The God of Glory spoke creation into existence

[B Bob]

Thesis: The author of the Bible an d the One telling the story of creation is the God of Eternity, and He He permanently and eternally abides in a temple made without hands, and from His own temple, He spoke creation into existence by lifting up His voice of and from His own bodily form; Jesus Christ


Firstly, ALL scripture is authored by God. All writers wrote the scripture under or through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Therefore, if the Bible says it, God said it. If God said it, it is true whether we believe it or not.

Jesus said to the seventy : "he who heareth you, hearethh me." This was and is Jesus' attitude toward all of the scripture. Another example is found in John 5:45-47. Jesus said to the Jews who were persecuting Him "But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words? IOW's if you don't believe what God has said, then how can you believe what I am saying, I speak the words of God, because I am not only the son of man, but I AM also God.
All scripture are truly words spoken by God. Whenever the scriptures are quoted, God is the One that is heard.

Matt 22:31-32
But regarding the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was spoken to you by God: 32I AM THE GOD OF ABRAHAM, AND THE GOD OF ISAAC, AND THE GOD OF JACOB? He (God) is not the God of the dead but of the living.


Job 3:23: Job sought the temple or tabernacle of God (fixed place where God resides), but could not find it, for it had not been revealed to him.

John 2:19-22: Jesus said He (His bodily form) was the temple of God. The temple made without hands.

Col 1:19: Jesus was eternally purposed to be the permanent and fixed dwelling of ALL the fullness of God

Col 2:9: Jesus is the permanent and eternal dwelling of ALL the fullness of God in bodily form (the resurrection and ascended Christ is the Glory of God that Moses saw the hinder parts of. Moses wrote about Him).

1 Cor 15:20-28, 27-28:P This is the depiction and description of who God is, in the end. God the Father subjected all things to the son of man (excepting Himself). After all His works were finished, the son, subjects himself in bodily form to God the Father, so God could be the ALL in ALL. This is the picture of who the God of eternity is. This is the God of the eternal day of creation; the true Sabbath day of God. The day that never ends.

Mark 2:27-28: For the above stated reason, this explains what Jesus meant when He said "man was not made for the Sabbath, but the Sabbath was made for man, therefore, the son of man, is Lord of the Sabbath.

Now, here is the thing: The author of the Bible and the One telling the story of His creation, is the eternal God depicted and described through the invisible thread of the Scriptures (I quoted enough to connect the dots, but many more scriptures lead to the same place because the Scriptures testify about the Glory of God: Jesus Christ).

Therefore, the Bible is written and God has spoken from His eternal place in Heaven. However, we still exist in the fullness of time of God's works. Even though He finished them before the foundation of the world.

If God finished His works before He made man (He did), then He spoke creation into existence from his place in eternity (He did), which is depicted in 1 Cor 15:20-28, 27-28 (it is, God eternally dwells in bodily form of the son of man, Jesus Christ).

We should now understand why Col 1:16-17 says all things were created by Him and through Him (God spoke creation by the voice and through the bodily form of Jesus Christ). God spoke creation into existence and the One who lifted up His voice is the One who is the ALL in ALL depicted in 1 Cor 15:27-28; All the fullness of God, eternally dwelling in the bodily form of His own Glory; Jesus Christ.

This means the voice that was heard at Jesus' baptism of John's baptism into repentance and at the transfiguration, came from God, the ALL in ALL. Why or how? Even before the foundation of the world, God finished all His works, therefore God is the God as depicted and described in 1 Cor 15:20-28, 27-28) that spoke creation into existence. He is also the only God that has ever spoken to man about who He is. He eternally abides in the bodily form of His own Glory; Jesus Christ.

This is the God of eternity and this is the only God that has ever spoken!

[polonius]

[quote="B Bob"]
Thesis: The author of the Bible an d the One telling the story of creation is the God of Eternity, and He He permanently and eternally abides in a temple made without hands, and from His own temple, He spoke creation into existence by lifting up His voice of and from His own bodily form; Jesus Christ


Firstly, ALL scripture is authored by God. All writers wrote the scripture under or through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Therefore, if the Bible says it, God said it. If God said it, it is true whether we believe it or not.



QUESTION: "If God said it," how can the bible contain contradictions and errors? Or did God make these contradictions and errors?

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 8 by Talishi]

A creation day is not a 24 hour day. In fact, we are still living in the sixth day of creation.

I agree but there are many bible "literalists" that believe every word in the bible must be taken literally.

JW

Literal: Adherence to the exact letter or the literal sense, where literal means "in accordance with, involving, or being the primary or strict meaning of the word or words; not figurative or metaphorical"

[Talishi]

If God said it, it is true whether we believe it or not.

God listed the bat, basically a winged rat, in the class of fowls:

Leviticus 11:

[13] And these are they which ye shall have in abomination among the fowls; they shall not be eaten, they are an abomination: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
[14] And the vulture, and the kite after his kind;
[15] Every raven after his kind;
[16] And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
[17] And the little owl, and the cormorant, and the great owl,
[18] And the swan, and the pelican, and the gier eagle,
[19] And the stork, the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.

Bats are not birds, whether God says it or not.

[JehovahsWitness]

If God said it, it is true whether we believe it or not.

God listed the bat, basically a winged rat, in the class of fowls

Bird? Insect? Bat or Plane?!


various translations refer to "winged creeping things", "winged four-footed thing ", "winged crawling thing "... The king james bible however refers to "fowls"

The hebrew word here translated is "owph" and while it CAN refer collectively to bird, it also can refer to anything that flies. In fact KJV translates the SAME WORD in Deut 14: 19 as "every creeping thing that flieth". It is clear from the description therefore in Leviticus (the number of legs) that chapter 11: 20 is NOT referring to a bird but insects or creatures that when they crawl move on 4 legs (like a quadruped).

Websters English Dictionary 1828 Fowl - noun, Latin fugio, fugo. Greek. and signifying the flying animal.

The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia says of Fowls - FOWL - foul (oph; peteinon): The word is now generally restricted to the larger, especially the edible birds, but formerly IT DENOTED ALL FLYING CREATURES; in Leviticus 11:20 the King James Version we have even, "all fowls that creep, going upon all four," 11:21, "every flying creeping thing that goeth upon all four."

The Etymology Dictionary tells us the origin of this word is Old Norse fugal, German vogel, Gothic fugls, probably by dissimilation from *flug-la, literally flyer, from the same root as Old English fleogan, modern to fly.


Thus various modern language translations render the word

International Standard Version
However, you may eat winged creatures that crawl on four legs that extend over its head and by which it hops on the ground.

NET Bible
However, this you may eat from all the winged swarming things that walk on all fours, which have jointed legs to hop with on the land.

New Heart English Bible
Yet you may eat these: of all winged creeping things that go on all fours, which have legs above their feet, with which to hop on the earth.

[ttruscott]

Thesis: The author of the Bible an d the One telling the story of creation is the God of Eternity, and He He permanently and eternally abides in a temple made without hands, and from His own temple, He spoke creation into existence by lifting up His voice of and from His own bodily form; Jesus Christ

Genesis 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

In the beginning, everything that God created, including human beings, was very good. That means Satan was very good. That means Adam and Eve were very good. That means the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil was very good. So how come God warned Adam and Eve not to eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, lest they die?

What is your proof 'very good' refers to these things and must apply to them as a moral description?

Please consider:
IF the creation of the physical universe was perfect for GOD's redemption of HIS sinful elect to separate them from the demonic, then "very good" would refer to all of creation being good for HIS purpose while it encompasses those who are evil, both those temporarily evil (the sinful elect) and the eternally evil, (those doomed already).

And the tree was indeed very good. GOD warned them not to eat of it to ensure that they did, a temptation they could not resist which proved to them they were indeed sinners which they had been rejecting, being not ashamed. 'Eating" opened their eyes to their sin, their nakedness which they had before they ate and which just happens to be the same word as cunning /crafty used to describe the evil of the serpent.

Their resulting shame brought them to GOD in repentance, the fig leaves, (where does it say the leaves only covered their genitals, being more often used to refer to a sword belt?) and to GOD's (symbol of) salvation, the skin coats.

Thus from the command not to eat to all the way to being expelled from the garden was the greatest blessing they could have received from their GOD, repentance, redemption and salvation. All they needed was a death to take them back home.

The problems with orthodoxy that you note all rest upon one doctrine: that they, and us, are created on earth as souls / spirits at our conception (the creationsit theory of the creation of the spirit) or at birth, (the traducian theory of the creation of the spirit) which has skewed the meaning of this and every other bible story since the garden.

[ttruscott]

I suspect that God simply created an artificial distinction, declaring by divine fiat, after creation, that the tree was "evil".

There is no support in the Bible that the tree was ever declared to be evil. How do you justify this judgement about the tree?

If we look at the outcome of the tree, the command not to eat and their eating we see a great blessing to them to be given a command to prove to them their sinfulness: Romans 3:20 Therefore no one will be justified in His sight by works of the Law. For the Law merely brings awareness of sin. their eyes were opened and they later received instruction to drop fig leafs for the skin coats, ie, Christ.

Since the the Law is given to bring / prove awareness of sin, for them to get a law proves their sin...which they were not yet ashamed of.

[ttruscott]

QUESTION: "If God said it," how can the bible contain contradictions and errors? Or did God make these contradictions and errors?

I believe that GOD had written what HE wanted to be written. I do not believe it has been conclusively proven there are any errors in the Bible, only errors of misinterpretation of what is written. If there are errors, as you say, HE has included them to suit HIS purpose of separating HIS sinful elect from the eternally reprobate non-elect by redeeming them and making them holy.

Such supposed error would then be part of the chains of darkness binding those doomed already, the clouded mentality of those enslaved by an addiction to evil.

[ttruscott]

If God said it, it is true whether we believe it or not.

God listed the bat, basically a winged rat, in the class of fowls:

Leviticus 11:

[13] And these are they which ye shall have in abomination among the fowls;
...

Bats are not birds, whether God says it or not.

But they are flying creatures:

Fowls: Strong's H5775 - owph
flying creatures, including: fowl, birds, even winged insects, and obviously bats.

[Talishi]

I suspect that God simply created an artificial distinction, declaring by divine fiat, after creation, that the tree was "evil".

There is no support in the Bible that the tree was ever declared to be evil. How do you justify this judgement about the tree?

Because immediately after Adam and Eve ate from the Tree, they obtained knowledge of good and evil, and knew that eating from the tree was evil, and hid from the Lord. If the tree was very good at creation, per Genesis 1, then eating from the tree would also be very good. Therefore the tree was assigned evil status by a mere divine whim after it was created.

[dio9]

[Replying to B Bob]

first off , The bible is not a science textbook explaining how Adam came to be. The bible is a collection of human foibles. How central figures fell short.Noah Abraham Moses David the kings of Israel and Judah . It is not a science book.

The Gospels are a testament about what man can be.
As in Jesus and not only him but all can be compassionate caring honest faithful trusting God kind of people.
In other words God spoke Jesus into being and it was very good.
However I don't think we can limit what God can say by saying that was the only time God could speak. Let's not try to limit what God can say. God can speak the kingdom of heaven on earth into existence too.
So why hasn't he? Perhaps he needs Man's cooperation. Ya think almighty God could need Adam's cooperation to establish justice on earth?