Did Mary ever spank Jesus?

bernee51 · Post by **bernee51** » Sat Mar 11, 2006 11:40 pm

In ArtNet, Lewish Kachur writes an article about surrealist art which includes an image of the 1926 Max Ernst painting The Blessed Virgin Chastises the Infant Jesus Before Three Witnesses.

In the painting it will be seen that Mary's halo is in place and Jesus' is lying on the ground. His buttocks are a bright red so he in obviously getting a bit of a hiding. Corporal punishment has a long history in humankind, so would Mary ever have to spank Jesus?

This question raises some interesting conundra. Would it mean that Jesus as a child was not really human if he never misbehaved at all - i.e. didn't lead a normal childhood? How does that differ from sinning if he did misbehave? Was it really OK for her to be in a position of chastising God if Mary did spank Jesus - or even speak to hem harshly? Did she really have that authority over the 'son of god'?

Paveway · Post by **Paveway** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 5:07 am

25Standing near the cross were Jesus' mother, and his mother's sister, Mary (the wife of Clopas), and Mary Magdalene. 26When Jesus saw his mother standing there beside the disciple he loved, he said to her, "Woman, he is your son." 27And he said to this disciple, "She is your mother." And from then on this disciple took her into his home.

John 19.

Also when Jesus was a child he spoke to his mother as "woman".
Jesus was free from sin all his life until he took on teh sin of the world on the cross.

This is a Catholic painting.
Purely Satanic.

Mary never touched Jesus like this, and it isn't mentioned at all in any Historical evidence.
Unless Catholic.

It is disgusting slander

bernee51 · Post by **bernee51** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 6:31 am

Paveway wrote: Mary never touched Jesus like this, and it isn't mentioned at all in any Historical evidence.

Jesus is not mentioned in any historical evidence.

Scrotum · Post by **Scrotum** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 7:11 am

Also when Jesus was a child he spoke to his mother as "woman".
Jesus was free from sin all his life until he took on teh sin of the world on the cross.

Oddly enough, the Bible says that everyone has sinned, this would include our little Jesus, would it not? Else it would be a contradiction, and prove the "none-existence" of your omnipotent God.

Nick Hallandale · Post by **Nick Hallandale** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 10:34 am

Well, I think that Jesus definitely deserved to be punished when he was 12 years old.
Consider the following...Luke 2:41-51 KJV

41Now his parents went to Jerusalem every year at the feast of the passover.

42And when he was twelve years old, they went up to Jerusalem after the custom of the feast.

43And when they had fulfilled the days, as they returned, the child Jesus tarried behind in Jerusalem; and Joseph and his mother knew not of it.

44But they, supposing him to have been in the company, went a day's journey; and they sought him among their kinsfolk and acquaintance.

45And when they found him not, they turned back again to Jerusalem, seeking him.

46And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions.

47And all that heard him were astonished at his understanding and answers.

48And when they saw him, they were amazed: and his mother said unto him, Son, why hast thou thus dealt with us? behold, thy father and I have sought thee sorrowing.

49And he said unto them, How is it that ye sought me? wist ye not that I must be about my Father's business?

50And they understood not the saying which he spake unto them.

51And he went down with them, and came to Nazareth, and was subject unto them: but his mother kept all these sayings in her heart.

So what do you think?
Jesus left his parents while on a trip, for THREE DAYS, without telling them that he was leaving or where he was going.
If you are a parent would you accept this as acceptable behavior from your 12 year old child?
As a child, would you have treated your parents to three days of worry because they did not know where you were or what happened to you?

One of the commandments is "Honor your Mother and Father""
Do you think that Jesus honored his parents by his disgraceful conduct?

Jesus sinned against his parents and deserved to be punished.

Nick Hallandale
enterprisestrategy@earthlink.net

Cathar1950 · Post by **Cathar1950** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 11:58 am

I never spanked my kids. If I talk to them sternly they were in tears. Beating them would have been an over kill.
In the book "James the brother of Jesus" it is shown where Luke used Josephus' work and even copied his mistake. It is also pointed out that when he was 12 he went to the temple and talked with the priest as a very Precocious child. Luke may have borrowed the story.
I don't believe in Jesus as the biological son of God. It seems if they had stuck with the Hebrew model they would have had a miracle birth with out God fathering the child. I suspect it is a late addition and Paul seems to be against the idea which had already cropped into the growing Christology.
According to the story God sacrificed his perfect son. No telling what he would have done had he been a bad child. Maybe he would have let him off. I tend to think the atonement was another late addition an analogy used by Paul that got out of hand. Off to the cafe they are having church down stairs.

Nick Hallandale · Post by **Nick Hallandale** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 12:47 pm

Well, I think that Jesus definitely deserved to be punished when he was 12 years old.
Consider the following...Luke 2:41-51 KJV

41Now his parents went to Jerusalem every year at the feast of the passover.

42And when he was twelve years old, they went up to Jerusalem after the custom of the feast.

43And when they had fulfilled the days, as they returned, the child Jesus tarried behind in Jerusalem; and Joseph and his mother knew not of it.

44But they, supposing him to have been in the company, went a day's journey; and they sought him among their kinsfolk and acquaintance.

45And when they found him not, they turned back again to Jerusalem, seeking him.

46And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions.

47And all that heard him were astonished at his understanding and answers.

48And when they saw him, they were amazed: and his mother said unto him, Son, why hast thou thus dealt with us? behold, thy father and I have sought thee sorrowing.

49And he said unto them, How is it that ye sought me? wist ye not that I must be about my Father's business?

50And they understood not the saying which he spake unto them.

51And he went down with them, and came to Nazareth, and was subject unto them: but his mother kept all these sayings in her heart.

So what do you think?
Jesus left his parents while on a trip, for THREE DAYS, without telling them that he was leaving or where he was going.
If you are a parent would you accept this as acceptable behavior from your 12 year old child?
As a child, would you have treated your parents to three days of worry because they did not know where you were or what happened to you?

One of the commandments is "Honor your Mother and Father""
Do you think that Jesus honored his parents by his disgraceful conduct?

Jesus sinned against his parents and deserved to be punished.

Nick Hallandale
enterprisestrategy@earthlink.net

Paveway · Post by **Paveway** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 5:19 pm

Jesus is not mentioned in any historical evidence.

Pwnt

Oddly enough, the Bible says that everyone has sinned, this would include our little Jesus, would it not? Else it would be a contradiction, and prove the "none-existence" of your omnipotent God.

It wouldn't prove the non-existence, more so the existence.

The Bible says that every man falls short of the glory of God.

When Jesus was on this earth he was an Avatar, not a Man.
No-one is Jesus, and God says that everyone falls short of the Glory of God, but Jesus is God, so he is righteous.
But maybe you don't understand, in the end of the 33 years Jesus tookk on the sin of Humanity...he didn't sin, but he had sin.
It was a price, his mortal flesh was sin and he died with that sin, he then arose and he was cleansed and God the Father then recodnised Him and Jeusus ascended into heaven free of sin.
Humans no matter what stage are NEVER free of sin.
Can you prove to me that Jesus was in fact a Human?
How can this be if Mary never had intercourse?
Jesus didn't follow the rules of Science, and i isn't following the Rules of Human endeavour here either.

bernee51 · Post by **bernee51** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 9:59 pm

Paveway wrote:
Jesus is not mentioned in any historical evidence.
Pwnt

PWNT - is that some 'net acronyym?

Does it shocjk you that thre a people in this world who may doubt the existence of the biblical Jesus?

The reference you gave (viz. Wikipedia) is not evidence of an historical figure - it is a recounting of legend. What would be evidence - if it existed - is something written by a historian who lived at the time of Jesus The Romans were consumate historians - none of them mentioned Jesus. In fact none mention any of the 'history' supposedly written in the bible. Where else, for example, is the alleged 'Massacre of the Innocents' mentioned?

There have been numerous discussions on this forum on this particular topic. No one has yet been able to provide a contemporary account of the Jesus of the bible. Can you?

Paveway wrote:
The Bible says that every man falls short of the glory of God.

The bible also says that a snake talked. Why should it be believed?

Paveway wrote: Humans no matter what stage are NEVER free of sin.

I disagree - to sin is to go against the word of god . God does not exist therefore sin does not exist. Ergo there are no sinners.

Nick Hallandale · Post by **Nick Hallandale** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 4:42 pm

Paveway wrote:.
The Bible says that every man falls short of the glory of God.
When Jesus was on this earth he was an Avatar, not a Man.
Can you prove to me that Jesus was in fact a Human?
How can this be if Mary never had intercourse?
Jesus didn't follow the rules of Science, and i isn't following the Rules of Human endeavour here either

Dear Paveway,
I wish I could understand exactly what you are trying to say.

However, I looked up "avatar" in my dictionary. Avatar= the incarnation of a Hindu deity. an incarnation in human form. an embodiment, as a concept or philosophy, in a person.
Did you mean to say that Jesus is an "incarnation of a Hindu deity?"
Or is Jesus an "embodiment, as a concept or philosophy, in a person.?"
I looked up "avatar" in my concordance and it was not there. ????

I always thought that the traditional Christian explanation was that Jesus was fully man and fully God.

I'm sorry but I can't prove that Jesus was human.

I wonder if Jesus' brothers and sisters were also born of a virgin if Mary never had sexual intercourse? And how do you know she was always a virgin?

What are the rules of human endeavor? And how do you know Jesus didn't follow the rules of Science?

But I'll tell you what I learned from the gospel according to Luke.
Jesus sinned when he was 12 years old. He left his parents for three days and did not tell them he was leaving or tell them where he was going.

Nick Hallandale
enterprisestrategy@earthlink.net