What is the logic behind Jesus' crucifixion?

[Justin108]

I have been asking this question over and over on this forum and no theist has ever been able to address it. They try, but once I give my rebuttal to their attempts, they eventually stop replying. Hopefully I can get an answer this time.

Note: This topic is specifically for Christians who believe Jesus' death was necessary for us to have our sins forgiven.

This is arguably the core of the Christian faith that Jesus died for our sins and made it possible for us to live for eternity in heaven... but why did Jesus have to die in order for us to have our sins forgiven?

God makes the rules. There is no "God HAD to sacrifice Jesus" because God can do anything.

Christians often say that God cannot let sin go unpunished as it would be unjust; but is it any more just to sacrifice an innocent man on behalf of a guilty man? If a man rapes a little girl and the man's brother offers to go to prison on his behalf, would this be justice?

If god is satisfied by punishment without guilt (Jesus), why is he not satisfied with guilt without punishment?

[JehovahsWitness]

t why did Jesus have to die in order for us to have our sins forgiven?

There was no other legitimate way to annul the inherited sin Adam's children were born under. This Adamic sin means that no human could live forever and God wanted to give obedient mankind the chance to live forever as per his original purpose.

For further explanation please consult video below (4"mins)

[Justin108]

There was no other legitimate way to annul the inherited sin Adam's children were born under.

Of course there was. God is omnipotent. If he did not want sin to be inheritable, he could have simply made sin an uninheritable trait.


I wonder if JehovahsWitness is going to stick around for this debate. He's usually the first to disappear the moment he can't answer a question. Let's see what happens!

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 3 by Justin108]

Do you understand the difference between being able to do something and it being the right thing to do?

[Justin108]

[Replying to post 3 by Justin108]

Do you understand the difference between being able to do something and it being right thing to do?

Okay explain to me how God deciding to make sin an inheritable trait was the "right" thing to do

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 5 by Justin108]


I'll consider it after you answer my question and provide evidence that what you say is true. It's important because God "can" do anything that doesn't mean its right to do everything.

JW

[Justin108]

I'll consider it after you answer my question and provide evidence that what you say is true.

Evidence for what exactly...?

As for your question, I assume you're referring to this one?

Do you understand the difference between being able to do something and it being the right thing to do?

Yes I understand there is a difference.

Moving on. Can you please explain to me how making sin an inheritable trait was the "right" thing to do?

[Justin108]

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[OnceConvinced]

I have been asking this question over and over on this forum and no theist has ever been able to address it.

I have asked it several times too. Nobody can seem to come up with any reasoning on why an all-powerful god would require the slaughter of an innocent being or animal before he was able or willing to forgive.

It seems that this god must DESIRE the death of an innocent being. He made the rule because he has a desire for blood to be spilt.

God makes the rules. There is no "God HAD to sacrifice Jesus" because God can do anything.

It does seem that the only reason that a blood sacrifice of an innocent being is needed is because God set the rule. After all God could surely forgive without the need for blood to be spilt. If God did set this rule in place... ie it was not something he was forced to do, then the question would be why did he establish that rule? The only reason I could see would be because he desired a barbaric way of dealing with the problem of sin. He got some kind of pleasure out of that rule.

Christians often say that God cannot let sin go unpunished as it would be unjust; but is it any more just to sacrifice an innocent man on behalf of a guilty man? If a man rapes a little girl and the man's brother offers to go to prison on his behalf, would this be justice?

There is no way that it can be just for an innocent man to pay the price for our abominations, even if that man volunteered to do so. It is a complete injustice if a criminal gets off scot free while an innocent person pays for his/her crimes.

It is NOT good news that an innocent man has paid the price for all the atrocities of evil people in this world.

Imagine if Adolf Hitler had been put on trial and some Jew came along and offered to be executed for Adolf, imagine the outrage if the judge said "Ok." Just because someone pays the price does not make it justice. Nor should it appease any rational and caring judge if an innocent man comes forward to take the punishment.

I actually wonder how Christians can look at themselves in the mirror knowing that an innocent man took the punishment for their atrocities. Surely it would be more honourable to stand up in front of God and say "I did those things. I should suffer the consequences. It's completely immoral for Jesus to suffer on my behalf."

I would think that a rational god would be more impressed with that honesty and willingness to take responsibility for ones actions, over someone who is trying to avoid responsibility by accepting the sacrifice of an innocent man.

[OnceConvinced]

t why did Jesus have to die in order for us to have our sins forgiven?

There was no other legitimate way to annul the inherited sin Adam's children were born under.

Says who? Why was there no other legitimate non-bloodthirsty way of annulling the sin?

This Adamic sin means that no human could live forever and God wanted to give obedient mankind the chance to live forever as per his original purpose.

You make out God to be very impotent. Surely God could have someone live forever simply by speaking his will, as he did when he created the universe?

Lets say for a minute that a sinner accepts Jesus's death on the cross. They repent. What happens at that point to take the sinner from being mortal to suddenly being able to live forever?

For further explanation please consult video below (4"mins)

I personally will pass on the video as I am here to debate on the forum, not watch videos. I must also keep up the impression that I'm actually doing work not skiving off.