About God and Wisdom and Love

[JoeyKnothead]

From Post 5 here:

I don't see God as a despot. He is perfect in wisdom and justice and love.

For debate:

Please offer some means to confirm God is:

1- Perfect in wisdom.
2- (perfect in?) love.

[Divine Insight]

It's simply required by definition of a supposedly trustworthy God who knows what he's doing. If he doesn't have "perfect wisdom" that means that he could potentially be wrong about something. But if that was the case, then he wouldn't be trustworthy. It's just a matter of definition. You can't very well have a God who might actually be wrong about things. So it's required just to keep the religion afloat.

But, of course it doesn't work anyway. Especially in Christianity where evangelists are worried sick that this God might actually condemn someone who doesn't truly deserve to be condemned. Evangelist who are desperately trying to "save souls" clearly have absolutely no faith at all in the perfect wisdom of their God, for if they did they wouldn't be the slightest bit worried about trying to save people who might otherwise be condemned.

Obviously if God's wisdom is 'perfect' then he could never condemn anyone who doesn't deserve to be condemned. And therefore any Christian who would be worried about saving souls obviously doesn't trust God's perfect wisdom. They must necessarily be afraid that God might condemn someone if they don't act to save them first.

In fact, Jesus didn't trust God to be perfectly wise when he cried out, "Father forgive them for they know not what they do", because if God has perfect wisdom he would have been able to figure that one out for himself. Apparently even Jesus didn't trust God the Father to be perfectly wise.

[OnceConvinced]

God is love - 1 John 4:8
Love is not jealous - 1 Corinthians 13:4
The Lord thy God is a jealous God - Deuteronomy 6:15.

Already we see that if we go by Bible standards, God cannot be considered love. I'll throw out a few other attributes which the bible states is love and see if God measures up. I'll let the reader determine whether he does.

Protecting
Doing your best to meet needs (feeding and clothing, etc)
Being willing to lay down your life
There is no fear in love - 1 John 4:18
It does not envy
It does not boast
It is not proud.
It is not rude
It is not self-seeking.
It is not easily angered
It keeps no record of wrongs.
It always trusts
It always perseveres.
The desire to spend time
Unconditional


Doing his best to protect - God definitely does not protect everybody, because as we know bad things happen to good people, even Christians.

Doing his best to meet needs
One way we show we care is to meet the needs of our loved ones. But does God do that? No, he doesn’t, even though the bible makes the claim in Philippians 4:19 that “My God shall supply all your needs�, he does not do so, even for his own followers.

Willing to lay down his life?
If you accept that Jesus is God, then you might be able to argue that he does, although Jesus didn't stay dead did he?

No fear in love.
The threats of Hell are used if one refuses to worship God.

It does not envy.
Is God envious? Well he certainly declares that he is in Exodus 20:4:
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me,

No boasting and pride.
God is very proud and the furtherest thing from humble you can get. Even Jesus boasted that he was the son of God and the “light of the world�. God says "There's nothing too difficult for me!" That's pride in anyone’s books

It is not rude.
Jesus was rude to people on many occasions, calling people fools, vipers and what not. He was also very rude to his mother when she came to the temple to get him.

Not self seeking.
Well God requires that everyone bow their knee and worship him. If that's not self seeking, I don't know what is.

Not easily angered.
In the Old Testament we see many times, a wrathful, vengeful God who didn't hesitate to order the death of someone for a trivial act. Eg picking up sticks on the Sabbath, preventing the Ark of the Covenant from falling, looking back when fleeing a city.

Keeps no record of wrong doings/perseveres
Come Judgement Day that love ceases to persevere and his wrath kicks in. Not only that but everyone is going to have to give an account of all the bad things done in their life. (Mat 12:36) And is God going to have a list? Of course he is. He’s going to know every dirty little kinky little thing you’ve ever done and it's gonna be replayed for all to see!