"Atheists believe there is no God"

[Talishi]

Many Christians like to say, "Atheists believe there is no God." But atheism is not a belief there is no God because to have a belief is to hold a proposition. There are thousands of other things that Christians, like atheists, do not have a belief in, from Sasquatch to elves. If the mechanism is correct that the non-existence of God is a proposition held by atheists, then both Christians and atheists must also have matching propositions for the non-existence of all other imaginary things, which clearly we do not, since we can only name a few.

So for the record:

Christians believe in the existence of Yahweh and they do not believe in the existence of Zeus.

Atheists do not believe in the existence of Yahweh and they also do not believe in the existence of Zeus.

Perhaps the underlying motivation for some Christians to say atheists believe there is no God is a suspicion they have that believing in something is inferior to understanding something. And perhaps it is enabled by the same sloppy reasoning that results in some Christians saying evolution is only a theory as if that were a bad thing.

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 189 by Clownboat]




[center]
Blastcat wakes up from a stupor to say "WHAT?"[/center]

Rejected. Anyone can be skeptical. I'm skeptical and I'm not an atheist.

Well, you really fooled me.
I would LOVE for you to explain your position on the existence of "God", please.


Just for clarity's sake.

[OnceConvinced]

1. To remove doubt and fear of uncertainty from not knowing if there is a God or not

How is saying "I'm an atheist" going to remove any doubt or uncertainty? The uncertainty would still be there. You don't just become an atheist because you say you're one, just as you don't become a Christian just because you say you're one. You become a Christian once you come to the belief that you need salvation and need Jesus and then repent. Likewise, you are an atheist once you come to the belief that there is no god. AFTER the uncertainty and doubt has gone.

2. To remove any authority which might tell us that we are wrong morally

Like Clownboat said, you're putting the cart before the horse here. First one must believe in God before one would feel the need to try to remove him as an authority. An atheist believes that gods are imaginary so thus would have absolutely no need to try to remove any imaginary being as an authority figure.

If someone is trying to remove god as an authority figure that doesn't make them an atheist. That makes them a rebellious theist.

Once again simply calling yourself an atheist does not make you an atheist.

3. To question and be skeptical about everything in hope of finding truth (this reason may unfortunately not exist with atheism any more, i hope to be wrong)

Why would someone need to declare themselves an atheist for that? Once again, simply saying "I am an atheist" does not make you one. If deep down you still actually believe, then you are not an atheist, you simply a sceptical theist.

4. To appeal to the public and join the voice of least resistance, to remove the responsibily of burden of proof and accountability of actions.

The path of least resistance would be to be a Christian. In places like the USA, atheists are persecuted horribly.

As for the burden of proof, it would be completely illogical for someone to declare themselves atheist just to avoid having to have the burden of proof. I know of know such atheist that has ever become an atheist for that reason. Do you? The only person who would declare themselves atheist for that ridiculous reason, would be a theist who just doesn't want to make the effort.

5. To create a fictional illusion of a shue which fits all and a world without right or wrong.

How would saying "I am an atheist" create that type of illusion? Most people are unable to twist their own arms behind their backs and make themselves believe things they don't believe. Just try making yourself not believe in gravity. See how far you get. See if you can create an illusion where there is no gravity.

You clearly have an incorrect concept of what an atheist is. You are taking the typical theist perspective that atheists are just rebels who want to sin and who hate god - that deep down they are actually believers. Sorry, that's not an atheist, that is a theist - a rebellious theist playing at being an atheist.

It becomes tiring to us atheist to have to keep putting theists straight about their false views on atheism. If you are able to grasp what a true atheist is you will see that there is no purpose in declaring oneself an atheist. It is simply a matter of disbelief, nothing more.

[William]

[Replying to post 189 by Clownboat]




[center]
Blastcat wakes up from a stupor to say "WHAT?"[/center]

Rejected. Anyone can be skeptical. I'm skeptical and I'm not an atheist.

Well, you really fooled me.
I would LOVE for you to explain your position on the existence of "God", please.


Just for clarity's sake.

Q: Huh?

Q: Did I hear you right Blastcat?

Q: Are you implying that one cannot have a belief in the existence of GOD and not also be skeptical?

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 185 by Hector Barbosa]



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What's the point of thinking about gods or goddesses?[/center]

And what's the purpose to make a stance in relation to God and Goddess claims?

What's the point of taking any position on any question?
It's rather good to know your own mind, so you can discuss your position with other people. Right now, by seemingly refusing to take a side, I can only guess. It seems to me that you are a theist.

Shrugging is a way of being, I suppose.
There are lots of people who really don't LIKE thinking about philosophical questions very much.

That's their choice.
Philosophy isn't for everyone.

Every action is purpose driven even if people are not conscious of what it is that drives, but a honest person should be able to find the true purpose of what drives their actions since we are the author of them.

This is one of few points I actually happen to agree with Freud on

I have purposes.
ATHEISM has no "purpose".

It's a position.

I have a purpose for having labels for my philosophical position. One is SAVING TIME. The label "atheist" is a short cut that explains my negative position on the God Hypothesis. The label is a lot shorter than the description and the explanation.

People can choose to not label themselves.
That's fine.

It just makes discussions with them more difficult.
Right now, we are stuck discussing what your position might be.

Yours is VERY ill defined.
And because you make me guess, it seems to me that you are a theist, even though, you might have called yourself an agnostic.

You seem to believe in a "god" or a "goddess" of some kind.



It would be VERY nice, though, if you figured it out, and let us know.

[Clownboat]

[Replying to post 189 by Clownboat]




[center]
Blastcat wakes up from a stupor to say "WHAT?"[/center]

Rejected. Anyone can be skeptical. I'm skeptical and I'm not an atheist.

Well, you really fooled me.
I would LOVE for you to explain your position on the existence of "God", please.


Just for clarity's sake.

I vary from Agnostic to Ignostic most days.

I currently do not accept any god claims for not meeting the burden of proof. So you could argue that I'm an agnostic/ignostic atheist for not holding to any theism I suppose.

It just seems to me that believers cannot even agree about their own god concept which tends to make discussing them as real ideas a bit meaningless. Thus the agnosticism/ignosticism first and foremost.

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 194 by Clownboat]







[center]
Blastcat wakes up from a stupor, reads the following, and relaxes again[/center]

I'm skeptical and I'm not an atheist.

Well, you really fooled me.

I vary from Agnostic to Ignostic most days.

I currently do not accept any god claims for not meeting the burden of proof. So you could argue that I'm an agnostic/ignostic atheist for not holding to any theism I suppose.

Yeah, but you DO call yourself an atheist, too, right?
So what I quoted was a mistake then?

[Clownboat]

[Replying to post 194 by Clownboat]







[center]
Blastcat wakes up from a stupor, reads the following, and relaxes again[/center]

I'm skeptical and I'm not an atheist.

Well, you really fooled me.

I vary from Agnostic to Ignostic most days.

I currently do not accept any god claims for not meeting the burden of proof. So you could argue that I'm an agnostic/ignostic atheist for not holding to any theism I suppose.

Yeah, but you DO call yourself an atheist, too, right?
So what I quoted was a mistake then?

To date, I have never called myself an atheist.

In all honesty, I was a born again Christian for 20 years. Because of that, I'm guessing the term 'atheist' still has a stigma for me. Not to mention my poor mother would lose her mind if she heard me refer to myself as an atheist.

Ask me again in a year or so...

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 189 by Clownboat]




[center]
Blastcat wakes up from a stupor to say "WHAT?"[/center]

Rejected. Anyone can be skeptical. I'm skeptical and I'm not an atheist.

Well, you really fooled me.
I would LOVE for you to explain your position on the existence of "God", please.


Just for clarity's sake.

Q: Huh?

Q: Did I hear you right Blastcat?

Q: Are you implying that one cannot have a belief in the existence of GOD and not also be skeptical?

No.

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 194 by Clownboat]







[center]
Blastcat wakes up from a stupor, reads the following, and relaxes again[/center]

I'm skeptical and I'm not an atheist.

Well, you really fooled me.

I vary from Agnostic to Ignostic most days.

I currently do not accept any god claims for not meeting the burden of proof. So you could argue that I'm an agnostic/ignostic atheist for not holding to any theism I suppose.

Yeah, but you DO call yourself an atheist, too, right?
So what I quoted was a mistake then?

To date, I have never called myself an atheist.

Oh, ok.
My mistake.



In all honesty, I was a born again Christian for 20 years. Because of that, I'm guessing the term 'atheist' still has a stigma for me. Not to mention my poor mother would lose her mind if she heard me refer to myself as an atheist.

Ask me again in a year or so...

Okee dokee

[Hector Barbosa]

[Replying to post 189 by Clownboat]

Rejected. Anyone can be skeptical. I'm skeptical and I'm not an atheist.

Yeah I'm with Blastcat here I am a bit confused by this statement from your arguments with me, for what you write here sounds like something I could have said, but it does not sound like a position you argue for in other posts.

Would you care to clarify your position?

I mean if you were a Christian and were a atheist, but now consider yourself neither, why do you argue so strongly for trust in one position against another if you are skeptical of both?