Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

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Miles
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Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

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Post by Miles »

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"On the day that President Biden signed an executive order allowing transgender people to serve in the military, Republican lawmakers 2,100 miles away in Montana’s capital advanced a law to ban transgender youth from competing in girls’ sports.

Less than a month into their 2021 sessions, GOP state legislators across the United States are relaunching campaigns to restrict transgender people’s access to medical care and school athletics. But this time, their efforts are clashing with the agenda of a Democratic president who has been called the most pro-transgender in history.

Biden signed an executive order on his first day in office to reinstate protections for gender identity that were curbed by the Trump administration. Meanwhile, lawmakers in at least a dozen states have proposed bills in recent weeks that challenge such protections. Some were carried over from 2020 sessions, when a record number of anti-trans bills were filed in state legislatures, according to the ACLU.

Many of those bills target youth and collegiate athletes, with supporters arguing that transgender girls have an unfair physiological advantage in girls’ sports, an edge that can affect access to scholarships.

Tennessee state Rep. Bruce Griffey (R), who has a cisgender daughter on a school golf team, is co-sponsoring a bill that would allow school competition only based on the sex listed on one’s birth certificate."
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So, what do you think, Is it fair to ban transgendered girls from competing in girls’ sports or not? KEEPING IN MIND that no one is talking about banning transgendered boys from competing in boys' sports.


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Re: Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

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Post by AgnosticBoy »

Miles wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 10:33 pm So, what do you think, Is it fair to ban transgendered girls from competing in girls’ sports or not? KEEPING IN MIND that no one is talking about banning transgendered boys from competing in boys' sports.
I can understand that there's an ideology that wants things to be equal, even genders, but we have to square that ideology with biology, or really, nature overall.

If we inform ourselves with biology, and not just ideology, then I would say that it is unfair for transgendered girls to compete in women's sports. The simple fact is that transgendered girls bodies still function as males, that is they have more testosterone, more muscle mass, more explosive strength than biological females, on average. That bodily make up would of course lead to better physical performance, especially when it comes to sports that require upper body strength. BAsed on this fact, I'd expect there to be evidence of transgender girls excelling in women's sports, on average. In a sense, there's already evidence of this if you compare the performances of biological males in sports with those of biological females.

You also asked why we don't hear about bans on transgendered boy competing in boys' sports, well one reason may be that transgendered boys won't have an advantage over boys, on average. If hormone replacement therapy has little to no effect on transgender boys, then I'd be worried that transgendered boys wouldn't excel much in such a sport.

One alternative proposal I've heard is create a sport just for the transgendered population.
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Re: Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

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Post by Miles »

AgnosticBoy wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 11:48 am
Miles wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 10:33 pm So, what do you think, Is it fair to ban transgendered girls from competing in girls’ sports or not? KEEPING IN MIND that no one is talking about banning transgendered boys from competing in boys' sports.
I can understand that there's an ideology that wants things to be equal, even genders, but we have to square that ideology with biology, or really, nature overall.

If we inform ourselves with biology, and not just ideology, then I would say that it is unfair for transgendered girls to compete in women's sports. The simple fact is that transgendered girls bodies still function as males, that is they have more testosterone, more muscle mass, more explosive strength than biological females, on average. That bodily make up would of course lead to better physical performance, especially when it comes to sports that require upper body strength. BAsed on this fact, I'd expect there to be evidence of transgender girls excelling in women's sports, on average. In a sense, there's already evidence of this if you compare the performances of biological males in sports with those of biological females.

You also asked why we don't hear about bans on transgendered boy competing in boys' sports, well one reason may be that transgendered boys won't have an advantage over boys, on average. If hormone replacement therapy has little to no effect on transgender boys, then I'd be worried that transgendered boys wouldn't excel much in such a sport.

One alternative proposal I've heard is create a sport just for the transgendered population.
Gotta agree; although, I seriously doubt there will ever be enough transgendered people, students in particular, to make such a sport feasible.


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Re: Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

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Post by Difflugia »

Miles wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 10:33 pm...an edge that can affect access to scholarships.
Basing academic scholarships on sports performance is unfair.
AgnosticBoy wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 11:48 amOne alternative proposal I've heard is create a sport just for the transgendered population.
Separate, but equal? You'd think someone would have tried that before.

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Re: Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

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Post by AgnosticBoy »

Difflugia wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 7:38 pm
Separate, but equal? You'd think someone would have tried that before.
I only claimed that there can be a separate sport, but I don't believe it has to be equal. Your ideology assumes that we're all supposed to be equal. Biology says otherwise.
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Re: Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

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Post by Difflugia »

AgnosticBoy wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 7:52 pmI only claimed that there can be a separate sport, but I don't believe it has to be equal.
I assumed that, but I generously granted that your proposal at least intended equality.
AgnosticBoy wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 7:52 pmYour ideology assumes that we're all supposed to be equal. Biology says otherwise.
Whether it's intentional or not, you're equivocating between sociopolitical and physiological equality. My ideology assumes that trans girls are sociopolitical equals of the other girls regardless of biology.

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Re: Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

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Post by AgnosticBoy »

Difflugia wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 7:59 pm Whether it's intentional or not, you're equivocating between sociopolitical and physiological equality. My ideology assumes that trans girls are sociopolitical equals of the other girls regardless of biology.
Hey, I have no a-priori objections to it. ;)

I just don't see how it would work when it comes to sports based on the reasons I brought up earlier. You can't separate physiology from that situation. If you can use logic and evidence to demonstrate how it's fair to allow transgender girls to compete with girls, then I'm all ears.
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Re: Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

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Post by Difflugia »

AgnosticBoy wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 8:16 pmHey, I have no a-priori objections to it. ;)

I just don't see how it would work when it comes to sports based on the reasons I brought up earlier. You can't separate physiology from that situation. If you can use logic and evidence to demonstrate how it's fair to allow transgender girls to compete with girls, then I'm all ears.
Some sports already have things like weight classes to at least try to level out certain natural advantages. If a sport doesn't already have something like that, then fairness in terms of physiology wasn't a feature of the sport to begin with. To only raise the issue of fairness when trans girls want to play means that it's very likely just a smokescreen for bigotry.

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Re: Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

Post #9

Post by Miles »

Difflugia wrote: Sun Jan 31, 2021 7:38 pm
Miles wrote: Sat Jan 30, 2021 10:33 pm...an edge that can affect access to scholarships.
Basing academic scholarships on sports performance is unfair.
Agreed, which is why athletic scholarships were created.


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Re: Transgender Girls To Be Banned From Competing In Girls’ Sports. Fair Or Not?

Post #10

Post by Purple Knight »

Fair? Of course it's not fair.

Those with the biggest innate biological advantage winning the prizes? That's horrible. Awful. Terrible. Unjustifiable!

...Oh wait, no it's not. This is how every sport has always been, since ever.

Imagine the tallest people having an advantage in basketball just because they were born with that innate biological advantage. Then imagine that no one in the universe cared. The people with the most testosterone win at track? You don't bloody say!

No, it's not fair. But life's not fair.

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