It's said god loves humanity (it's also said god hates humanity but that's for another thread). Yet, god does do some things that, to humanity, seems, well.... not very 'loving':
According to biblical stories:
- God set up mankind to fail in the garden, which condemned mankind; one could say this allowed for god's love to provide humanity an 'out' with his son's sacrifice, though I'd counter there would be no need if there was no setup to begin with
- God leveled an entire city for it being 'bad' (for lack of a better term - everyone seems to have their own terms for this that tends to alter their POV)
- God drowned an entire planet - save a handful of people
- God drowned an entire army that followed Mosses (guess the animals in this and the above case were 'collateral damage'?)
God did these things with it could have LITERALLY done ANYTHING else it wanted. But these things... these are the things it wanted to do to people it's said to love.
Does this mean (agape love aside) is god's love different than the love humanity has?
For discussion:
If god's love is different than humanity's love, how can we know for sure anything about god's love for humanity and thus, love god outside of doing so out of fear?
God's love
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Re: God's love
Post #11Is there someone from 1000 years ago, who was evil and is not dead? By what i know, people usually die before they are 120, if they are evil, they don't continue forever.
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Re: God's love
Post #12brunumb wrote: ↑Fri Dec 31, 2021 7:28 amLike wait until it is so bad that you have to drown the planet.JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Fri Dec 31, 2021 5:26 amI don't believe that is necessarily true. Sometimes one has to allow evil to become manifest in order to properly deal with it. There is no suffering that an omnipotent God cannot wipe out.
Where is the love and caring in allowing evil to manifest? If there is no suffering that an omnipotent God cannot wipe out, why the need to wait until it becomes manifest? Interim suffering doesn't seem to matter.
It matters but if it is necessary, and could be repaired and if it were necessary and the lesser of two evils, then it would be kindness and wisdom to do so.
It would depend on the issues involves.
JW
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Sat Jan 01, 2022 6:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
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Re: God's love
Post #13So there must be good trying and bad trying. The omnipotent one seems to be in the latter category considering his alleged skill set.mgb wrote: ↑Fri Dec 31, 2021 7:38 am Any complex system of possibilities involves good and bad possibilities simply because it exists. Take chess, for example. Chess has an immense number of possible games. Not all of them are good chess. But bad chess exists because chess exists. The idea is to learn how to play good chess. Likewise with music; bad/good music exists because music exists. Creation involves possibilities. God is trying to show us how to be good 'chess players' and good 'musicians' and good people.
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
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Re: God's love
Post #14I have absolutely no idea how any of that answers my questions.
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
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Re: God's love
Post #15You appear to be saying that allowing evil to manifest along with subsequent suffering can amount to kindness and wisdom. Hmmm.JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Fri Dec 31, 2021 4:04 pmbrunumb wrote: ↑Fri Dec 31, 2021 7:28 amLike wait until it is so bad that you have to drown the planet.JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Fri Dec 31, 2021 5:26 amI don't believe that is necessarily true. Sometimes one has to allow evil to become manifest in order to properly deal with it. There is no suffering that an omnipotent God cannot wipe out.
Where is the love and caring in allowing evil to manifest? If there is no suffering that an omnipotent God cannot wipe out, why the need to wait until it becomes manifest? Interim suffering doesn't seem to matter.
It matters but if it is necessary, and cojld be repaires and if it were necessary and the lesser of two evils, then it would be kindness and wisdom to do so.
It would depend on the issues involves.
JW
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
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Re: God's love
Post #16Might want to look up "equivocation" in reference to your "bad" here.mgb wrote: ↑Fri Dec 31, 2021 7:38 amAny complex system of possibilities involves good and bad possibilities simply because it exists. Take chess, for example. Chess has an immense number of possible games. Not all of them are good chess. But bad chess exists because chess exists. The idea is to learn how to play good chess. Likewise with music; bad/good music exists because music exists. Creation involves possibilities. God is trying to show us how to be good 'chess players' and good 'musicians' and good people.
.
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Re: God's love
Post #17Creation has the freedom to explore existence outside God's wisdom and perfection. It also has the freedom to return to God. Creation needs to learn how to be without becoming corrupt. If it will not listen to God it must go its own way and learn the hard way.
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Re: God's love
Post #18Yes, that is exactly what I am saying. Do you have anything to say in response?
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
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Re: God's love
Post #19Only that I am glad that I do not hold such views. I consider allowing evil to manifest with subsequent suffering the furthest thing from kindness or wisdom and totally unjustifiable. Do the faithful get brownie points for pandering to Jehovah in that way?JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Sat Jan 01, 2022 6:23 amYes, that is exactly what I am saying. Do you have anything to say in response?
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
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Re: God's love
Post #20I'm sorry but I cannot make any sense out of that 'word salad'. Perhaps you could rephrase it in such a way that a numpty like myself can understand what you mean.
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.