Will the Parousia occur during our lifetime?

[polonius]

Jesus prophecized that the second coming would occur while some of his generation were still alive, but it didn't.

There is some claim that really occurred in 1914. But it didn't. So, what's the claim now?

www.britannica.com/topic/Jehovahs-Witnesses

The Adventist movement emerged in the 1830s around the predictions of William Miller, who proclaimed that Jesus Christ would return in 1843 or 1844.

When Christ did not return as Miller prophecied, Adventists divided into a number of factions.

During the 1870s, Charles Taze Russell established himself as an independent and controversial Adventist teacher.

He rejected belief in hell as a place of eternal torment and adopted a non-Trinitarian theology that denied the divinity of Jesus. He also interpreted the Second Coming in accordance with the literal translation of the original Greek term, parousia (presence), suggesting that Christ would come as an invisible presence and that the Parousia, or Millennial Dawn, already had occurred, in 1874.

The coming of Christs invisible presence signaled the end of the current order of society and would be followed by his visible presence and the establishment of the millennial kingdom on earth in 1914.

Although the kingdom did not come, Russells teachings motivated a number of volunteers to circulate his many books and pamphlets and a periodical, The Watchtower, and to recalculate the time of the Parousia.

So when will Christ's visible presence and the establishment of the millennial kingdom on earth occur?

[myth-one.com]

The millennium should occur within the period of years 2040 to 2061, with the likely date being the year 2042.

Would you be so kind as to explain the bases for the above?

One cannot calculate the approximate date of the Second Coming without first understanding the following verse:

Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. (Exodus 20:8)

So what is the sabbath day?

It is a sign... (Exodus 31:13)

It is a sign... (Exodus 31:17)

I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign... (Ezekiel 20:12)

It is clearly a sign of something.

The Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is in six days and rested on the seventh day.

A Sabbath is a period of rest following six equal periods of work. The periods are not always equal to a day:

Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye come into the land which I give you, then shall the land keep a sabbath unto the Lord. Six years thou shalt sow thy field, and six years thou shalt prune thy vineyard, and gather in the fruit thereof; But in the seventh year shall be a sabbath of rest unto the land, a sabbath for the Lord: thou shalt neither sow thy field, nor prune thy vineyard. (Leviticus 25:2-4)

The Sabbath defined above for farmland is to sow and harvest the land for six years, then let it rest the seventh year.

And according to the Bible, there will be a period of rest for God's people.

There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. (Hebrews 4:9-10)

This period of rest for God's people will be the Millennium which begins at the Second Coming.

For the millennium to be a Sabbath, it must have been preceded by six equal periods of work.

Therefore, from the Genesis creation of man, we should have six one thousand year long periods of work before the millennium Sabbath begins!

So the sign which the six-day Genesis recreation followed by the Sabbath day of rest points to is what we are living through presently! This is the age of man. Our age will be six thousand years of work, or six days to God since a thousand years is like one of our days, followed by a thousand years of rest which is the millennium Sabbath.

Therefore, the Second Coming will occur 6,000 years from the creation of man.

Let's begin the adventure of deriving an equation for determining how to calculate the year of the Second Coming! That date will be 6,000 years from the creation of Adam.

[center]Calculating the approximate date of the Second Coming[/center]

Since the Second Coming will be 6,000 years from man's creation -- as the sign of the sabbath indicates, the goal is to determine how many years have elapsed since the creation of Adam & Eve in the garden -- then comparing that result with 6,000.

Let's begin with Adam and accumulate the sequential years by tracing mankind's genealogy forward about 2,000 years from the creation of man:

Subtotal: 0 years
Genesis 5:3 And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, and after his image; and called his name Seth: (130 years)
Subtotal: 130 years
Genesis 5:6 And Seth lived an hundred and five years, and begat Enos: (105 years)
Subtotal: 235 years
Genesis 5:9 And Enos lived ninety years, and begat Cainan: (90 years)
Subtotal: 325 years
Genesis 5:12 And Cainan lived seventy years and begat Mahalaleel: (70 years)
Subtotal: 395 years
Genesis 5:15 And Mahalaleel lived sixty and five years, and begat Jared: (65 years)
Subtotal: 460 years
Genesis 5:18 And Jared lived an hundred sixty and two years, and he begat Enoch: (162)
Subtotal: 622 years
Genesis 5:21 And Enoch lived sixty and five years, and begat Methuselah: (65 years)
Subtotal: 687 years
Genesis 5:25 And Methuselah lived an hundred eighty and seven years, and begat Lamech. (187 years)
Subtotal: 874 years
Genesis 5:28 And Lamech lived an hundred eighty and two years, and begat a son:
29 And he called his name Noah, (182 years)
Subtotal: 1056 years
Genesis 5:32 And Noah was five hundred years old: and Noah begat Shem, . . . (500)
Subtotal: 1556 years
Genesis 11:10 These are the generations of Shem: Shem was an hundred years old, and begat Arphaxad two years after the flood: (100 years)
Subtotal: 1656 years
Genesis 11:12 And Arphaxad lived five and thirty years, and begat Salah: (35 years)
Subtotal: 1691 years
Genesis 11:14 And Salah lived thirty years, and begat Eber: (30 years)
Subtotal: 1721 years
Genesis 11:16 And Eber lived four and thirty years, and begat Peleg: (34 years)
Subtotal: 1755 years
Genesis 11:18 And Peleg lived thirty years, and begat Reu: (30 years)
Subtotal: 1785 years
Genesis 11:20 And Reu lived two and thirty years, and begat Serug: (32 years)
Subtotal: 1817 years
Genesis 11:22 And Serug lived thirty years, and begat Nahor: (30 years)
Subtotal: 1847 years
Genesis 11:24 And Nahor lived nine and twenty years, and begat Terah (29 years)
Subtotal: 1876 years
Genesis 11:26 And Terah lived seventy years, and begat Abram . . . (70 years)
Subtotal: 1946 years
Genesis 16:16 And Abram was fourscore and six years old, when Hagar bare Ishmael to Abram. (86 years)
Subtotal: 2032 years
Abrams name was changed to Abraham:

Genesis 17:5 Neither shall thy name any more be called Abram, but thy name shall be Abraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee.

Genesis 21:5 And Abraham was an hundred years old, when his son Isaac was born unto him. (100 years)
total: 2132 years

(The entire geneology of Jesus Christ is given in Luke 3:23-38. There are 77 generations -- Click here.)

But let's look at one generation from the above string:

Genesis 5:28 And Lamech lived an hundred eighty and two years, and begat a son: And he called his name Noah, (182 years)
Subtotal: 1056 years

Taken in context, these verses state that Lamach begat Noah 1056 years from the creation of Adam.

These 1056 years are Anno Mundi (AM) or "in the year of the world." That is, they are years measured from the first man Adam.

Coming from the other direction, (from the birth of Jesus), historical records indicate that Noah was born in the year 2948 BC.

Thus 1056 AM is the same year as 2948 BC. Noah was born in the year 1056 AM or 2948 BC.

The sum of these two numbers will be the time from the creation of Adam to the birth of Jesus as they cover that entire time.

--------(forward)-------(meeting point)-------(time backward)----- (Year 1 AD) ----------------------------- 2020 AD

Adam --------------> Noah at 1056 AM < -------------------------- Birth of Jesus --------------------------> current year
Adam --------------> Noah at 2948 BC <--------------------------- Birth of Jesus ---------------------------> current year

To the Right of "birth of Jesus" begins current time in AD.

So the current number of years since the birth of Adam will be AM + BC + AD:

1056 + 2948 +2020 = 6024 years since the creation of man.

And the second coming should have occurred (6024 - 6000) = 24 years ago in 1996.

The general equation is:

(DOB in AM) + (DOB in BC) + (present year AD) = Years since the creation of Adam

The Second Coming should be 6000 from the creation of Adam, so subtract 6000.

If the result is positive, then the Second Coming should have been that many years ago. That is, we overshot the date.

If the result is negative, then the Second Coming should occur in that many years.

Let's quickly take another pair:

Genesis 16:16 And Abram was fourscore and six years old, when Hagar bare Ishmael to Abram. (86 years)
Subtotal: 2032 years

Ask the internet "When was the biblical Ishmael born?" and get 1910 BC. Then:

2032 + 1910 + 2020 = 5962 years since Adam was created.

5962 - 6000 = - 38 years

So the Second coming should occur in 2020 + 38 or 2058 AD.

The accuracy for any one of the 77 generations will depend on the accuracy of the historical values.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 100 by myth-one.com]

Okay so I get youre sayjng approx 6000 years from Adams creation to 1996.

But how did we get from 1996 to 2020? And I dont understand why we are adding on the 38 years.

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to post 100 by myth-one.com]

Okay so I get youre sayjng approx 6000 years from Adams creation to 1996.

But how did we get from 1996 to 2020? And I dont understand why we are adding on the 38 years.

The general equation is:

(DOB in AM) + (DOB in BC) + (present year AD) = Years since the creation of Adam

The Second Coming should be 6000 from the creation of Adam, so subtract 6000 from the "Years since the creation of Adam" as calculated above.

If the result is positive, then the Second Coming should have been that many years ago in the past. That is, we overshot the date.

If the result is negative, then the Second Coming should occur in that many years in the future.

=====================================================

For example:

Genesis 16:16 And Abram was fourscore and six years old, when Hagar bare Ishmael to Abram. (86 years)
Subtotal: 2032 years

Ask the internet "When was the biblical Ishmael born?" and get 1910 BC. Then:

So Ishmael was begotten 2032 AM + 1910 BC + 2020 Ad = 5962 years since Adam was created.

Subtract 6000 from that result.

5962 - 6000 = - 38 years

If the Second Coming will be 6000 years from the creation of Adam, and 2020 is only 5962 years from the creation of Adam, then the Second Coming will be another 38 years in the future.

Or in the year 2020 + 38 = 2058 AD.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 102 by myth-one.com]

Okay I'm a math idiot but I get the general idea...its basically 6000 years from Adam and the variants are where the 6000 total ending in 1996 might need adjusting. I can't be too hard on you, we fell into the same trap, but have learnt Jesus wasn't joking when he said that certain details are not for us to know.

But as I said we went down the same line of thinking back in 1975 and have learnt our lesson. We are firmly ressolved to repeat that error again.

JW

MARK 13:32, 33

Concerning that day or the hour nobody knows, neither the angels in heaven nor the Son, but the Father. Keep looking, keep awake, for you do not know when the appointed time is.

ACTS 1:7
It does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the Father has placed in his own jurisdiction.

[PinSeeker]

[Replying to post 103 by JehovahsWitness]

LOL! The bottom line is, don't worry about when exactly it's going to occur. Just know that at the appointed (by God) time, it will happen. Don't try to predict, because it is not for man to know the times or epochs which the Father has fixed by His own authority. And... be ready.

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to post 102 by myth-one.com]

Okay I'm a math idiot but I get the general idea...its basically 6000 years from Adam and the variants are where the 6000 total ending in 1996 might need adjusting. I can't be too hard on you, we fell into the same trap, but have learnt Jesus wasn't joking when he said the "date" (year) cannot be calculated. There is no underminding a clear statement from Christ, no matter how eagre we may be.

But as I said we went down the same line of thinking back in 1975 and have learnt our lesson. We are firmly ressolved to repeat that error again.

JW

Yes, only God the Father knows the exact date of the Second Coming:

But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father. (Mark 13:32)

My equation does not give an exact date.

It gives an area generally around 6000 years from the creation of Adam.

And God gave us that sign to look for in the Sabbath Day -- to anticipate the Secong Coming.

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to post 103 by JehovahsWitness]

LOL! The bottom line is, don't worry about when exactly it's going to occur. Just know that at the appointed (by God) time, it will happen. Don't try to predict, because it is not for man to know the times or epochs which the Father has fixed by His own authority. And... be ready.

Then why did He give us a sign?

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 105 by myth-one.com]

Fair enough, most taken the expression to idiomatically include "the year"

When the diciples asked about his return they asked ": Lord, are you restoring the kingdom to Israel at this time? and didnt specifically say this hour, day, month, or year. In other words the question was open enough to include the year.... Further, Jesus could have replied "look to scripture, you'll figure out the year... but not the day, month or hour" but instead his reply implied their question itself was misplaced even though they made no mention of day or hour.

ACTS 1:7
It does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the Father has placed in his own jurisdiction.

It's also interesting that at the time, neither he himself nor the angels in heaven knew the day nor the hour, yet if the calculations were based purely on historical events, anchored on the year of Adams creation both would have easily been able to calculate the day, month and year. They all knew from being witnesses of key events exactly when everyone was born. There's "a wild card" in there that not even Jesus could figure out at the time.

MARK 13:32, 33

Concerning that day or the hour nobody knows, neither the angels in heaven nor the Son, but the Father. Keep looking, keep awake, for you do not know when the appointed time is.

But still you do indeed have this linguistic "wiggle room", we ourselves believe there are "seasons" that can be identified in advance (The "harvest season" of the last days for example) just not that one, which is, as Jesus said under Gods jurisdiction. But you gotta do what you gotta do. We have travelled down that path, so I for one can understand your position although I disagree with it.


JW

[myth-one.com]

We have travelled down that path, so I for one can understand your position although I disagree with it.
JW

So the sabbath is not a sign pointing to the Second Coming and Millennium?

There won't be a rest for the people of God?

That is the basis upon which my algorithm was formulated.

[JehovahsWitness]

So the sabbath is not a sign pointing to the Second Coming and Millennium?

I dont know what that means... is the Sabbath an antitype, a pattern for the 1000 year rule of Christ? Yes. Can we use it to calculate the year of Christ's return? No I dont believe so.

There won't be a rest for the people of God?

Sure there will be.

That is the basis upon which my algorithm was formulated.

I understand the basis for it. I just dont believethat basis can be used to calculate the exact year of the return of Christ (and the start of the millenuim). In short, the 6000 years may well be pivitol but there there are elements in the final date (year) that cannot be calculated. In short we may have x (6000 years since Adams creation) ....but we dont have y=? ("wild card") so we cannot calculate "z" (year of Christ's return).

How do we know there's a "wild card" in there? Because its been more than 6000 years since Adams creation and we're still here. How do we know it's not in the scriptures and we have but to search a little harder? Because we believe the year is a time " that the Father has placed in his own jurisdiction".

JW