Jesus will say, "I never knew you."

[inthevoid]

In Matthew 7:21-23, the Bible claims that Jesus will say to the people in the last day that he 'never knew them' in regards to people who are false followers of Christ.

My question is, how is that so?

According to Christians, Jesus is supposedly God, yet God will not know who he speaks to on the last day?

Psalms is littered with scripture mentioning that God knows all things in man and his heart(Psalm 44:21, 94:11, etc). Even in Luke 12:7, it mentions that God knows the exact number of hairs on all our heads.

So how is it that on the last day God will say he 'never knew you' when it clearly shows that he does?

Perhaps this just proves that Jesus is not God at all? Perhaps Jesus was just a servant sent only as flesh?

[inthevoid]

For example "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."~Jesus

Yes, this is what I'm getting at here. Ties in with my first post somewhat.

[inthevoid]

[Replying to post 30 by Tart]

Alright, I'm glad you are seeing this angle.

Don't go crazy like I did. Digest it slow. I know how ex-Christianity can be like. I'm no guru.

I'm figuring this out just as much as you are.

[Tart]

For example "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."~Jesus

Yes, this is what I'm getting at here. Ties in with my first post somewhat.

Yes, i myself have bad interpretations, and limited understanding. In my debates, i understand i can be wrong.. That is for sure... I think i misunderstood the original post... I dont believe Jesus is God, but the Son of God... To be honest, im not too sure about the relationship of knowledge between the Son and the Father, it is only something I can speculate on...

[inthevoid]

Yes, i myself have bad interpretations, and limited understanding. In my debates, i understand i can be wrong.. That is for sure... I think i misunderstood the original post... I dont believe Jesus is God, but the Son of God... To be honest, im not too sure about the relationship of knowledge between the Son and the Father, it is only something I can speculate on...

Yes. I mean beyond this point is pure speculation and opinion based from individual to individual. I have my own ideas as well.

However, I agree that Jesus cannot be God and that he was merely a messenger who did not know everyone intimately as God does. This verse is abused by Christians into fear tactics to follow said preacher bypassing alot of logic. Truly unfortunate for so many people to fall into these kinds of traps and false logic.

I wanted someone to at least challenge my argument before I became more convinced myself.

[inthevoid]

Peace to you,


In response to bjs, you (the OP) asked,

Could you provide scripture to prove your point? I provided mine.

This does not mean that Christ is God (YHWH), but here is one such scripture:

But [Jesus] did not entrust Himself to them, for He knew all men. He did not need any testimony about man, for He knew what was in a man. John 2:24, 25



When Christ says to some people "I never knew you", He is speaking of an intimate knowing; a union. They (the people from your example) call Him Lord and claim or believe that they are in Him (and Him in them); but they are not; He never knew them.



Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

My mistake Tam. I overlooked your post as well. We are in agreement. At least up to the YHWH part.

Peace to you.

[Overcomer]

inthevoid wrote:

I am suggesting Jesus doesn't know them intimately but only knows them from happenstance by seeing them before sometime in his life. Knowing how someone looks aesthetically does not mean you know them intimately.

Thus God only knows all humans intimately and aesthetically. Jesus does not. Thus Jesus is not God

.

Does God know us all intimately? Yes, he does. That means he knows us inside out. According to Scripture, that means that he even knows how many hairs are on each of our heads. No problem there.

It's when you try to apply that information to the passage where Jesus talks about not knowing somebody that the mistake is made. The Greek verb that is translated as "knew" in English is one that speaks to being in a relationship with someone. Therefore, Jesus is saying that, there may be people who call out his name and say they acted on his behalf, but they were never in a relationship with him. That's what being a follower of Christ is all about -- being in a relationship with him.

So when Jesus talks about not knowing somebody in that passage from Matthew, it has nothing to do with Jesus "having seen someone before in his life" but not getting to know them. It has everything to do with their not entering into a relationship with him because they didn't understand who he was, why he came, what it meant to be his follower.

So, to go back to my original statement about God knowing us intimately, that refers to his omniscience and the fact that he knows everything. It has nothing to do with relationship.

As for omniscience and how it applies to Jesus, we know from Phil. 2:6 that Jesus was indeed God (it says he was in essence God), but chose to set aside his divine attributes (Phil. 2:7) when he came to earth. Jesus was indeed God Incarnate.

[inthevoid]

It's when you try to apply that information to the passage where Jesus talks about not knowing somebody that the mistake is made. The Greek verb that is translated as "knew" in English is one that speaks to being in a relationship with someone. Therefore, Jesus is saying that, there may be people who call out his name and say they acted on his behalf, but they were never in a relationship with him. That's what being a follower of Christ is all about -- being in a relationship with him.

So when Jesus talks about not knowing somebody in that passage from Matthew, it has nothing to do with Jesus "having seen someone before in his life" but not getting to know them. It has everything to do with their not entering into a relationship with him because they didn't understand who he was, why he came, what it meant to be his follower.

If you look at the Greek translation as you've tried to claim, the word 'knew' is spelt "ginóskó" in the interlinear Bible (https://biblehub.com/greek/1097.htm).

As you can see in the link, the definition as 'knew' doesn't mean what you claim it to mean; which you seem to alter to some other definition other than mentioned in the actual translation.

It either means to 'know someone as a firsthand acquaintance' or to 'perceive' by 'knowing them'.

Therefore, are you claiming that God will not know you as a first hand acquaintance or he will not perceive you on the last day at all; and still claim to have never known you?

As for omniscience and how it applies to Jesus, we know from Phil. 2:6 that Jesus was indeed God (it says he was in essence God), but chose to set aside his divine attributes (Phil. 2:7) when he came to earth. Jesus was indeed God Incarnate.

And of course these words are coming from Paul who himself is not Jesus, so to make a claim on someone's behalf is really null; unless Jesus himself claimed to be God, which I don't see anywhere in the Bible being claimed by Jesus himself.

[Bust Nak]

Okay. Well that answers that. You've come in here mentioning sex acts with God and now you are pleading innocence.

Good to know.

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[rikuoamero]

[Replying to inthevoid]

The very clear implication of Jesus words in Matthew 7 was that the person who he was speaking to, the person who called Jesus “Lord,� was not a subject of Jesus.

Jesus was not saying that he literally did not know who the person was. Rather, the person was not in a genuine relationship with Jesus which make would make calling Jesus “Lord� and honest statement.

I have to ask: Did you genuinely read this passage and think, “Huh. Jesus literally does not know who that person is�? It seems likely such a wildly unnatural reading of the passage that I am have a hard time wrapping my mind around how someone could get there. Can you explain your thought process a little more?

I think OP can be excused for thinking "Huh. Jesus literally does not know who that person is" given the existence of strains of Christianity that preach a literal understanding/reading of the Bible.

[ttruscott]

Shoot perhaps the verse you referenced about Jesus never knowing someone is true.. Maybe Jesus literally didnt know them, but I take this verse as having an intimate relationship with Jesus for salvation.

OR: as most commentaries accept, He knew them in fact becasue He created them but HE did NOT have nor ever did have an intimate or a loving relationship with them as HE did (does) with other people.