Paradise on Earth

onewithhim · Post by **onewithhim** » Fri Nov 18, 2016 12:25 am

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

JehovahsWitness · Post by **JehovahsWitness** » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:54 pm

[Replying to post 210 by Blastcat]

I read your answer but it is more or less incoherent and I am having trouble gleaning from it what your point is. Could you restate your response, preferably without the (presumed) sarcasm and in complete sentences.

Thanks,

JW

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:58 pm

[Replying to post 209 by JehovahsWitness]
Are you going with Paul's concept of seed?

Galatians 3:15-17New International Version (NIV)

The Law and the Promise

15 Brothers and sisters, let me take an example from everyday life. Just as no one can set aside or add to a human covenant that has been duly established, so it is in this case. 16 The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. Scripture does not say and to seeds, meaning many people, but and to your seed,[a] meaning one person, who is Christ. 17 What I mean is this: The law, introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously established by God and thus do away with the promise.

Since seed can be plural as well as singular in English and in its original language a quick look at the original promise should soon put his interpretation to the test.

Genesis 15:5
And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.

Genesis 22:17
That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies
Genesis 26:4
And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;

Exodus 32:13
Remember Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, thy servants, to whom thou swarest by thine own self, and saidst unto them, I will multiply your seed as the stars of heaven, and all this land that I have spoken of will I give unto your seed, and they shall inherit it for ever.

His interpretation seems a bit shaky?

JehovahsWitness · Post by **JehovahsWitness** » Fri Jan 13, 2017 7:01 pm

postroad wrote: [Replying to post 209 by JehovahsWitness]
Are you going with Paul's concept of seed?

What do you believe "Paul's concept of seed" to be?

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Fri Jan 13, 2017 7:32 pm

[Replying to post 213 by JehovahsWitness]

16 The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. Scripture does not say and to seeds, meaning many people, but and to your seed,meaning one person, who is Christ.

Blastcat · Post by **Blastcat** » Fri Jan 13, 2017 8:32 pm

[Replying to post 211 by JehovahsWitness]

[center]
Blastcat gets busted for sarcasm.[/center]

JehovahsWitness wrote:
I read your answer but it is more or less incoherent and I am having trouble gleaning from it what your point is. Could you restate your response, preferably without the (presumed) sarcasm and in complete sentences.

Maybe it is sarcasm.
Sorry.

I get accused of that a lot. And I'm busted. Mea culpa.
When I get bored because people repeat repeat repeat ... repeat and repeat..

Sorry.

"Woo" is an expression I use when I am very impressed. I think it stems from the word "whoa".

I did mean it sarcastically. I use irony a lot.. and sometimes ... with a bit of an edge to it. I'm not really impressed at all, so I did mean the very opposite, you see.

Some people believe this, some people that... some people like chocolate, some vanilla. So what?

You can go ahead and like lemon for all I care.
Really.

What I care about is the truth of beliefs.
If you can demonstrate that what you believe is TRUE in anyway, I'd be interested in those. If you can't explain to anyone why your beliefs are true, forget it, man.

So, I had an honest reaction, but I might not have expressed it very well.

Woo.. look at that .. woo woo woo... woo. I DON'T CARE if you take the Bible literally or whatnot... It doesn't matter that others do or did. Some people agree with you , but mostly NOT.

Two BILLION people are some kind of "Christians", but if what they believe in is BOGUS ... they are all WRONG, and that is an EXTREMELY sad state of afairs for the entire WORLD. Two billion people being SO wrong REALLY matters.

I don't know, JW, it's just that I'm a little less impressed than you are about your wonderful beliefs is all. I'd be WAY more impressed if you could give us ONE good reason to ever believe what you believe is true.

You love your book. Got it. WOOO do I got it.
Others love it too. Ditto. Got it.

You love your religion. YEAH... WOO WOO WOO, really really really really got it, man.
Others love it too. Ditto. Got it too.

Some like red candies, some blue. So what?

I'm so happy for you that I don't know what to do. Like what you like, love what you love... but really?

I do not care what your taste is.

You keep repeating to us what you believe all the time.. I really really really get it.
It's kinda lost it's novelty now.

Sometimes, I get TIRED of the preaching.

At least it really SEEMS to be important for you to keep telling us over and over and over what you happen to believe in.

You know what I don't ever see coming from you? I don't see the words "It's true because..." That's what I don't ever see coming from you.

Now, SOMETIMES, you have interesting info.. about the Bible, mostly. You DO find interesting Bible verses..

But as to your beliefs about them?
I find them extremely and crushingly boring, and completely USELESS in debates.

Sorry about the sarcasm.
I should know better.

I think I meant that ... SO WHAT?

Does any of this make any sense to you?

JehovahsWitness · Post by **JehovahsWitness** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:41 am

Blastcat wrote:Sorry about the sarcasm. I should know better.

No problem, I have been known to tend towards the caustic myself, I'm working on doing better.

Blastcat wrote:What I care about is the truth of beliefs.

Really? Do you believe such a thing can be established? Scientific truths, I can understand you caring about but ... the truth of (religious) beliefs? Do you sincerely believe that such truth can be found? If so, why? Based on what?

JW

JehovahsWitness · Post by **JehovahsWitness** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:46 am

postroad wrote: [Replying to post 213 by JehovahsWitness]

16 The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. Scripture does not say and to seeds, meaning many people, but and to your seed,meaning one person, who is Christ.

Yes, I believe that scripture to be true. Paul did indeed say the above, and it is part of inspired scripture, so I for one, absolutely accept that to be true.

Blastcat · Post by **Blastcat** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:20 am

[Replying to post 216 by JehovahsWitness]

[center]
TRUTH VS FICTION[/center]

JehovahsWitness wrote:
No problem, I have been known to tend towards the caustic myself, I'm working on doing better.

I'm a work in progress.
Thanks for understanding.

Blastcat wrote:What I care about is the truth of beliefs.

JehovahsWitness wrote:
Really? Do you believe such a thing can be established?

Yep.
Of course what we MEAN by truth can be very long to explain... But usually, for starters, I use the word "Truth" to mean "being in accord with fact or reality"

From <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth>

JehovahsWitness wrote:
Scientific truths, I can understand you caring about but ... the truth of (religious) beliefs? Do you sincerely believe that such truth can be found?

A lot of theists seem to think so.

JehovahsWitness wrote:
If so, why? Based on what?

Based on religious testimony. People make truth claims about their religious beliefs.
One such set is "JW" testimony.

I ASSUMED that JW testimony represents SOME kind of truth, and not just "Fiction".
Correct me if I'm wrong.

It would be interesting for me to discover that all along that you believed your religious beliefs were FALSE. I'd be quite surprised, too.

There are true religious propositions, and then, there are other kinds of religious propositions.

What kind of religious propositions do YOU believe in?

JehovahsWitness · Post by **JehovahsWitness** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:04 pm

[Replying to post 218 by Blastcat]

So, correct me if I'm wrong, you base your belief of the existence of something (in this case reigious Truth) ONLY on the testimony of others?

No facts, no physical evidence, not testable or falsifiable data, but you still believe it is possible that religious Truth can exist because other people have said it does?

onewithhim · Post by **onewithhim** » Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:42 pm

This might be the final word on this particular thread, I don't know. But the OP centers on the coming Paradise, and the Bible actually tells us about what to expect in the near future.

There are two choices. Christ compared it to the choice of one or the other of two roads. One is "broad and spacious," on which people are permitted freedom to please themselves. The other road is "cramped," or, "small" and "narrow." (Matt. 7:13,14) The people on that road are required to obey the instructions and laws of God. The majority are taking the broad road, and only a few, Jesus noted, are taking the narrow one. Which road will we each choose? We must keep this in mind: The broad road will suddenly come to a dead end---destruction. (Matt.7:13) The narrow road will lead us right through the Great Tribulation and into God's new system of things. There we can share in making the earth a glorious paradise, where we can live forever in happiness.

It's simply not true that there are different roads that lead to the same happy place. There is only one. There was just one ark that made it through the Great Flood, not a bunch of boats. We can't conclude that all religions lead to the same goal. (Matt.7:21-23; 24:21)

Try and keep the picture of God's promised new system of things vivid in your mind. Think about it every day---Paradise on Earth. It is no dream. It is real. The Bible promise is certain to be fulfilled: "The righteous will possess the earth, and they will reside forever upon it....When the wicked ones are cut off, you will see it." (Psalm 37:29, 34)