Quranic contradictions?

[Abdullah]

None,

I challenge every person here to find any, you won't succeed.

[Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

I know that the Qur’an refers to him as ‘Isa. It has it wrong. Please refer to this site to educate yourself on the etymologies behind his name (born in Galilee as Jew it stands to reason he would have a Jewish name!).

[Greatest I Am]

muhammad rasullah

Many would disagree with you on the nature or nature of being Gay.

If I were to follow your logic to the Christian view then the abomination assigned to Gays would be transferred to whoever nurtured this Gayness and the Gays themselves would be exonerated from discrimination and denigration.

I personally believe in the nature end of the debate because it happens in many animal species of which we are but one.

I have listened to a Mr. Dedat speaking of your faith. He is impressive.

He stated that his God never makes mistakes.

Do you agree with his statement?

Many Christians feel that God has royally screwed up and they await His return to fix things up.

If your God does not make mistakes, does that mean that all of Gods creations are perfect as God Himself?

Or does His Perfection produce imperfection.

Regards
DL

Response

He stated that his God never makes mistakes.

Do you agree with his statement?

Yes, I agree with this statement God is all-knowing it is impossible for him to make a mistake. Even if we thought that God had made a mistake we still could not consciously say without having all the knowledge that God has say he has made a mistake or is incorrect. If we do it's like saying we know more than God which we don't.

Jesus says about god in the bible that you never seen his shape nor heard him speak. What return are they waiting for?

If your God does not make mistakes, does that mean that all of Gods creations are perfect as God Himself?

Or does His Perfection produce imperfection.

As I have told others that God does not create anything without purpose. Man was created to worship God and obey his laws and commands. Whether they realize that purpose and pursue it is there choice to decide Allah says truth is clearly distinguished from falsehood as the night from the day. Nothing can be perfect as God is God has no beginning and no ending and everything has been created by God and everything which is created has to have and end. 112:1 Say: He is Allah, the One and Only; 112:2 Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;112:3 He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;112:4 And there is none like unto Him. If man Understood the meaning of this verse the outcome would be remarkable but many fail to realize. Just because something is not perfect as God and created by God does not mean God produces imperfection. God has no partners and since God is the one and only who is perfect there cannot be two. So in the eyes of God we are imperfect but our creation is as God has intended it to be for God is all-knowing all wise.

Since we agree that God does not make mistakes, then why does He create Gays?
Surely not just for us to hate, denigrate and discriminate against.

From what you write, can I assume then that you do not believe in an end time, where God is to return. To fix an imperfect earth?

Regards
DL

Since we agree that God does not make mistakes, then why does He create Gays?
Surely not just for us to hate, denigrate and discriminate against.

From what you write, can I assume then that you do not believe in an end time, where God is to return. To fix an imperfect earth?

God does not create gays, being gay is a behavior that is learned and babies are not born gay. When you have a behavior that is excepted it becomes more prominent within the environment.

I don't believe God ever came so how can he return. And if God is all-knowing and all-powerful why would he need to come to earth to fix it? that is the reason God uses prophets to do his will. Islam believes that Isa (Jesus) is going to return during the last days but we don't believe him to be God. If God wanted him could end everything faster than the twinkling of an eye.

I agree with your last comment.

So then Islam does not have an end time. Good. No sending a bunch of us to hell right?

If a Gay person does pop up somehow in your Mosque, is he or she welcomed?
If his or her gayness has been produced by others as you say then I would think that they would be considered innocent of wrongdoing and that those who have taught them this gay system would be the one's that would be ostracized and that the Gay person can go on to live and practice their life style.

Is this the Islamic way?

Regards
DL

[muhammad rasullah]

muhammad rasullah

Many would disagree with you on the nature or nature of being Gay.

If I were to follow your logic to the Christian view then the abomination assigned to Gays would be transferred to whoever nurtured this Gayness and the Gays themselves would be exonerated from discrimination and denigration.

I personally believe in the nature end of the debate because it happens in many animal species of which we are but one.

I have listened to a Mr. Dedat speaking of your faith. He is impressive.

He stated that his God never makes mistakes.

Do you agree with his statement?

Many Christians feel that God has royally screwed up and they await His return to fix things up.

If your God does not make mistakes, does that mean that all of Gods creations are perfect as God Himself?

Or does His Perfection produce imperfection.

Regards
DL

Response

He stated that his God never makes mistakes.

Do you agree with his statement?

Yes, I agree with this statement God is all-knowing it is impossible for him to make a mistake. Even if we thought that God had made a mistake we still could not consciously say without having all the knowledge that God has say he has made a mistake or is incorrect. If we do it's like saying we know more than God which we don't.

Jesus says about god in the bible that you never seen his shape nor heard him speak. What return are they waiting for?

If your God does not make mistakes, does that mean that all of Gods creations are perfect as God Himself?

Or does His Perfection produce imperfection.

As I have told others that God does not create anything without purpose. Man was created to worship God and obey his laws and commands. Whether they realize that purpose and pursue it is there choice to decide Allah says truth is clearly distinguished from falsehood as the night from the day. Nothing can be perfect as God is God has no beginning and no ending and everything has been created by God and everything which is created has to have and end. 112:1 Say: He is Allah, the One and Only; 112:2 Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;112:3 He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;112:4 And there is none like unto Him. If man Understood the meaning of this verse the outcome would be remarkable but many fail to realize. Just because something is not perfect as God and created by God does not mean God produces imperfection. God has no partners and since God is the one and only who is perfect there cannot be two. So in the eyes of God we are imperfect but our creation is as God has intended it to be for God is all-knowing all wise.

Since we agree that God does not make mistakes, then why does He create Gays?
Surely not just for us to hate, denigrate and discriminate against.

From what you write, can I assume then that you do not believe in an end time, where God is to return. To fix an imperfect earth?

Regards
DL

Since we agree that God does not make mistakes, then why does He create Gays?
Surely not just for us to hate, denigrate and discriminate against.

From what you write, can I assume then that you do not believe in an end time, where God is to return. To fix an imperfect earth?

God does not create gays, being gay is a behavior that is learned and babies are not born gay. When you have a behavior that is excepted it becomes more prominent within the environment.

I don't believe God ever came so how can he return. And if God is all-knowing and all-powerful why would he need to come to earth to fix it? that is the reason God uses prophets to do his will. Islam believes that Isa (Jesus) is going to return during the last days but we don't believe him to be God. If God wanted him could end everything faster than the twinkling of an eye.

I agree with your last comment.

So then Islam does not have an end time. Good. No sending a bunch of us to hell right?

If a Gay person does pop up somehow in your Mosque, is he or she welcomed?
If his or her gayness has been produced by others as you say then I would think that they would be considered innocent of wrongdoing and that those who have taught them this gay system would be the one's that would be ostracized and that the Gay person can go on to live and practice their life style.

Is this the Islamic way?

Regards
DL

So then Islam does not have an end time. Good. No sending a bunch of us to hell right?

I never said that Islam didn't have and end time. There is a time when everything wil come to end but it won't be with God coming to earth to fix anything. There will be sending a bunch of people to hell!

If a Gay person does pop up somehow in your Mosque, is he or she welcomed?
If his or her gayness has been produced by others as you say then I would think that they would be considered innocent of wrongdoing and that those who have taught them this gay system would be the one's that would be ostracized and that the Gay person can go on to live and practice their life style.

Yes they are welcome to come to the mosque. but welcome to do what? if they want to practise Islam then they can't be gay. they won't be considered of wrongdoing because everybody comes to an age where they can think for themselves and they know the difference between right and wrong. they will be held accountable for their actions. Just because it's accepted by society doesn't mean it's right! Being gay is not the Islamic way!

[Greatest I Am]

muhammad rasullah

What is it about being Gay that offends Islam. What exactly is wrong with being Gay?

Regards
DL

[muhammad rasullah]

muhammad rasullah

What is it about being Gay that offends Islam. What exactly is wrong with being Gay?

Regards
DL

The thing that offends Islam about homosexuality is that homosexuality goes against the natural order of things. In Islam the women should be covered so as not to show any of her shape to the opposite sex. Unless they be women then she is not allowed to show her private areas to those other than her husband. The man should cover from the knees to the belly button. And none of his private areas are to be exposed to none other than his wife. you see, homosexuality even in these basic terms without sex being involved doesn't fit into the fold of Islam. Man and women were created for each other as mates to populate the earth. Homosexuality is brought to man and women by shaytan and shaytan misleads them by thinking that this good and acceptable. Shaytan makes there wrongness seem good to them which is only a delusion from the truth because he wants to lead them away from the straight path.

4:120 he holds out promises to them, and fills them with vain desires: yet whatever Satan promises them is but meant to delude the mind.

[Greatest I Am]

muhammad rasullah

What is it about being Gay that offends Islam. What exactly is wrong with being Gay?

Regards
DL

The thing that offends Islam about homosexuality is that homosexuality goes against the natural order of things. In Islam the women should be covered so as not to show any of her shape to the opposite sex. Unless they be women then she is not allowed to show her private areas to those other than her husband. The man should cover from the knees to the belly button. And none of his private areas are to be exposed to none other than his wife. you see, homosexuality even in these basic terms without sex being involved doesn't fit into the fold of Islam. Man and women were created for each other as mates to populate the earth. Homosexuality is brought to man and women by shaytan and shaytan misleads them by thinking that this good and acceptable. Shaytan makes there wrongness seem good to them which is only a delusion from the truth because he wants to lead them away from the straight path.

4:120 he holds out promises to them, and fills them with vain desires: yet whatever Satan promises them is but meant to delude the mind.

If she is not allowed and men are the enforcers of this law, then equality is never possible right?

As to Gays, if as you say they are being mislead by a powerful supernatural being then should the proper thing to do not be to forgive them. I understand that Islam would rather be more harsh than to forgive.

Does this policy not mimic the Christian, misguided one.

Regards
DL

[muhammad rasullah]

muhammad rasullah

What is it about being Gay that offends Islam. What exactly is wrong with being Gay?

Regards
DL

The thing that offends Islam about homosexuality is that homosexuality goes against the natural order of things. In Islam the women should be covered so as not to show any of her shape to the opposite sex. Unless they be women then she is not allowed to show her private areas to those other than her husband. The man should cover from the knees to the belly button. And none of his private areas are to be exposed to none other than his wife. you see, homosexuality even in these basic terms without sex being involved doesn't fit into the fold of Islam. Man and women were created for each other as mates to populate the earth. Homosexuality is brought to man and women by shaytan and shaytan misleads them by thinking that this good and acceptable. Shaytan makes there wrongness seem good to them which is only a delusion from the truth because he wants to lead them away from the straight path.

4:120 he holds out promises to them, and fills them with vain desires: yet whatever Satan promises them is but meant to delude the mind.

If she is not allowed and men are the enforcers of this law, then equality is never possible right?

As to Gays, if as you say they are being mislead by a powerful supernatural being then should the proper thing to do not be to forgive them. I understand that Islam would rather be more harsh than to forgive.

Does this policy not mimic the Christian, misguided one.

Regards
DL

If she is not allowed and men are the enforcers of this law, then equality is never possible right?

Are you saying if she is not allowed to uncover herself and wear revealing clothing and since the men are the ones who govern this then she is not equal? What should she be equal to? Or what should she be equal to do? Are you saying she should be treated equal? what do you mean by equal?
Islam looks at the subject of fairness rather than equal. men and women can't be treated as equals because each have limitations the other may be better able to perform. For instance, as pertaining to acts of worship women are not equal to men in this regard. Women go through there monthly menses which prohibit them from praying (making their salat), whereas for men there are no times when they are excused from making their salat prayers. During the holy months as ramadan women are are not able to worship as the men due to their menses. When it comes to being equal women are not looked at as equal in this regard. Fairness is more so along the lines of decisions made in accordance with relative merit or significance.

As to Gays, if as you say they are being mislead by a powerful supernatural being then should the proper thing to do not be to forgive them. I understand that Islam would rather be more harsh than to forgive.

Does this policy not mimic the Christian, misguided one.

I am not saying that the shaytan is a powerful supernatural being. The conscious of every human being is divided into two ways of thinking right and wrong. There are things in your conscious that will steer you to make good and right decisions for yourself and for others, and there is also your conscious that misleads you into thinking that things that are wrong are fair seeming and you believe them so much that you begin to rationalize the reasoning behind them. The actions of these thoughts are of the work of the shaytan. Every person has the ability to discern right conduct from wrong conduct when they reach maturity. Some people choose wrong conduct because it seems more pleasing to them and to fulfill there lower desires but this is only an illusion and in reality isn't better.
Forgiveness is given to those ask for Allah forgiveness, who feel ashamed of their actions and who refrain from every doing it again. Otherwise how can they be forgiven if they continue to indulge? Allah is most merciful oft-forgiving. the intention has to be made from them first. From what I understand christians really don't have anything to address the issue of homosexuality. They just say it's forbidden which is the same thing Islam says.

[Greatest I Am]

muhammad rasullah

What is it about being Gay that offends Islam. What exactly is wrong with being Gay?

Regards
DL

The thing that offends Islam about homosexuality is that homosexuality goes against the natural order of things. In Islam the women should be covered so as not to show any of her shape to the opposite sex. Unless they be women then she is not allowed to show her private areas to those other than her husband. The man should cover from the knees to the belly button. And none of his private areas are to be exposed to none other than his wife. you see, homosexuality even in these basic terms without sex being involved doesn't fit into the fold of Islam. Man and women were created for each other as mates to populate the earth. Homosexuality is brought to man and women by shaytan and shaytan misleads them by thinking that this good and acceptable. Shaytan makes there wrongness seem good to them which is only a delusion from the truth because he wants to lead them away from the straight path.

4:120 he holds out promises to them, and fills them with vain desires: yet whatever Satan promises them is but meant to delude the mind.

If she is not allowed and men are the enforcers of this law, then equality is never possible right?

As to Gays, if as you say they are being mislead by a powerful supernatural being then should the proper thing to do not be to forgive them. I understand that Islam would rather be more harsh than to forgive.

Does this policy not mimic the Christian, misguided one.

Regards
DL

If she is not allowed and men are the enforcers of this law, then equality is never possible right?

Are you saying if she is not allowed to uncover herself and wear revealing clothing and since the men are the ones who govern this then she is not equal? What should she be equal to? Or what should she be equal to do? Are you saying she should be treated equal? what do you mean by equal?
Islam looks at the subject of fairness rather than equal. men and women can't be treated as equals because each have limitations the other may be better able to perform. For instance, as pertaining to acts of worship women are not equal to men in this regard. Women go through there monthly menses which prohibit them from praying (making their salat), whereas for men there are no times when they are excused from making their salat prayers. During the holy months as ramadan women are are not able to worship as the men due to their menses. When it comes to being equal women are not looked at as equal in this regard. Fairness is more so along the lines of decisions made in accordance with relative merit or significance.

As to Gays, if as you say they are being mislead by a powerful supernatural being then should the proper thing to do not be to forgive them. I understand that Islam would rather be more harsh than to forgive.

Does this policy not mimic the Christian, misguided one.

I am not saying that the shaytan is a powerful supernatural being. The conscious of every human being is divided into two ways of thinking right and wrong. There are things in your conscious that will steer you to make good and right decisions for yourself and for others, and there is also your conscious that misleads you into thinking that things that are wrong are fair seeming and you believe them so much that you begin to rationalize the reasoning behind them. The actions of these thoughts are of the work of the shaytan. Every person has the ability to discern right conduct from wrong conduct when they reach maturity. Some people choose wrong conduct because it seems more pleasing to them and to fulfill there lower desires but this is only an illusion and in reality isn't better.
Forgiveness is given to those ask for Allah forgiveness, who feel ashamed of their actions and who refrain from every doing it again. Otherwise how can they be forgiven if they continue to indulge? Allah is most merciful oft-forgiving. the intention has to be made from them first. From what I understand christians really don't have anything to address the issue of homosexuality. They just say it's forbidden which is the same thing Islam says.

You say that women are not equal in prayer to men.
People pray with the mind, not the body.
Why restrict the mind of women just because they bleed. Blood has nothing to do with communication with God. If I am bleeding, I can still think and pray.

As to Gays; If Allah is the creator of souls, why create a gay soul or a Gay nature in the first place if it has no value?
What happens if the Gay person does not repent and sees nothing wrong with his or her lifestyle.

Regards
DL

[muhammad rasullah]

muhammad rasullah

What is it about being Gay that offends Islam. What exactly is wrong with being Gay?

Regards
DL

The thing that offends Islam about homosexuality is that homosexuality goes against the natural order of things. In Islam the women should be covered so as not to show any of her shape to the opposite sex. Unless they be women then she is not allowed to show her private areas to those other than her husband. The man should cover from the knees to the belly button. And none of his private areas are to be exposed to none other than his wife. you see, homosexuality even in these basic terms without sex being involved doesn't fit into the fold of Islam. Man and women were created for each other as mates to populate the earth. Homosexuality is brought to man and women by shaytan and shaytan misleads them by thinking that this good and acceptable. Shaytan makes there wrongness seem good to them which is only a delusion from the truth because he wants to lead them away from the straight path.

4:120 he holds out promises to them, and fills them with vain desires: yet whatever Satan promises them is but meant to delude the mind.

If she is not allowed and men are the enforcers of this law, then equality is never possible right?

As to Gays, if as you say they are being mislead by a powerful supernatural being then should the proper thing to do not be to forgive them. I understand that Islam would rather be more harsh than to forgive.

Does this policy not mimic the Christian, misguided one.

Regards
DL

If she is not allowed and men are the enforcers of this law, then equality is never possible right?

Are you saying if she is not allowed to uncover herself and wear revealing clothing and since the men are the ones who govern this then she is not equal? What should she be equal to? Or what should she be equal to do? Are you saying she should be treated equal? what do you mean by equal?
Islam looks at the subject of fairness rather than equal. men and women can't be treated as equals because each have limitations the other may be better able to perform. For instance, as pertaining to acts of worship women are not equal to men in this regard. Women go through there monthly menses which prohibit them from praying (making their salat), whereas for men there are no times when they are excused from making their salat prayers. During the holy months as ramadan women are are not able to worship as the men due to their menses. When it comes to being equal women are not looked at as equal in this regard. Fairness is more so along the lines of decisions made in accordance with relative merit or significance.

As to Gays, if as you say they are being mislead by a powerful supernatural being then should the proper thing to do not be to forgive them. I understand that Islam would rather be more harsh than to forgive.

Does this policy not mimic the Christian, misguided one.

I am not saying that the shaytan is a powerful supernatural being. The conscious of every human being is divided into two ways of thinking right and wrong. There are things in your conscious that will steer you to make good and right decisions for yourself and for others, and there is also your conscious that misleads you into thinking that things that are wrong are fair seeming and you believe them so much that you begin to rationalize the reasoning behind them. The actions of these thoughts are of the work of the shaytan. Every person has the ability to discern right conduct from wrong conduct when they reach maturity. Some people choose wrong conduct because it seems more pleasing to them and to fulfill there lower desires but this is only an illusion and in reality isn't better.
Forgiveness is given to those ask for Allah forgiveness, who feel ashamed of their actions and who refrain from every doing it again. Otherwise how can they be forgiven if they continue to indulge? Allah is most merciful oft-forgiving. the intention has to be made from them first. From what I understand christians really don't have anything to address the issue of homosexuality. They just say it's forbidden which is the same thing Islam says.

You say that women are not equal in prayer to men.
People pray with the mind, not the body.
Why restrict the mind of women just because they bleed. Blood has nothing to do with communication with God. If I am bleeding, I can still think and pray.

As to Gays; If Allah is the creator of souls, why create a gay soul or a Gay nature in the first place if it has no value?
What happens if the Gay person does not repent and sees nothing wrong with his or her lifestyle.

Regards
DL

You say that women are not equal in prayer to men.
People pray with the mind, not the body.
Why restrict the mind of women just because they bleed. Blood has nothing to do with communication with God. If I am bleeding, I can still think and pray.

I don't mean that they are not equal to men in regarding prayer, I am saying that women are not ranked as high as men when it comes to this. All actions are performed with the body. In Islam prayer or salat consist of many movements and prostrations the heart and mind is involved as well. But before the salat is performed the person must clean or wash themselves to become clean which is known as wudu a women is deficient in this because she cannot become clean due to her menses therefore she is not able to perform her salat until her menses are over. It doesn't stop or prohibit communication with Allah because Allah hears, sees and knows all things.

As to Gays; If Allah is the creator of souls, why create a gay soul or a Gay nature in the first place if it has no value?
What happens if the Gay person does not repent and sees nothing wrong with his or her lifestyle.

Yes you are correct Allah is the creator of all souls but, there is no such thing as a gay souls. Being gay is a behavior, a learned behavior and personality trait and characteristic. the souls doesn't possess any of these things but the souls is effected by them all. Allah did not create people in a gay nature again the shaytan has waged a war against mankind steering him away from the correct and right path tempting and pursuading him to do any and everything opposite to that of what Allah wants for us.
7:16 He said: "Because thou hast thrown me out of the way, lo! I will lie in wait for them on thy straight way:
7:17 "Then will I assault them from before them and behind them, from their right and their left: Nor wilt thou find, in most of them, gratitude (for thy mercies)."

If the gay person does not repent before his or her appointed time has come then he should not look forward to his judgement with Allah!

Those that follow shaytan and his ways on the day of judgement shaytan will leave them to the fire and abandon them all! but as for those who believe in Allah and his messenger and stay firm on his path, they are the righteous in this world and will be in the company of those pleasing to allah!

[Greatest I Am]

muhammad rasullah

You wrote
"there is no such thing as a gay souls. Being gay is a behavior, a learned behavior and personality trait and characteristic."

What punishment do you give to those who teach such behavior.
They should get even more punishment that the Gay person. Do you actively seek these dastardly people for retribution or do you keep all the hate for the hapless victim who may now be totally indoctrinated into the Gay life style.

I still am not sure what you are saying about women who are bleeding.
You say that Allah is always open to their prayers while at the same time restricting them from joys of Islam.
Me praying at home is not the same as me praying in church.

You say they are equal and at the same time say that they are of a lower rank.
Which is it?
If equal, why does Islam only give rules as to how a man can punish his wife but does not give rules as to how a wife should punish her husband. Has she somehow lost her equality here?

Regard
DL