JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Argue for and against Christianity

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply

Is jealousy a good attribute in a god?

Yes
2
22%
No
7
78%
Don't know
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 9

2Dbunk
Site Supporter
Posts: 838
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2015 1:39 pm
Location: East of Eden

JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #1

Post by 2Dbunk »

Exodus 20:5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me,
The above is strong stuff. In a land that cherishes the choices Capitalism has provided us with, and Freedom beyond "free will," we Americans welcome competition. But the Abrahamic God would proscribe that right and, in the face of our Constitution, punish offender's children thru the 3rd and 4th generation. IMO that's a bit harsh for children to suffer for something they had no say or control about. IMO this, alone, points to human authorship of the Bible, as flawed as this command is.

1) Is it necessary for God to be jealous in light of the fact he has given us free will and has access to everything there is anyway?

2) Is it necessary for God to be jealous at all?

User avatar
Peds nurse
Site Supporter
Posts: 2270
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 7:27 am
Been thanked: 9 times

Re: JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #2

Post by Peds nurse »

2Dbunk wrote:
Exodus 20:5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me,
2Dbunk wrote:The above is strong stuff. In a land that cherishes the choices Capitalism has provided us with, and Freedom beyond "free will," we Americans welcome competition. But the Abrahamic God would proscribe that right and, in the face of our Constitution, punish offender's children thru the 3rd and 4th generation. IMO that's a bit harsh for children to suffer for something they had no say or control about. IMO this, alone, points to human authorship of the Bible, as flawed as this command is.

1) Is it necessary for God to be jealous in light of the fact he has given us free will and has access to everything there is anyway?

2) Is it necessary for God to be jealous at all?

Hey 2Dbunk! Are you having pleasant day?

If you finish the rest of the passage, it says, "but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments."

God's love is always greater than his discipline.

If we are his bride, his beloved people, would he not want us to be faithful to him? Imagine if you were married, but had affairs with multiple people, should your spouse not be jealous? He is jealous for us, because he loves us so intensely. He is not willing to share us with other images of Gods. He created us, and wants to have a faithful relationship with him, so that he can shower his love upon us, and direct us in the way we should go.

User avatar
Divine Insight
Savant
Posts: 18070
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:59 pm
Location: Here & Now
Been thanked: 19 times

Re: JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #3

Post by Divine Insight »

2Dbunk wrote: 2) Is it necessary for God to be jealous at all?
Supposedly he's jealous of other Gods. However, if he is the only God and there are no other Gods then this makes no sense at all.
[center]Image
Spiritual Growth - A person's continual assessment
of how well they believe they are doing
relative to what they believe a personal God expects of them.
[/center]

2Dbunk
Site Supporter
Posts: 838
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2015 1:39 pm
Location: East of Eden

Re: JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #4

Post by 2Dbunk »

[Replying to post 2 by Peds nurse]

It IS a fine day (I'm just getting over neck muscle spasms so this past week wasn't too glorious as I was in bed taking muscle relaxants -- just found out that I may have a magnesium deficiency). You are SO cheerful -- if ever I need a nurse in the hospital, I hope he or she is as pleasant.

After reading your post I'm wondering what your Faith is (protestant, catholic, etc.)?
I like to think I can be as cheerful as you (if I don't get into discussions on religion). I've read the Bible and come away with quite a different take on its content than you. It does sound to me that your God is rather immature in proclaiming his jealousy. But that isn't the only issue I have with "Him." I don't have the time or space to list them all, but as sure as he DIDN'T make little green apples I just don't think such a meany could be God!

I was raised in a home with a mom (Dutch Reformed and Democrat) and a dad (Progressive Mennonite and Republican). Thus my indoctrination into a certain Faith never took. I was obsessive compulsive into my twenties . . . the last compulsion was me determining if there was a God. Once I certified to myself that God most probably did not exist, my compulsions melted away. It was like being born again but not in the sense the fundamentalists seek.

I'm in my second marriage and I love her dearly. Believe me, she is a wonderful nurse, as she was to her previous husband who died from juvenile diabetes (he was blind most of their marriage). We both share the same apostasy -- we don't hate God . . . we just don't think he exists. She was brought up strict Catholic but lost her faith working as a secretary in a seminary.

You and I are looking at different sides of a coin. From what I see on this forum, many are doing the same. You see God in everything and I see Nature in everything. For whatever reason God doesn't talk to me like he speaks to you. Why the difference?


I

Kenisaw
Guru
Posts: 2117
Joined: Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:41 pm
Location: St Louis, MO, USA
Has thanked: 18 times
Been thanked: 61 times

Re: JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #5

Post by Kenisaw »

2Dbunk wrote:
Exodus 20:5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me,
The above is strong stuff. In a land that cherishes the choices Capitalism has provided us with, and Freedom beyond "free will," we Americans welcome competition. But the Abrahamic God would proscribe that right and, in the face of our Constitution, punish offender's children thru the 3rd and 4th generation. IMO that's a bit harsh for children to suffer for something they had no say or control about. IMO this, alone, points to human authorship of the Bible, as flawed as this command is.

1) Is it necessary for God to be jealous in light of the fact he has given us free will and has access to everything there is anyway?

2) Is it necessary for God to be jealous at all?
We can't have free will if the god is all knowing as he claims. Even more bizarre is that even the god can't have free will if it is all knowing, for it even knows what it will do for the rest of eternity. So the universe is determined. At that point I guess I don't care what level of jealousy is in play.

2Dbunk
Site Supporter
Posts: 838
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2015 1:39 pm
Location: East of Eden

Re: JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #6

Post by 2Dbunk »

[Replying to Peds nurse]

Hi PN,

I hope your day is as beautiful as it is here, and my neck is much better.

I forgot to mention in my last post when declaring my love for my wife that I'm so in love with her that if she met another man who could make her happier, I would step aside -- certainly in sorrow but not in jealousy. She means so much to me that her happiness comes first. You may think this malarkey but I've actually experienced this early in our marriage (15 years ago), when I thought someone younger (her physician) was interested in her and she with him. It turned out to be my imagination spinning overtime. I had stoically accepted losing her, but there was no jealousy on my part.

I mention this because if I have overcome jealousy -- and I if I can do that, why can't a god? I am not envious of anyone -- I feel I have it all. No, I'm not a millionaire or a power broker, but I've got my good health and happiness -- that's the best wealth there is.

And that's not all that the Abrahamic god lacks. I would never have created different races of people so that one would be superior to another causing millennia of bickering and bloodshed. I would never subjugate women as "His" teachings imply. I could go on in this vein but the point of my bringing this up is: I feel I'm better than "God." Of course that's impossible, so, therefore this God really doesn't exist. Plain and simple!
-------------------------------------------------------------
Islam is ALL that a religion can be!

User avatar
Tired of the Nonsense
Site Supporter
Posts: 5680
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2009 6:01 pm
Location: USA
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #7

Post by Tired of the Nonsense »

2Dbunk wrote:
Exodus 20:5
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me,
The above is strong stuff. In a land that cherishes the choices Capitalism has provided us with, and Freedom beyond "free will," we Americans welcome competition. But the Abrahamic God would proscribe that right and, in the face of our Constitution, punish offender's children thru the 3rd and 4th generation. IMO that's a bit harsh for children to suffer for something they had no say or control about. IMO this, alone, points to human authorship of the Bible, as flawed as this command is.

1) Is it necessary for God to be jealous in light of the fact he has given us free will and has access to everything there is anyway?

2) Is it necessary for God to be jealous at all?


According to modern Jewish belief, Christian belief and Muslim belief, there is no God but God. God, being fully omniscient, is necessarily fully aware that He is the only Divine Being that exists. For Him to be jealous of Beings which He fully knows do not even exist, would make Him just a little bit more then completely psychotic, wouldn't you agree?

Now, it's true that in the Old Testament God is described as being a "jealous God." In those early days of Judaism God had other God's to compete with. The reason for this is because in ancient times when the books of the OT were being written, the Jews were not monotheistic. They were henotheistic.

Wikipedia
Henotheism
Henotheism (Greek henas theos "one god") is the belief in and worship of a single god while accepting the existence or possible existence of other deities that may also be served.

Canaanite religion and early Judaism
Rabbinical Judaism as it developed in Late Antiquity is emphatically monotheistic, but its predecessor, the various schools of Hellenistic Judaism and Second Temple Judaism, and especially the cult of Yahweh as it was practiced in ancient Israel and Judah during the 8th and 7th centuries BC, have been described as henotheistic.

For example, the Moabites worshipped the god Chemosh, the Edomites, Qaus, both of whom were part of the greater Canaanite pantheon, headed by the chief god, El. The Canaanite pantheon consisted of El and Asherah as the chief deities, with 70 sons who were said to rule over each of the nations of the earth. These sons were each worshiped within a specific region. Kurt Noll states that "the Bible preserves a tradition that Yahweh used to 'live' in the south, in the land of Edom" and that the original god of Israel was El Shaddai.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henotheism
Image "The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this." -- Albert Einstein -- Written in 1954 to Jewish philosopher Erik Gutkind.

User avatar
1213
Savant
Posts: 13491
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:06 am
Location: Finland
Has thanked: 498 times
Been thanked: 511 times

Re: JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #8

Post by 1213 »

2Dbunk wrote: 2) Is it necessary for God to be jealous at all?
I think jealousy is one sign of love. If one truly loves, he can become jealous, if he is losing the love one. So I think jealousy is part of loving God, unless he doesnt really care (love).
My new book can be read freely from here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rIkqxC ... xtqFY/view

Old version can be read from here:
http://web.archive.org/web/202212010403 ... x_eng.html

User avatar
Blastcat
Banned
Banned
Posts: 5948
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 4:18 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #9

Post by Blastcat »

[Replying to post 2 by Peds nurse]

Hi, Peds.
Peds nurse wrote: If you finish the rest of the passage, it says, "but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments."

God's love is always greater than his discipline.

If we are his bride, his beloved people, would he not want us to be faithful to him?
If we are his bride, his beloved people, he would PUNISH US FIRST, to get us into line. And then, we would be too afraid to be unfaithful, and YES, a jealous god doesn't want anyone to be unfaithful.

BECAUSE HE'S JEALOUS PSYCHOPATH.
Peds nurse wrote:Imagine if you were married, but had affairs with multiple people, should your spouse not be jealous?
There's something WRONG with that relationship. God needs to go to a marriage counselor, or just let the WIFE GO.

God should not PUNISH the wife in ANY way. GOT THAT? Your god is IMMORAL, and sounds crazy.
Peds nurse wrote:He is jealous for us, because he loves us so intensely.
He is a psychopath. He wants to OWN us, and tell us what to think by way of TORTURE and DEATH THREATS. Your god is intensely psychopathic.
Peds nurse wrote:He is not willing to share us with other images of Gods.
And you imagine that to be a loving stance. We call that a sign of psychopathy. He is jealous of IMAGES.
Peds nurse wrote:He created us, and wants to have a faithful relationship with him, so that he can shower his love upon us, and direct us in the way we should go.
And if we STEP OUT OF LINE HE WILL BURN US FOR ETERNITY.

A godly psycho. If you weren't accepting some religious propaganda, you would see it as clearly as any other outsider to your faith. Being IN.. you can't SEE that your god is not only crazy, but evil.

:)

User avatar
Blastcat
Banned
Banned
Posts: 5948
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 4:18 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: JEALOUSY: A good attribute in a god?

Post #10

Post by Blastcat »

[Replying to post 8 by 1213]
1213 wrote: I think jealousy is one sign of love. If one truly loves, he can become jealous, if he is losing the love one. So I think jealousy is part of loving God, unless he doesnt really care (love).
Nonsense.

I can care about someone, really, TRULY care about them without at all being jealous IN ANY WAY.

Jealousy is a sign of human WEAKNESS, not love.

:)

Post Reply