

those women were spared, they were taken as wives and as wives of hebrew men they had the same rights to law and resources as every other hebrew woman.

I think in the modern world such treatment is more accurately described as "kidnapping" and "rape." See Deuteronomy 21:10-14 for the "rights" such women had. They had the right to be held prisoner for a month before having sex with one of the men who killed her family. She did not have the right to say "no thanks."

The wars and the directives to destroy those nations was because those nations were agressors toward Isreal and they were defying Isreals right to take the land promised to Abraham. Apart from that, the nations that God decreed should be wiped out were vile practicers of human sacrifices and their treatment of their own women was far worse then anything you could imagine. So those virgins who were spared were far better off with Isreal then they were among their own tribes. Its very likely that the virgins were sitting on death row waiting to be sacrificed to their midianite gods.....if you want to stand on the side of the midianites, perhaps you would change your mind if you know a bit more about their savage barbaric treatment of women.

I've often said this, but using the OT as a resource for information on the Midianites is like using Mein Kampf as a resource for information on the Jews. Your source might be just a little bit biased.

Do you have evidence for any of these claims?

[JohnPaul]

i hear this all the time, yet when i read the OT I can see it for what it is...its a history of people and how people behaved...its not a record of God telling people to behave that way.

So when we read, for example, of God instigating his followers to take genocidal vengeance against the Midianites and this then leads to the virgin girls being taken as the spoils of war by the Israelites (Numbers 31), how are you interpreting this as a good way to treat women?

those women were spared, they were taken as wives and as wives of hebrew men they had the same rights to law and resources as every other hebrew woman.

The wars and the directives to destroy those nations was because those nations were agressors toward Isreal and they were defying Isreals right to take the land promised to Abraham. Apart from that, the nations that God decreed should be wiped out were vile practicers of human sacrifices and their treatment of their own women was far worse then anything you could imagine. So those virgins who were spared were far better off with Isreal then they were among their own tribes. Its very likely that the virgins were sitting on death row waiting to be sacrificed to their midianite gods.....if you want to stand on the side of the midianites, perhaps you would change your mind if you know a bit more about their savage barbaric treatment of women.

I really do try to listen to Christians with an open mind, but their mentality is often beyond human comprehension. The OT is one of the most evil documents ever written. Do you really believe what you have written above? Do you really understand from your reading that "those nations were agressors toward Isreal"?

The Isrealites were clearly the aggressors and the invaders, and the atrocities committed by them and ordered by their God were beyond belief. The young virgin girls given to the Israelite troops in Numbers 31 were certainly not meant to be wives. The Israelites were specifically forbidden to marry Midianite and Canaanite women because they might cause the Israelites to worship idols. We can only imagine what use was made of the young virgin girls by the Israelite troops in the field, but I don't think the girls survived it very long.

Here are a few verses from Numbers 31:

Numbers 31
1And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

2Avenge the children of Israel of the Midianites: afterward shalt thou be gathered unto thy people.

3And Moses spake unto the people, saying, Arm some of yourselves unto the war, and let them go against the Midianites, and avenge the LORD of Midian.

7And they warred against the Midianites, as the LORD commanded Moses; and they slew all the males.

9And the children of Israel took all the women of Midian captives, and their little ones, and took the spoil of all their cattle, and all their flocks, and all their goods.

10And they burnt all their cities wherein they dwelt, and all their goodly castles, with fire.

11And they took all the spoil, and all the prey, both of men and of beasts.

12And they brought the captives, and the prey, and the spoil, unto Moses, and Eleazar the priest, and unto the congregation of the children of Israel, unto the camp at the plains of Moab, which are by Jordan near Jericho.

17Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.

18But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.

I suspect the young virgin girls wouldn't have been much fun for the soldiers if they were dead!

As I said, I really do try to listen to Christians with an open mind, but enough is enough!!!

John

[Confused]

In our mythology ('mythology' in the academic sense, not meaning 'it ain't true, folks') Eve is the one with the smarts. She saw what had to be done, and since Adam was too chicken, she did it.

So you disagree with Paul?

And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression.

Sorry, folks, but I am not impressed by quotations from Paul. Paul may be the major "interpreter" of Christianity in the New Testament, but any rational unbiased person would have immediately seen that his story of meeting the long-dead Jesus on the road to Damascus, conveniently unobserved by others, and then being "converted" to the new and growiing sect was an obvious lie. Paul was an opportunistic charlatan who used Christianity to make himself a big fish in a little pond and to express his own pathetic misogynistic sexual insecurities and resentments disguised as the "Word" of his conveniently new-found God.

John

I agree paul is thee anti-christ of the bible .

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