Submitted for your consideration:
I believe the 666 connotation represents three things that are aptly described by Revelations:
Money is easily described as it.
Media and communications (wearable cell phones anyone?) can also be something inferred from Revelation's description of the Mark.
and some third 6.
Six is a number of the the beast in actuality. Just as the five-pointed star represents magic from the sacrifice of man, 1=head, 2,3=arms 4,5 legs, so the six pointed star represent the magic from sacrifice of beasts: as above 1-5, and a sixth point from the tail of animals.
Are there any expansions on these assertions being further correct or incorrect? and from this, is it possible to discover the representation of the final "6?"
Could this also thus mean, a third sacrifice?
Mark of the beast
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Willum
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Re: Mark of the beast
Post #11[Replying to AdHoc]
Well, the focus is on the riddle of the description, the persistent mystery of what the number of the beast means.
Every man shall have it on his hand or his head. It will be impossible to do commerce without it.
If someone can ascribe more meaning to 616 than 666, by all means.
I am taking a view that there are 3 x 6's for a reason. Or there are 2x6's and a 1, if necessary.
That money fits the description of the Mark.
That media could be the second six.
Or I could be wrong about both. No worries, so long as someone can come up with something better, or at least different.
Since the barter system was abandoned for example, money, either gold/silver, marking the hand, or paper/electrons marking the head, have governed commerce.
The paper/electron version of money can't exist sans belief (head) and media.
This actually still does not tie it to the number six, or one for that matter. But I am out here asking. Hoping a new perspective will promote a new road to understanding.
Well, the focus is on the riddle of the description, the persistent mystery of what the number of the beast means.
Every man shall have it on his hand or his head. It will be impossible to do commerce without it.
If someone can ascribe more meaning to 616 than 666, by all means.
I am taking a view that there are 3 x 6's for a reason. Or there are 2x6's and a 1, if necessary.
That money fits the description of the Mark.
That media could be the second six.
Or I could be wrong about both. No worries, so long as someone can come up with something better, or at least different.
Since the barter system was abandoned for example, money, either gold/silver, marking the hand, or paper/electrons marking the head, have governed commerce.
The paper/electron version of money can't exist sans belief (head) and media.
This actually still does not tie it to the number six, or one for that matter. But I am out here asking. Hoping a new perspective will promote a new road to understanding.
Re: Mark of the beast
Post #12You're right I shouldn't have said "often" what I should've said is "apparently in Greek and Hebrew his name was translated Neron."Pazuzu bin Hanbi wrote:If it's 'often' then give me 6 examples. I have never actually heard of him referred to as 'Neron'.AdHoc wrote:the numbers for Neron Caesar in Hebrew = 666 (Neron is how his name was often written)
"In both ancient Greek and Hebrew, letters also represented numerals (as they do in Latin), their values assigned according to the order of the alphabet, alpha and aelph, for example, having the numerical value of 1. By adding these values, words could be represented as the sum of their numbers. This literation of numbers and numeration of letters was known as isopsephism by the Greeks and gematria by the Jews (which, in cabalistic practice, has been used to interpret Hebrew scripture). If the Greek spelling of Nero Caesar (Neron Kaisar) is transliterated into Hebrew (nrwn qsr), the numerical equivalent is 666." - http://penelope.uchicago.edu/~grout/enc ... /nero.html
Re: Mark of the beast
Post #13Yes I didn't mean to distract from your point but just to throw it out there.Willum wrote: [Replying to AdHoc]
Well, the focus is on the riddle of the description, the persistent mystery of what the number of the beast means.
Every man shall have it on his hand or his head. It will be impossible to do commerce without it.
If someone can ascribe more meaning to 616 than 666, by all means.
Well actually one thing is certain that there aren't 3 x 6 or 2 x 6 and a 1. The reason for this is that Revelation was written in Greek and the Greek language didn't have numbers instead they had letters that represented numbers. So what is actually written in Revelation "is rendered in Greek numerical form as χξϛ, or sometimes literally as ἑξακόσιοι ἑξήκοντα ἕξ, hexakósioi hexēkonta héx, "six hundred and sixty-six". - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_the_BeastWillum wrote: I am taking a view that there are 3 x 6's for a reason. Or there are 2x6's and a 1, if necessary.
Neither are 666 that would be χχχ.
Money fits the description but there was money in Christ's time so what would make this a new thing that John needs to prophesy about?Willum wrote: That money fits the description of the Mark.
Sure but why?Willum wrote: That media could be the second six.
I don't have a better perspective than yours but I'm leaning toward calculating the beast's name and I tend to think of the beast as an organization rather than a person.Willum wrote: Or I could be wrong about both. No worries, so long as someone can come up with something better, or at least different.
Since the barter system was abandoned for example, money, either gold/silver, marking the hand, or paper/electrons marking the head, have governed commerce.
The paper/electron version of money can't exist sans belief (head) and media.
This actually still does not tie it to the number six, or one for that matter. But I am out here asking. Hoping a new perspective will promote a new road to understanding.
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Willum
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Re: Mark of the beast
Post #14[Replying to AdHoc]
Jesus' prophesy hardly need to be constrained to the far future.
They can be money + media +
actually the wiki does a pretty good job of it.
So, the number of the beast is six; head, 4 paws and a tail.
The six pointed star represents animal sacrifice, as the five pointed represents man.
It is the Star of David.
No one shall do commerce without it-money.
That brings to mind then, if Christians are using money, aren't they ascribing to the Anti Christ?
See these are questions I am interested in integrating into a coherent picture.
Surely dogma and logic and circumstance can answer more about the riddle of the beast.
Jesus' prophesy hardly need to be constrained to the far future.
They can be money + media +
actually the wiki does a pretty good job of it.
So, the number of the beast is six; head, 4 paws and a tail.
The six pointed star represents animal sacrifice, as the five pointed represents man.
It is the Star of David.
No one shall do commerce without it-money.
That brings to mind then, if Christians are using money, aren't they ascribing to the Anti Christ?
See these are questions I am interested in integrating into a coherent picture.
Surely dogma and logic and circumstance can answer more about the riddle of the beast.
Re: Mark of the beast
Post #15I'm not sure how this is a reply to my post... I didn't say that Jesus prophesied about the mark of the beast and you didn't respond to my point about the number not being three sixes. You also didn't answer any of my questions.Willum wrote: [Replying to AdHoc]
Jesus' prophesy hardly need to be constrained to the far future.
They can be money + media +
actually the wiki does a pretty good job of it.
So, the number of the beast is six; head, 4 paws and a tail.
The six pointed star represents animal sacrifice, as the five pointed represents man.
It is the Star of David.
No one shall do commerce without it-money.
That brings to mind then, if Christians are using money, aren't they ascribing to the Anti Christ?
See these are questions I am interested in integrating into a coherent picture.
Surely dogma and logic and circumstance can answer more about the riddle of the beast.
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Willum
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Re: Mark of the beast
Post #16[Replying to post 15 by AdHoc]
I'm learning here to...
I don't know what to make of it not being three sixes, as I mentioned myself, I am not sure how it connects to a number from the three chi-s.
I'm learning here to...
I don't know what to make of it not being three sixes, as I mentioned myself, I am not sure how it connects to a number from the three chi-s.
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tam
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Post #17
Peace to you Willum.
I must agree with what Adhoc has said above. There is no reason to believe that the number relates to three things, each represented by one 6. That would be 3 beasts, would it not?
Six hundred and sixty-six is the number of the beast. It is also man's number.
Instead of getting caught up in the number, and what it might possibly be translated into, perhaps pay more attention to the attributes of the beast. That being said, we are talking about Revelation here, meaning this is something that is revealed. Meaning if you want to know, and know for sure, you should ask Christ if He will reveal it to you.
A couple of questions one might want to ask and/or consider:
What does it mean to look like a lamb... yet speak like a dragon? (the first two attributes of this second beast, that rises out of the earth)
Who/what is the lamb?
Who/what is the dragon?
What does the dragon speak?
Peace to you and Adhoc both,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy
I must agree with what Adhoc has said above. There is no reason to believe that the number relates to three things, each represented by one 6. That would be 3 beasts, would it not?
Six hundred and sixty-six is the number of the beast. It is also man's number.
Instead of getting caught up in the number, and what it might possibly be translated into, perhaps pay more attention to the attributes of the beast. That being said, we are talking about Revelation here, meaning this is something that is revealed. Meaning if you want to know, and know for sure, you should ask Christ if He will reveal it to you.
A couple of questions one might want to ask and/or consider:
What does it mean to look like a lamb... yet speak like a dragon? (the first two attributes of this second beast, that rises out of the earth)
Who/what is the lamb?
Who/what is the dragon?
What does the dragon speak?
Peace to you and Adhoc both,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy
Post #18
Good questions Tammy. I would guess looking like a lamb means it has a gentle and peaceful appearance. Speaking like a dragon could also mean speaking like a serpent which to me evokes the forked tongue I.E. deceitful.tam wrote: Peace to you Willum.
I must agree with what Adhoc has said above. There is no reason to believe that the number relates to three things, each represented by one 6. That would be 3 beasts, would it not?
Six hundred and sixty-six is the number of the beast. It is also man's number.
Instead of getting caught up in the number, and what it might possibly be translated into, perhaps pay more attention to the attributes of the beast. That being said, we are talking about Revelation here, meaning this is something that is revealed. Meaning if you want to know, and know for sure, you should ask Christ if He will reveal it to you.
A couple of questions one might want to ask and/or consider:
What does it mean to look like a lamb... yet speak like a dragon? (the first two attributes of this second beast, that rises out of the earth)
Who/what is the lamb?
Who/what is the dragon?
What does the dragon speak?
Peace to you and Adhoc both,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy
The Lamb is Christ the dragon is Satan.
Here are some questions for you:
What do horns represent?
Why does the beast have two horns?
What does the earth represent?
Why does the beast come out of the earth?
Post #19
[Replying to post 18 by AdHoc]
Dear adhoc,
The horns represent leaders. The beast has two horns, because he sets up two Christ like leaders to deceive those "who dwell on the earth".
The "first beast" who had been "slain" and whose fatal would had been healed was Julius Caesar, who had been slain and then made a god by the Roman Senate. Constantine was the 7th head of the beast, who exercised all the authority of the first beast Julius Caesar, as a successor, under the title of Augustus Caesar.
He deceived "those who dwell on the earth" by his formatting of the Roman Church at his convened Council of Nicaea, in which the false prophet Paul and the "worthless shepherd" (Zechariah 11:17) Peter became the leaders.
The beast's authority comes from Satan, and the churches standing comes from 7th head of the beast/Constantine. The mark of the beast is simply keeping the commandments of the beast per the example of Dt 6:8. One of the commandments/edicts of the beast was to keep the "day of the sun" as the new day of rest, whereas all shops were closed, and you could not buy or sell. This to glorify Constantine's god, Sol Invictus, the sun god. Constantine's banner was the sign Sol Invictus gave to him at the Battle of Milvian bridge, in which Constantine was to Conquer under the sign of the cross, which is an old pagan symbol. Constantine's banner also sported his image.
Constantine's law of…321 [C.E] uniting Christians and pagans in the observance of the "venerable day of the sun" It is to be noted that this official solar worship, the final form of paganism in the empire…, was not the traditional Roman-Greek religion of Jupiter, Apollo, Venus, and the other Olympian deities. It was a product of the mingling Hellenistic-Oriental elements, exemplified in Aurelian's establishment of Eastern Sun worship at Rome as the official religion of the empire, and in his new temple enshrining Syrian statutes statues of Bel and the sun…. Thus at last Bel, the god of Babylon, came into the official imperial temple of Rome, the center of the imperial religion. It was this late Roman-Oriental worship of one supreme god, symbolized by the sun and absorbing lesser divinities as subordinates or manifestations of the universal deity, that competed with young Christianity. This was the Roman religion that went down in defeat but infiltrated and colored the victorious church with its own elements, some of which can be seen to this day. (Cramer 4)
On March 7, 321, Sunday was declared the official day of rest, on which markets were banned and public offices were closed,[ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constantin ... ristianity
\adhoc wrote:
The Lamb is Christ the dragon is Satan.
Here are some questions for you:
What do horns represent?
Why does the beast have two horns?
What does the earth represent?
Why does the beast come out of the earth?
Dear adhoc,
The horns represent leaders. The beast has two horns, because he sets up two Christ like leaders to deceive those "who dwell on the earth".
The "first beast" who had been "slain" and whose fatal would had been healed was Julius Caesar, who had been slain and then made a god by the Roman Senate. Constantine was the 7th head of the beast, who exercised all the authority of the first beast Julius Caesar, as a successor, under the title of Augustus Caesar.
He deceived "those who dwell on the earth" by his formatting of the Roman Church at his convened Council of Nicaea, in which the false prophet Paul and the "worthless shepherd" (Zechariah 11:17) Peter became the leaders.
The beast's authority comes from Satan, and the churches standing comes from 7th head of the beast/Constantine. The mark of the beast is simply keeping the commandments of the beast per the example of Dt 6:8. One of the commandments/edicts of the beast was to keep the "day of the sun" as the new day of rest, whereas all shops were closed, and you could not buy or sell. This to glorify Constantine's god, Sol Invictus, the sun god. Constantine's banner was the sign Sol Invictus gave to him at the Battle of Milvian bridge, in which Constantine was to Conquer under the sign of the cross, which is an old pagan symbol. Constantine's banner also sported his image.
Constantine's law of…321 [C.E] uniting Christians and pagans in the observance of the "venerable day of the sun" It is to be noted that this official solar worship, the final form of paganism in the empire…, was not the traditional Roman-Greek religion of Jupiter, Apollo, Venus, and the other Olympian deities. It was a product of the mingling Hellenistic-Oriental elements, exemplified in Aurelian's establishment of Eastern Sun worship at Rome as the official religion of the empire, and in his new temple enshrining Syrian statutes statues of Bel and the sun…. Thus at last Bel, the god of Babylon, came into the official imperial temple of Rome, the center of the imperial religion. It was this late Roman-Oriental worship of one supreme god, symbolized by the sun and absorbing lesser divinities as subordinates or manifestations of the universal deity, that competed with young Christianity. This was the Roman religion that went down in defeat but infiltrated and colored the victorious church with its own elements, some of which can be seen to this day. (Cramer 4)
On March 7, 321, Sunday was declared the official day of rest, on which markets were banned and public offices were closed,[ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constantin ... ristianity
