Sun stood still (Earth stopped rotating)

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Zzyzx
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“Sun stood still� (Earth stopped rotating)

Post #1

Post by Zzyzx »

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Sun stood still (Earth stopped rotating)

Joshua 10:12Then Joshua spoke to the LORD in the day when the LORD delivered up the Amorites before the sons of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel, "O sun, stand still at Gibeon, And O moon in the valley of Aijalon." 13So the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, Until the nation avenged themselves of their enemies. Is it not written in the book of Jashar? And the sun stopped in the middle of the sky and did not hasten to go down for about a whole day. 14There was no day like that before it or after it, when the LORD listened to the voice of a man; for the LORD fought for Israel.


Here, in layman's language, is an idea of what would happen if the Earth stopped rotating.
There are two things to keep in mind:
1. An object in motion tends to stay in motion unless acted upon by an outside force.
2. Everything that is on the surface of the Earth is also spinning with the Earth, which is why we experience day and night.

At the moment of sudden stop, every object that was not firmly anchored to the Earth would continue traveling in the direction it was moving -- tangential to the Earth's surface. The degree of "lurch" would depend greatly on your line of latitude -- which reflects your distance from the axis of spin. At the North and South Pole a small piece of earth has 24 hours to move in a full circle around the axis, which is feet to fractions-of-an-inch per hour (i.e. pretty darn slow). At the equator -- the farthest distance from the axis -- the surface of the Earth is moving at 1670 kilometers/hour (1070 miles/hr).

In other words: at the moment of sudden stop everyone standing at the equator would suddenly find themselves travelling at 1.4 times the speed of sound relative to the now-still surface...at least until they hit something.

And then the real fun starts.

Amongst the things that would still be moving (per Newton's first law of motion) is the atmosphere. Anyone who survived flying sideways at 1000+ miles per hour would quickly realize that they were experiencing the worst wind storm ever imaginable. For context, a category five hurricane has winds of over 249km/h (155 miles/h). Just like the people who went flying, the speed of the air is now 1000+ miles per hour relative to the now-stopped surface. Anything that didn't already go zooming to one side would be getting smashed by crushing wind force...and probably then go flying.

And then there's the fact that about 70% of the Earth's surface is water -- which is also not anchored. The shift in momentum would yield enormous tsunamis, which would probably be even worse due to the aforementioned raging windstorm.

There's yet one more liquid we'd have to be concerned with: all of the magma constantly moving through the Earth's mantle and core. I'm not sure whether the magma stops moving suddenly with the solid earth or it stays moving -- but assuming it's still moving*, that would most likely lead to volcanic eruptions through every channel possible to the surface...and there would be earthquakes that go with that.
https://www.quora.com/What-would-happen ... rotating-1
When the Earth began rotating again the reverse would happen . . .

Still believe ancient tales about the Earth ceasing rotation? What sort of mental gymnastics and/or willful ignorance of physics and astronomy does it take to keep believing tales by ancients who thought the Sun revolved around the Earth?

Would it not be more rational to understand that the tale is a TALL TALE -- a religious fantasy?
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sf

Re: “Sun stood still� (Earth stopped rotating)

Post #21

Post by sf »

polonius.advice wrote:Since the first seven books of the Old Testament are now believed to have been written between 800 and 700 BC, the most reasonable explanation is that we are dealing with fiction as in many other cases.
Please provide a citation for this claim.

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Post #22

Post by Inigo Montoya »

Or it could be that gods and physics aren't required to explain it at all.

It could just be that it makes for a great campfire story.

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Isn't the Book of Joshua is a mythological saga?

Post #23

Post by polonius »

polonius.advice wrote:

Since the first seven books of the Old Testament are now believed to have been written between 800 and 700 BC, the most reasonable explanation is that we are dealing with fiction as in many other cases.

SF replied:

Please provide a citation for this claim.

RESPONSE:
Sure.

From: The Bible Unearthed: Archaeologys New Vision of Ancient Israel and the Origin of its Sacred Texts, Israel Finkelstein and Neil Asher Silberman, Simon and Schuster, NY, 2001

The biblical stories should thus be regarded as a national mythology with no more historical basis then the Homeric sage of Odysseuss travels or Virgils saga of Aeneass founding of Rome. pg 36

So the combination of camels, Arabian goods, Philistines, and Gerar - as well as the other places and nations mentioned in the patriarchal stories in Genesis- are highly significant All the clues point to a time of composition many centuries after the time in which the Bible reports the lives of the patriarchs took place. These and other anachronisms suggest an intensive period of writing the patriarchal narratives in the eighth and seventh centuries BCE. pg. 38


For an extended presentation, you might want to consult:

Bible Unearthed Discoveries of Old versions of the bible) - YouTube
Video for the bible unearthed documentary 1:24:59

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Re: “Sun stood still� (Earth stopped rotating)

Post #24

Post by dianaiad »

Zzyzx wrote: .
[Replying to post 2 by tigger2]

That would be an example of the "mental gymnastics" I mentioned.

Of course if we are talking in make-believe, science fiction, or religious speculation ANYTHING can be "explained".

"Goddidit" and that's all there is to say . . . However, here in C&A debate we do not assume that religious speculation is truthful and accurate (or authoritative or proof of truth).

Y'know, if we are going to posit a Creator God Who can do anything, it does seem a bit silly to decide that He can't cause people to think that the sun stood still by speeding up metabolism or slowing 'time' (whatever that might involve). Shoot, it would seem to be easier than stopping the planet from twirling...

or saying 'whoa' to Apollo's horses, whatever.

It just struck me as odd, this objection. I mean, really; if God CAN do anything, then of course He COULD have stopped the planet, or the sun, or the whole universe...whatever.

The question isn't whether or not such a deity COULD do this. It's...Is there such a deity, and did He do it?

I'm having a little logical disconnect with the argument that an omnipotent Deity doesn't exist because someone is claiming that He did something that modern science says is impossible.

I mean...really...is there a meaning for 'omnipotent' that I'm not aware of? ;)

PERSONALLY, I think this particular tale is probably a very romanticized, tall tale along the lines of King Arthur and magic swords, as many of the OT tales are the accounts of battles told by the winners.

I was just...struck...by the illogic of claiming that an omnipotent deity doesn't exist BECAUSE of an event that non-believers claim a God can't do.

Er....what?

JLB32168

Re: “Sun stood still� (Earth stopped rotating)

Post #25

Post by JLB32168 »

Zzyzx wrote:Still believe ancient tales about the Earth ceasing rotation? What sort of mental gymnastics and/or willful ignorance of physics and astronomy does it take to keep believing tales by ancients who thought the Sun revolved around the Earth?
Assuming God exists (and all of the requisite aspects alleged to be a part of God), omnipotence would seem to take care of any problems you say would exist with stopping the earth in mid rotation.
Zzyzx wrote:Would it not be more rational to understand that the tale is a TALL TALE -- a religious fantasy?
It seems theres rational and irrational but no excluded middle.

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Re: “Sun stood still� (Earth stopped rotating)

Post #26

Post by ttruscott »

Zzyzx wrote:
ttruscott wrote:

Any person who accepts this happened knows that GOD can make it happen just like it was written if HE wanted to.
Agreed " IF one accepts supernatural gods they can believe whatever they like.

Notice, however, that we debate in a sub-forum that does NOT assume gods exist or that god literature is authoritative or proof of truth.
But your question is about the earth stopping to rotate and in the context of the Bible. This must presume there is a power to stop it which implies that power whatever it is conceived to be, will also stop the effects you envision.

Your question is meaningless without the context that goddidit...maybe it should
be in the science section?
PCE Theology as I see it...

We had an existence with a free will in Sheol before the creation of the physical universe. Here we chose to be able to become holy or to be eternally evil in YHWH's sight. Then the physical universe was created and all sinners were sent to earth.

This theology debunks the need to base Christianity upon the blasphemy of creating us in Adam's sin.

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Re: “Sun stood still� (Earth stopped rotating)

Post #27

Post by Zzyzx »

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Good to see you posting Diana.
dianaiad wrote: Y'know, if we are going to posit a Creator God Who can do anything,
Not all who debate are willing to accept that posit " but simply ask for verification that the story is true.
dianaiad wrote: it does seem a bit silly to decide that He can't cause people to think that the sun stood still by speeding up metabolism or slowing 'time' (whatever that might involve). Shoot, it would seem to be easier than stopping the planet from twirling...or saying 'whoa' to Apollo's horses, whatever.
That would be an example of the mental gymnastics mentioned in the OP.
dianaiad wrote: It just struck me as odd, this objection. I mean, really; if God CAN do anything, then of course He COULD have stopped the planet, or the sun, or the whole universe...whatever.
The operating term is IF
dianaiad wrote: The question isn't whether or not such a deity COULD do this. It's...Is there such a deity, and did He do it?
Bold added to emphasize the question -- or, more accurately, "Did it happen?".
dianaiad wrote: I'm having a little logical disconnect with the argument that an omnipotent Deity doesn't exist because someone is claiming that He did something that modern science says is impossible.
Has someone made that argument here?
dianaiad wrote: PERSONALLY, I think this particular tale is probably a very romanticized, tall tale along the lines of King Arthur and magic swords, as many of the OT tales are the accounts of battles told by the winners.
I agree. However, some people want to maintain that the tale is a true account of an event that really, literally happened. Perhaps they fear that admitting any Bible stories are mythologized is admission that the Bible is not infallible, inerrant, word of God (or whatever they believe).
dianaiad wrote: I was just...struck...by the illogic of claiming that an omnipotent deity doesn't exist BECAUSE of an event that non-believers claim a God can't do.
The OP does not make that claim or take that position. It simply questions whether the story is true. Truth of the story is independent of anyone's religious beliefs " i.e., if a story is true (or false) it is true (or false) regardless what one believes about gods.

Someone who believes in God(s) may be more likely to believe the story; however, that does not make the story true.
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Re: “Sun stood still� (Earth stopped rotating)

Post #28

Post by dianaiad »

Zzyzx wrote: .
......
dianaiad wrote: I'm having a little logical disconnect with the argument that an omnipotent Deity doesn't exist because someone is claiming that He did something that modern science says is impossible.
Has someone made that argument here?
Well, that was certainly the inference I got from the OP. (That's right, yes? You imply and I infer?....one of those two).

By giving a detailed description of what would happen (if, that is, the laws of physics were applicable...and yeah, I believe that they were/are) if the earth suddenly stopped turning implies, I believe, that this would be an impossible feat for God...because of course the described consequences would follow if He did such a thing...and since we have no record of such consequences, then it didn't happen.

Which of course is saying that an omnipotent deity couldn't have avoided the consequences. This is what struck me as illogical.

Now me...I honestly don't think He would have bothered. It doesn't take mental gymnastics to understand that pulling a psychological slight of hand on the fighters is a lot easier than stopping the planet.

And all we have is the record of the event told by the winners of it, with all the traditional bragging.

So...is that story literally true? Well, an omnipotent God could have done it...but I don't see why He would bother.

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Re: “Sun stood still� (Earth stopped rotating)

Post #29

Post by Yahu »

polonius.advice wrote: RESPONSE::

Since the first seven books of the Old Testament are now believed to have been written between 800 and 700 BC, the most reasonable explanation is that we are dealing with fiction as in many other cases.
Then I suggest you read 'Ages in Chaos' where the author found similar events recorded in civilizations around the world. I guess that 'fiction' really got around in the ancient world.

Granted, it wasn't of an extended noon but other portions of the day that were extended based on how far around they earth they are from Israel. It also occurred at a time of major upheaval.

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Post #30

Post by Zzyzx »

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Yahu wrote: Then I suggest you read 'Ages in Chaos' where the author found similar events recorded in civilizations around the world. I guess that 'fiction' really got around in the ancient world.
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