The kingdom of God.

[Checkpoint]

Some seem to think it is entirely future, while others give the impression they are always thinking of it as present, and to not be looking at the future in kingdom terms at all.

Jesus had much to say about the kingdom, including this:

Luke 16:

6 The Law and the Prophets were until John; since then the good news of the kingdom of God is preached, and everyone is being zealously urged into it.

So, where do you stand as to whether it is present, future, or has both a present and a future aspect?

On what basis?

According to which scriptures?

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 268 by Checkpoint]

The point is Jesus has a government; unless he has a government AND a kingdom, they are both the same thing. If you believe that the kingdom and the government are different all you have to do is explain what the difference is and what role he plays in each.




JW

[tam]

[Replying to post 269 by JehovahsWitness]

Of course He has a kingdom and a 'government'. I'm not sure how you disagree with that? He is the King; He shares His reign with His Bride (they reign with Him for a thousand years as kings and priests); and His Kingdom also includes those who are not part of the 'government': the subjects of the Kingdom, subjects who are also invited into the Kingdom.

Then the King (Christ) will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave Me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave Me something to drink, I was a stranger and you took Me in, I was naked and you clothed Me, I was sick and you looked after Me, I was in prison and you visited Me."




Some reading might not realize that this is referring to the subjects of the Kingdom, and not the Bride (not Christians) herself, but you agree that this is speaking about the subjects, yes? And so, not the 'government' of the Kingdom? So unless you are going to suggest that the subjects of the Kingdom live outside the Kingdom, then the Kingdom must also encompass the earth (as part of the territory of the Kingdom).

King... Bride (kings and priests who reign with Christ in His Kingdom)... subjects.

All three are in the Kingdom; but only the King and the Bride make up the 'government'.


Is there anything that you disagree with in the above (other than who makes up the Bride)?


Peace to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[JehovahsWitness]

only the King and the Bride make up the 'government'.

I would agree with this, we believe that only Jesus and 144,000 (the bride class) make up or a part of the government but there are indeed two "classes" those who rule in the government and those who don't. Everyone who does not will be subjects of the government.

the Kingdom must also encompass the earth (as part of the territory of the Kingdom).

Yes, there can be no kingdom without a domain. This is what Jehovah's Witnesses preach from door to door: the good news of the coming government that will rule over the entire territory of the earth. It will rid the earth (ie all those living in its territory of the earth) of all sickness, and suffering. The earth will be "as it is in heaven" . The earth will be a garden like paradise.

When do you think the government was it set up? Do you too believe the government was set up in the Roman Era?

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 270 by tam]


So what do you think the answer to my question is?

To learn more please go to other posts related to...

THE KINGDOM, THE MILLENIUM and ...THE EARTHLY PARADISE

[tam]

only the King and the Bride make up the 'government'.

I would agree with this, we believe that only Jesus and 144,000 (the bride class) make up or a part of the government but there are indeed two "classes" those who rule in the government and those who don't. Everyone who does not will be subjects of the government.

So these subjects are not in the 'government', but they are in the Kingdom, yes?

When do you think the government was it set up? Do you too believe the government was set up in the Roman Era?

What do you mean by 'set up'?

Do you think that the 'government' is 'set up' as soon as Christ was made King (if so, then the 'government' was set up when Christ was given all authority in heaven and on earth - couple thousand years ago)? If you think the government is set up when the Bride is included (after having been married to the King), then it has not yet been set up. Not until Christ returns to gather His own up, to be married; and this has not yet occurred.



Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 268 by Checkpoint]

The point is Jesus has a government; unless he has a government AND a kingdom, they are both the same thing. If you believe that the kingdom and the government are different all you have to do is explain what the difference is and what role he plays in each.




JW

Yes, that is exactly the point, [b[Jesus has a government[/b].

And, it is on his shoulders; that is what we do agree on.

How sad that we are now differing on an unnecessary and counter-productive sidetrack.

Let's soon get back on the main track.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 274 by Checkpoint]

Good so we'll, just refer to the kingdom government and that will cover every thing.ie

What is God's Kingdom for which Jesus taught us to pray? It is a kingdom government that will rule over the earth and have numerous subjects that will not be ruling with Jesus in the government but will benefit from its rule.

When we pray for the "kingdom to come" we are praying for this kingdom-government and all the benefits that it will existend to its subjects.Some Christians will be ruling in the government, others will be subjects of that kingdom-government.

Agreed?

[McCulloch]

What is God's Kingdom for which Jesus taught us to pray? It is a kingdom government that will rule over the earth and have numerous subjects that will not be ruling with Jesus in the government but will benefit from its rule.

When we pray for the "kingdom to come" we are praying for this kingdom-government and all the benefits that it will existend to its subjects. Some Christians will be ruling in the government, others will be subjects of that kingdom-government.

Why is the kingdom still to come? If the kingdom government is so beneficial, why has God delayed its implementation for thousands of years?

[marco]

God's kingdom refers to his heavenly government which has been in operation since the year 1914

I suspect you sincerely believe this. I suspect that the phrase: "God's government" does not present to you any cause for ridicule. That you can write this, knowing the reaction, calls for courage of one's convictions.

In a miniscule way I begin to understand the faith of those who stood silent as flames licked around them. I hope it was for some high purpose, and the kingdom they sacrificed themselves for, was really there.

I do not believe there is a "KINGDOM of God" except in metaphor and poetry.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 277 by marco]


Firstly, thank you for your kind words, they are much appreciated; Jesus the kindly carpenter from Nazareth claimed to be the son of God; he was ridiculed for that so when it comes to riducule by those that don't believe, I am in good company. Ridicule only affects me if it is coming from people whose opinion I respect; and those that stoop to ridicule rather than reason can have no respect from me, so all is good with the world.

"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." - Mahatma Gandhi

My understanding is you are an atheist, so naturally you don't believe god has a government, god cannot have anything because for you there *is* no God; it is unclear if you think that *if* an omnipotent all powerful God that could do anything did exist, ominipotene does not allow for God to have a kingdom-government, but I suppose that would depend on what is meant by omnipotent. However divine governement is something mentioned specifically in the bible which is why we believers are discussing the topic in this thread.

Again thank you for your very kind words and encouragement,



JEHOVAHS WITNESS