Salvation Loss. Is it possible?

[Mick]

I believe it is possible for a heaven bound Christian to end up condemned. There are many passages describing this but I believe the parable in Luke 12:42-46 is one of the clearest.

In this parable, the word "manager" is singular, showing that there is only one faithful and wise manager being spoken of. Looking at the verses, we have:

a) V.42 tells us of a faithful and wise manager (obviously a saved man) who is put in charge while the master (Jesus) is away.

b) Vs. 43-44 say that the servant will be rewarded and put in charge of all the master's possessions if the master returns and finds that the servant has remained faithful.

c) Vs. 45-46 then tells us that the same servant will be condemned and assigned a place with the unbelievers (in hell) if the master returns and finds that he is sinning and mistreating the other servants etc.

To say that the servant will be assigned a place with unbelievers makes it obvious that he was a believer initially.

To me, this is one of several parables and passages which clearly show that a Christian can be rewarded or condemned, depending on his actions.

Loss of salvation is a vitally important issue.

What do you think of this parable?

[Benoni]

Hebrews 13:5 Amplified Bible (AMP)

5 Let your character [your moral essence, your inner nature] be free from the love of money [shun greed—be financially ethical], being content with what you have; for He has said, “I will never [under any circumstances] desert you [nor give you up nor leave you without support, nor will I in any degree leave you helpless], nor will I forsake or let you down or relax My hold on you [assuredly not]!�

[Benoni]

[Replying to post 1 by Mick]

There are many levels of salvation some 30, 60 and 100 fold. Salvation is an act of grace not an act of mans will. All men reject God under the curse of Adam and some grow religiously and loose their religious belief but that is not salvation.

[Mick]

[Replying to post 1 by Mick]

There are many levels of salvation some 30, 60 and 100 fold. Salvation is an act of grace not an act of mans will. All men reject God under the curse of Adam and some grow religiously and loose their religious belief but that is not salvation.

But how do you interpret the parable which says that a servant can be either rewarded or condemned when Jesus returns?

[Benoni]

[Replying to Mick]

What is condemnation? It comes from the same root a judged in the Greek. God's judgement are just. How do these "saviours" judge the fleshly man, Esau? To answer this, we need to know what the word "judgment" means. In the New Testament, the word used is "Krisis", which we have changed to "Crisis". In English, it means "a critical period of time, a decisive moment, turning point, deciding time." In Greek, it means "a separating, choosing, deciding, determining, judging, trial, judgment."
In the New Testament, the word judgment (Krisis) is used to denote the deciding time, trial, or probation of man. This time of judgment is spoken of in scripture in such a way as to indicate that it is given to man as a blessing and a favor. It is shown as a cause for great rejoicing and thanksgiving. In Psalm 96, all nature and people are told to exult and rejoice "Before the Lord, for He cometh to judge the world. He shall judge the world with righteousness and the people with his truth."
Judgment time as a period of great rejoicing is in striking contrast to the orthodox view of a time of horror and dread! It would almost seem we were reading from a different Bible. No — it is the same Bible, but it is "the good tidings of great joy" that the angels said "shall be unto all people." These good tidings have been obscured by the traditions of men and clouded over by carnal reasoning. As a result, we have been taught that only a remnant would be saved and the remainder of mankind would suffer the tortures of an everlasting hell.

[Mick]

[Replying to Mick]

What is condemnation?

The simple answer is in the parable I asked your opinion on. It says that the servant who is unfaithful will be cut to pieces and assigned a place with the unbelievers. Now that's judgment and condemnation.

Do you see the parable this way or do you have another understanding?

God bless,
Mick

[Benoni]

[Replying to Mick]

So are you saying God is going torture trillions of people He never called? I see God's judgment as spiritual not torture. All flesh shall see the salvation of God.

[Mick]

[Replying to Mick]

So are you saying God is going torture trillions of people He never called? I see God's judgment as spiritual not torture. All flesh shall see the salvation of God.

My friend, hell is another subject but this thread is concerning the parable of Luke 12:42-46. In my opening post I outlined what I believe the parable is saying. What do you say?

God bless,
Mick

[Left Site]

[Replying to Mick]

So are you saying God is going torture trillions of people He never called? I see God's judgment as spiritual not torture. All flesh shall see the salvation of God.

Try looking at that from a different perspective. There are those that let themselves be called and those that refuse to hear God calling:

Romans 1:18  "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19  Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20  For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead<(divinity, as in higher nature); so that they are without excuse..."

God calls everyone but not everyone is willing to hear:

Psalms 19:1  "The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2  Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3  There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard."

Acts 17:26  "And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
27  That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us..."

[Benoni]

[Replying to Mick]

This is what the narrow way is all about Not the belief that Billions will be loss. But that God has an elect and the elect by the spirit KNOW His voice and are eating the meat of truth. There are two groups of believers in the Book of Revelations those who will rule and reign and everyone else. The overcomers are God's elect. Not all believes are God’s elect. The meat here is spiritual meat. You see most only can drink spiritual milk for they will choke on a spiritual stake for they may be spiritual giants in their church or system but our spiritual babes and for that reason not grown spiritual teeth. It takes teeth to CHEW on a thick steak.

Many are drunk on their beliefs for they have drunken the old wine and anything spiritual new they reject so they reject the new wine of revelation. Rev. 17:6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

Notice the servant will get his portion of glory so will the unbeliever.

wise steward Luke 12:42-46 King James Version (KJV)
42 And the Lord said, Who then is that faithful and wise steward, whom his lord shall make ruler over his household, to give them their portion of meat in due season?
43 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.
44 Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath.
45 But and if that servant say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to beat the menservants and maidens, and to eat and drink, and to be drunken;
46 The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers.