EVANGELICALISM

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JehovahsWitness
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Post #51

Post by JehovahsWitness »

dio9 wrote:
JehovahsWitness wrote:
dio9 wrote: [Replying to JehovahsWitness]

here again you are presenting a conquest theology.
Are you contesting the scriptures I presented in post # 38 above are not part of the bible canon?

JW
I'm challenging wrong thinking.
So was I wrong to think the scriptures listed are part of the bible canon? I do believe you said the idea of divine execution was ONLY in the book of Revelation, which is why I listed the scriptures above in the first place.



JW
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
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dio9
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Post #52

Post by dio9 »

just read abut a former secretary f interior's view on the effect of fossil fuels on the environment . He wrote it doesn't matter how much the climate changes because in a few generations Christ will return. The question is what do evangelicals expect Christ to do when he returns?
Do evangelicals have a moral responsibility to the environment?

Elijah John
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Post #53

Post by Elijah John »

dio9 wrote: evangelical theology seems to be heavily influenced by the book of revelations. Fear of the Antichrist stopping social restoration for fear that the antichrist might be behind it. Also the book of Revelations is so full of symbolism it's not clear. But we expect a terrible judgement before any good can come. That seems to be the root of the theology. The end is coming and hopefully we will avoid it via Christ's grace. bottom line the world is going to hell and there's nothing we can do about it. It's God's will that tribulation will come. . I disagree with this theology, for even Niniva was spared.
I agree with your observation here. Evangelicals do seem heavily focused on the "end times" and the book of Revelation. As do Jehovah's Witnesses. Other beliefs that Evangelicals seem to all share:

-HEAVY emphasis on the Gospel of John and the letters of Paul.
-The Trinity, and Divinity of Jesus,
-Jesus redemptive blood atonment, otherwise known simply as "the blood".
-The perfection and infallibility of the Bible.
-And the importance of "preaching the Gospel" so others will believe like they do, and be saved.

Getting back to the book of Revelation and it's importance to Evangelicals. I was raised Catholic too, and I don't remember ever hearing about the "Rapture". If it was mentioned at all from the altar, the "end times" were certainly not emphasized and obsessed over.
My theological positions:

-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.

I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.

RightReason
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Post #54

Post by RightReason »

[Replying to Elijah John]
I was raised Catholic too, and I don't remember ever hearing about the "Rapture". If it was mentioned at all from the altar, the "end times" were certainly not emphasized and obsessed over.
You are correct, because it isn’t something to obsess over.

"But do not ignore this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slow about his promise as some count slowness, but is forbearing toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. . . . Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of persons ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be kindled and dissolved, and the elements will melt with fire! But according to his promise we wait for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells. Therefore, beloved, since you wait for these, be zealous to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace" (2 Pet. 3:8–14

However, the Catholic Church speaks often about the last things and how we are always to be ready and prepared and continually fight the good fight for no one knows the hour or time.

RightReason
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Re: EVANGELICALISM

Post #55

Post by RightReason »

[Replying to post 47 by marco]
If Christianity wanted to take itself seriously it would gather all its threads together and find a common purpose, eradicating any differences. I wonder why it doesn't.
What do you mean by this?

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Post #56

Post by Elijah John »

RightReason wrote: [Replying to Elijah John]
I was raised Catholic too, and I don't remember ever hearing about the "Rapture". If it was mentioned at all from the altar, the "end times" were certainly not emphasized and obsessed over.
You are correct, because it isn’t something to obsess over.


However, the Catholic Church speaks often about the last things and how we are always to be ready and prepared and continually fight the good fight for no one knows the hour or time.
Yes, the RCC does not get bogged down in the weeds of "millenialism" vs. "pre-millenialism" and "post-millenialism" etc, etc. And they do not consign other Christians to hell for not believing exactly the same way on these matters for preachig a "different Gospel" like some Evangelicals do with each other.

When you say the RCC often speaks about the "last things" do you mean the Pope? The Magesterium? Or individual Priest from the pulpit? Maybe in your experience, but I do not remeber hearing much of that kind of teaching/preaching...not much at all. If they do, only in very general terms.

Sure, the Creed mentions "he will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and his kingdom will have no end", and Priests will often say introducing the Lord's prayer: "Let us pray now, for the coming of the Kingdom". But beyond these things, there is not much emphasis on eschatological matters in the RCC.

I see this as a good thing. Over-empasis, Evangelical emphasis on the "end times" shifts the focus on how we can all be better people, in this life to who is "saved" and who "lost". It sometimes becomes an escape mechanism among Evangelicals. At least in my exprerience.
My theological positions:

-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.

I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.

RightReason
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Post #57

Post by RightReason »

[Replying to post 56 by Elijah John]
When you say the RCC often speaks about the "last things" do you mean the Pope? The Magesterium? Or individual Priest from the pulpit? Maybe in your experience, but I do not remeber hearing much of that kind of teaching/preaching...not much at all. If they do, only in very general terms.
Well, I would suggest you either weren’t paying attention or were attending a weak parish (unfortunately that does happen) and not paying attention to what the Church globally was saying. The truth is the Church has always spoken about what she traditionally refers to as “the four last things� – death, judgment, Heaven, Hell. This has been common since the establishment of the Church. If you attend mass regularly you will hear about the last things. And if you still don’t believe me just google Catholic Church the Last Things and you will have endless articles, Scripture, homilies, books, teachings, etc at your disposal. Some from Popes past and present. Some from the magisterium, some from parish priests, some from lay folk.

Sure, the Creed mentions "he will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and his kingdom will have no end", and Priests will often say introducing the Lord's prayer: "Let us pray now, for the coming of the Kingdom". But beyond these things, there is not much emphasis on eschatological matters in the RCC.
I couldn’t disagree more. Not only that I have been involved over the years with multiple different Church groups (groups like Opus Dei and Miles Christi) and have attended entire retreats specifically on that topic. But even if I hadn’t, it’s in Scripture and only in the Catholic Church will you get Scripture in its entirety (nothing left out). The Church has a strict liturgical calendar so that nothing is missed, unlike many other Christian denominations where Father So and So gets up and talks about whatever he feels like that particular Sunday. When one tends to get an awful lot of the sermon on the mount, the story about the Good Samaritan, and the Prodigal Son. Good priests stick to the liturgical calendar and speak about the final judgment.

I see this as a good thing. Over-empasis, Evangelical emphasis on the "end times" shifts the focus on how we can all be better people, inthis life to who is "saved" and who "lost".
It can, but if done properly Christ’s Church should never shy away from such conversation and in my opinion doesn’t. But I certainly don’t doubt your own experience.

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Post #58

Post by Elijah John »

[Replying to post 57 by RightReason]

"death, judgement, heaven and hell". Yes, but notice no "rapture" "arrmeggedon" "millennialism" and it's variants. The RCC seldom uses Evangelical jargon.

But does the Pope usually focus on eschatology or "last things"? I don't think so, not usually, not Francis, not John Paul II. Their proclamations are more often on the role of the RC in the world today, how we can be better people, and make the world a better place.

It's a matter of focus and emphasis. Evangelicals emphasize these things, Catholics? Not nearly as much.
Last edited by Elijah John on Sun Dec 02, 2018 4:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
My theological positions:

-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.

I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.

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JoeyKnothead
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Re: EVANGELICALISM

Post #59

Post by JoeyKnothead »

dio9 wrote: What is it that distinguishes evangelicalism as a unique member of the Christian body?
What is the difference between progressives and evangelicals? Is there something theological like Luther's thesis, or practice or behavior , political , issues or what ?
Help me understand what makes evangelicals a unique part of the Christian body?
Theology.

And how some folks have 'em them a different take on it.
Some say it came from Memphis down in Tennessee
Or it drifted in from Georgia about 1953
Just as long as it's greasy, as long as it's fast
As long as it's pumpin' honey, it's gonna last

It's the hillbilly rock, beat it with a drum
Playin' them guitars like shootin' from a gun
Keepin' up the rhythm, steady as a clock
Doin' a little thing called the hillbilly rock
- Marty Stuart

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Post #60

Post by otseng »

RightReason wrote: Well, I would suggest you either weren’t paying attention or were attending a weak parish (unfortunately that does happen) and not paying attention to what the Church globally was saying.
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