The Christian Response to Homosexuality

[micatala]

Many Christians consider homosexual practices to be immoral. The forum has multiple threads which include arguments as to whether or not homosexuality should be considered immoral, and even whether this position is supported Biblically.

In this thread, we will take it is a given that homosexuality is immoral.

Under this assumption, what should the response of Christians be to the existence of homosexuality? How should we interact with or treat persons who are homosexuals?

In terms of political society, what sort of laws should Christians support with respect to homosexuality? If there is to be unequal treatment of homosexuals under the law, what is the Biblical basis for this?


Again, arguments concerning the morality of homosexuality are not relevant to the thread. What is relevant is discussion of the possible Christian responses to homosexuality, and what valid rationale there are for these responses.

[chachynga]

Don't bother responding in detail to that chachynga character. Whatever is writing the posts, there is an agenda at work. And, it is not a Christian agenda.

As I have already started to point out, this person has little, if any, knowledge of Christian thought, , doctrine, identity, or, can handle even beginners apologetics.

I can't help but agree with you John, see there is something we can agree upon

Your doctrines false and your calling the kettle black.

Ahh haa haa haa haa Aaha ah ha ha ha funny!

[melikio]

I am not extremist, and you and your hate would not be accepted in Christs Kingdom, so think it over and reject him with caution... his fathers Laws require the death of homosexuals, like it or not.

Maybe YOU don't think/believe you express "extremist" views, but many people likely think/believe you do.

Love and hatred can be defined in many ways by many people.

And it seems even "Christians" aren't immune to allowing "hatred" to be spliced into their "religious" views. The proportion to which hatred becomes a reality, in the "way" some Christians live by or promote their religious beliefs, is genrally unpredictable.

Not all "Christians" are "good" people. Actually, many prove they are generally "BAD" people who put their "religion" ahead of human beings. To themselves, their often arrogant and hateful behavior is a reflection of God's will, and they so often can't be reasoned with, outside of the definitons of "reason" provided in the "Bible". Some of these extremist-Christians INSIST that everyone MUST see things based upon their (biblical) interpretation/s as applied to this common reality. That is "reason" to them, and no other form of thinking/reason is "valid". They make the mistake of defining their "faith" as "truth"; they are not always the same things.

Faith is not necessarily truth. People CONFUSE the two things, and often project that confusion unwittingly, by believing there is something "RIGHT" about PUSHING or FORCING others to believe as they DO. If ALL Christians could agree on every biblical interpretation, that would say a LOT more than one group/faction here or there INSISTING (arrogantly so) that THEY are the most "correct"; moreso than anyone and everyone else.

Now, the mistake that many Christians (especially) make, is to think that they (themselves) are somehow the FORCE that causes "belief", when in fact, they are pushing so many people away from the very thing they embrace by their overzealousness and obligatory COMPULSION.

This is unmistakeable, and it will be addressed one way or the other (and in due time). I'm becoming more patient, but some aren't. Things will balance out, balance out; whether by God's hand or sheer fate as mankind progresses (or destroys itself). We'll just have to wait and see what happens in the end.

-Mel-

[chachynga]

And once again another fool and his folly. You guys dont even pay attention, how the heck do you expect to ever know scripture properly?

Hum?

BTW if you are not making these posts from a prison you are simply a hypocrite to your own beliefs.

Perverting Gods word like YOU, hardly

Seems like you have a conundrum on your hands, on one hand Jesus said in the bible to love your fellow man but on the other hand a part of the bible says to kill homosexuals. How many homosexuals have you killed?

Whoa, what are you talking about?

In person or any old way?

Execution of the Law is the duty of Government, but that is not to say that it's not possible to carry it out and still be forgiven.

This isn't about me, it's about you and your rejection of Gods Laws.

Oh there is something to consider: it is confusion.

Yes but not on my side, if you are going to follow one of the levitican laws you have to follow them all. Check out what your clothes are made of.
[/quote] Be sure that I do, socks to underwear to all gifts. That Law is Still effective under the God of the NT and OT, that law and those types are still here and Jesus Never Ever changed THEM.

So you'd rather go against God and defile the Land for the sake of pleasing a man instead of a holy God.

Sorry but I'm not all that into blood sacrifice, theres a law about that too. You can't pick and choose my boy.
[/quote] No Sir, this is where you are sure to throw a hissy fit, as this shows that you neither understand what laws are not applicable under Christ nor what the bible truly says.

Christ is Our Sacrifice to thise that are HIS, and YOU are NOT His, fro certain, unless you have a change of heart.

My hands are not covered with Blood nor Hatred for carrying out Gods Will, it is upon the people doing the detestable acts.

I am a mere follower of the Way!

You could at least come up with an original excuse, many of the nazis used that one at Nuremberg.
[/quote]
Like I said My hands are not covered with their blood, theirs is, and if you actually read the OT then you may learn a thing or two.

Tell me, what punishment is required of me if I did carry out justly one of Gods Laws?


Leviticus
20 13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.


Simple, really, all you have to do is read Gods words.


These Moral Laws were Never nailed to squat! They Exist Today.

that means Lev. 20.13 is to be carried out by a just Government that loves the Lord.
So again, what is wrong with that?

Heavens no, every christian is called on to do the lords work, you don't get off that easy. You say you want people dead but you are too squeamish to do the work. You have said earlier that you fear nothing but it looks like you have a definate aversion to blood and killing. If more people would actually have to do what they call out for others to do there would be a lot less stupidity in the world.
[/qoute]
It's nothing to you, Gods laws!

Lords work included Keeping Gods Holy Laws, including Stoning or firing squad for certain things like Beastality, just like our Forfathers did at the start of this Great Counrty. They were Bible Believers and did actually carry out the laws as best they could, the executed a young mand and the animals he had sex with, according to God and His Ways.

And you have the Gaul to say that this is somehow WRONG!

Bull

Pure Deceipt!

God says Do it and as an obedient follower you are called to follow God.

I know this, truly I say to you, that Jesus would have NO problem with ordering the execution today, provided it was don Lawfully.

Them there's tha Facts Jack!

Please tell me where God is wrong! You can't do it without destroying the whole Bible. You god is wrong, not the Holy God of Israel.

Who said anything about god, I'm saying you are wrong. If you were the true OT christian you claim you are you would kill homosexuals and then give yourself up to the authorities as the bible demands. But no you take the cowards way out and say it is the governments job, all so you can keep your hands clean.[/quote]

Bible would not require me to give myself up to any authority that is Anti_Gods Laws, all authority comes by and through and because of God, anyone setting their own laws over Gods like you are is setting their own god up instead, and secondly ther is no difference in the OT and NT for a Christian, and all NT has to be read in light of the old...

I'm merely telling you God's laws and you reject them and claim I made up something, no indeed I just am saying God requires you to follow his rules not mans and that you hate.

Call me all sorts of foolish names, that's okay, Sticks and Stones you know never ever hurt me nor can they ever.

God says their blood in UPON THEM, no excuse necessary other than to be just in process of carrying out the law.

Just like the woman caught in the very act of adultery, they were doing it UNlawfully, un justly, not according to law, if they would have been just and followed the law without doing what they did, then the two of them "caught" in the act would have been stoned, as demanded, providing a few other tid bits, there could have been more in the party to be stoned... not that you'd care since God and his laws mean nothing to you.

[chachynga]

I am not extremist, and you and your hate would not be accepted in Christs Kingdom, so think it over and reject him with caution... his fathers Laws require the death of homosexuals, like it or not.

Maybe YOU don't think/believe you express "extremist" views, but many people likely think/believe you do.

Well it doesnt really matter what others think now does it!

I mean all that matters is What God Thinks, Right?

And God Commands to exectue Homosexuals.

Period.

Your just opposed to God and His Holy Ways.

You don't have to call me a hate monger for siding with God do you?

[chachynga]

I am not extremist, and you and your hate would not be accepted in Christs Kingdom, so think it over and reject him with caution... his fathers Laws require the death of homosexuals, like it or not.

mething "RIGHT" about PUSHING or FORCING others to believe as they DO. If ALL Christians could agree on every biblical interpretation, that would say a LOT more than one group/faction here or there INSISTING (arrogantly so) that THEY are the most "correct"; moreso than anyone and everyone else.


-Mel-

if all christians agreed then christ would be here or the ones calling them selves christians would be believeing a false God....

Christians love to believe lies, period!

True Christians will NOT believe like the rest of professing Christians

the only way they would have the same beliefs is when God Is Here in his second coming

[chachynga]

they are pushing so many people away from the very thing they embrace by their overzealousness and obligatory COMPULSION.
-Mel-

What's wrong with PUSHING people AWAY, that is a VERY Christian THING to do? So why do you not like to act like a Christian?

Why Did Jesus Push many people away on purpose?

This is not about converting souls.

It never was bout seeing how many sould you can save.

Salvation is not the main GOAL.

Oh, yeah, you still dont understand the message do you.

Start in Genesis and read all the way through to the end.

[cad0830]

I'll give you all part knowledge on what the Bible says. The Law does state that homosexuals should be killed. I believe it is in Deutoronomy and Leviticus. Paul further states in one of his letters that homosexuality is a sin. The problem with all of this deals with Jesus. He stated that we were to forgive people of their sins, no matter the sin. Paul also states that we were to be no longer bound by the Law. In the end, Paul, I feel, believes that although homosexuality is sin, Christ would not want them to be stoned. We are to love the sinner, but hate the sin. I am not arguing whether or not homosexuality is in fact a sin, but rather the continuity of the Bible and how everything in the Bible should be taken in the context of the whole, not just parts. That is the major problem with looking at small portions of the Bible rather than the entire work. The Bible is pieced together in a fashion that the context is lost without knowledge of the whole.

Long story short, we are not asked to kill people because they are homosexuals. We are to show them love and compassion.

[chachynga]

I'll give you all part knowledge on what the Bible says. The Law does state that homosexuals should be killed. I believe it is in Deutoronomy and Leviticus. Paul further states in one of his letters that homosexuality is a sin. The problem with all of this deals with Jesus. He stated that we were to forgive people of their sins, no matter the sin. Paul also states that we were to be no longer bound by the Law. In the end, Paul, I feel, believes that although homosexuality is sin, Christ would not want them to be stoned. We are to love the sinner, but hate the sin. I am not arguing whether or not homosexuality is in fact a sin, but rather the continuity of the Bible and how everything in the Bible should be taken in the context of the whole, not just parts. That is the major problem with looking at small portions of the Bible rather than the entire work. The Bible is pieced together in a fashion that the context is lost without knowledge of the whole.

Long story short, we are not asked to kill people because they are homosexuals. We are to show them love and compassion.

Actually your wrong, But I do like your post. Very well done!



"I'll give you all part knowledge on what the Bible says. The Law does state that homosexuals should be killed."

About time, indeed, and who wrote the law? God is the writer of scripture and it is his moral laws here.

Christ is God, right!

Christ followed Gods Laws and even said were so to follow them.


So why not a scripturally mandated law?

Attempting to do away with something not done away, or do you think this was nailed to the cross?

If it was not nailed to the cross, then I assume you'd agree that it is in effect even today, right!




"The problem with all of this deals with Jesus. He stated that we were to forgive people of their sins, no matter the sin. "
Not true!

Later




" Paul also states that we were to be no longer bound by the Law. "

What Law?

Do you know?

And Christ said he even did not do away with the law.

Matthew
5 17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Right!

Then the question becomes, exactly what laws were in existance he supported? No?



Oh I see: Just Like many who falsely believe this:
"In the end, Paul, I feel, believes that although homosexuality is sin, Christ would not want them to be stoned. We are to love the sinner, but hate the sin. "

That's okay, we can get into it more later still. If you Like!




" I am not arguing whether or not homosexuality is in fact a sin, but rather the continuity of the Bible and how everything in the Bible should be taken in the context of the whole, not just parts. "

Exactly perfect, you are indeed at least thinking--- so far!


" That is the major problem with looking at small portions of the Bible rather than the entire work."

To some degree, I'll agree. You seem to be at least somewhat wise, as time will surely tell if this be true, I do enjoy your post. Too bad there are not others here that think like you.




" The Bible is pieced together in a fashion that the context is lost without knowledge of the whole. "

I donno if I'll agree or even if I fully understand your point, please give additional info if it suits you and adds value to your points thus far.



"
Long story short, we are not asked to kill people because they are homosexuals. We are to show them love and compassion."

We are asked to carry out Gods Laws, and killing a homosexual and a person that sleeps with animals and relatives et al, are to be removed from society.

You don't kill them because they are something, you kill them because they are to be removed, so as to not defile the land.... of course it has to be done lawfully.

Neither am I saying to torture them or not be kind to them or whatnot, but when it is discovered what they do, and the law can be carried out lawfully, then the appropriate measures shall be carried out swiftly.


Now, I hope to continue the discussion, but the odds are against it... time will tell.


Chachynga

[Wyvern]

Seems like you have a conundrum on your hands, on one hand Jesus said in the bible to love your fellow man but on the other hand a part of the bible says to kill homosexuals. How many homosexuals have you killed?

Whoa, what are you talking about?

What haven't you read both the OT and the NT of the bible? You seem to freely adopt the OT as true while ignoring the NT, which is strange in itself for a supposed christian. If you are going to take one of the Levitican laws as being relevant you must take them ALL. No more mixed cloth wearing for you.

Execution of the Law is the duty of Government, but that is not to say that it's not possible to carry it out and still be forgiven.

This isn't about me, it's about you and your rejection of Gods Laws.

You obviously haven't actually read the Levitican laws, GOD's LAW is every christians job to carry out. The laws of man on the other hand is usually relegated to the government to perform. If you aren't willing to do the duty you describe stop trying to tell others what they should do. You my friend have rejected gods law by trying to slough it off on the government to do. I on the other hand do not hold to the beliefs that you describe so I am not called to kill people for god.
Because you don't want to carry out gods laws because you don't have the guts to do it yourself you try to make it the governments job. The god you claim to follow probably won't spend much time when it comes to judging a coward like you.

Be sure that I do, socks to underwear to all gifts. That Law is Still effective under the God of the NT and OT, that law and those types are still here and Jesus Never Ever changed THEM.

If you live pretty much anywhere in the western world you can't get away from mixed cloth. Thats strange those laws are OT so Jesus never said them in the first place.

No Sir, this is where you are sure to throw a hissy fit, as this shows that you neither understand what laws are not applicable under Christ nor what the bible truly says.

So are you now saying that all the Levitican laws don't neccessarily apply anymore? If you want to keep the one about homosexuals you had better keep the one about burnt offerings of animals.

Like I said My hands are not covered with their blood, theirs is, and if you actually read the OT then you may learn a thing or two.

Tell me, what punishment is required of me if I did carry out justly one of Gods Laws?

Well if you carry out the law about killing people, by mans laws you probably will spend the rest of your life in a sanitarium hopped up on thorazine, by gods law if you kill someone you will be sent to hell forever, of course if you hold to both you very well might get both punishments. I suggest reading the NT for the latest word from god as to how to behave.

These Moral Laws were Never nailed to squat! They Exist Today.

Where pray tell?

Lords work included Keeping Gods Holy Laws, including Stoning or firing squad for certain things like Beastality, just like our Forfathers did at the start of this Great Counrty. They were Bible Believers and did actually carry out the laws as best they could, the executed a young mand and the animals he had sex with, according to God and His Ways.

I might be a bit rusty but where does the bible mention firing squads?

God says Do it and as an obedient follower you are called to follow God.

Yes exactly, YOU are called to carry out gods law, why aren't you out there killing people for god? Instead of trying to tell others what to do lead by example. Act like you are as brave as your words for once.

I know this, truly I say to you, that Jesus would have NO problem with ordering the execution today, provided it was don Lawfully.

I guess you skipped all those parts about Jesus talking about loving your neighbors as yourself. You have a real odd version of law.

Bible would not require me to give myself up to any authority that is Anti_Gods Laws, all authority comes by and through and because of God, anyone setting their own laws over Gods like you are is setting their own god up instead, and secondly ther is no difference in the OT and NT for a Christian, and all NT has to be read in light of the old...

Of course it does, the bible states you should obey the laws of the land so to speak. Then you need to do some reading in order to bring the rules that the two parts give into a cohesive whole. Don't blame me if the bible as a whole gives contradictory rules.

I'm merely telling you God's laws and you reject them and claim I made up something, no indeed I just am saying God requires you to follow his rules not mans and that you hate.

Yes you are and I'm telling you that you aren't folowing those very rules you think we should be following. Never did I say you are making things up, you just aren't keeping up with modern days is all.

Call me all sorts of foolish names, that's okay, Sticks and Stones you know never ever hurt me nor can they ever.

I haven't called you any names.

God says their blood in UPON THEM, no excuse necessary other than to be just in process of carrying out the law.

Then why aren't you out there carrying out gods law? Simple as that, you tell us what god commands YOU to do and what is your response? You sit inside and tell a bunch of people on a forum what they should do. Yes surely you must be among the righteous.

Just like the woman caught in the very act of adultery, they were doing it UNlawfully, un justly, not according to law, if they would have been just and followed the law without doing what they did, then the two of them "caught" in the act would have been stoned, as demanded, providing a few other tid bits, there could have been more in the party to be stoned... not that you'd care since God and his laws mean nothing to you.

Obviously these laws mean nothing to you either, theres been nothing in the news about someone going on a killing spree targeting adulterers and homosexuals. Put up or shut up, you've given yourself all the justification needed so what's stopping you?

[sue]

Question: Why would a non-Christian care OR, be posting in "this" thread?

Because I can't allow rhetoric that advocates for violence against any group to go unchallenged, especially in a forum that calls for civility. Also because I have personal experience being a minority in an environment with occasional hostility directed at that minority. My Air Force squadron was 97% male.

And I've had a recent experience that makes me wonder if there is a god, so while I'm not Christian that doesn't mean that I'm an atheist.

Well spill the beans! What sort of experience could one have that would make one wonder?

](*,)

I'm done talking about me in "debate" threads unless it's an experience used as an illustrative example.