Evolution RIP

[EarthScienceguy]

From Zumdahl Chemistry Sixth edition

Gibbs free energy equation in Chemistry indicates whether a chemical reaction will occur spontaneously or not. It is derived out of the second law of thermodynamics and takes the form.

dG = dH - TdS

dG = the change in Gibbs free energy
dH = the change in enthalpy the flow of energy reaction.
T = Temperature
dS = Change in entropy Sfinal state - Sinitial state

For evolution to occur the dS is always going to be negative because the
final state will always have a lower entropy then the initial state.

dH of a dipeptide from amino acids = 5-8 kcal/mole ,(Hutchens, Handbook
of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology.

dh for a macromolecule in a living system = 16.4 cal/gm (Morowitz,
Energy flow in Biology.


Zumdauhl Chemistry sixth edition

When dS is negative and dH is positive the Process is not spontaneous at
any temperature. The reverse process is spontaneous at all temperatures.

The implications are that evolution could not have happen now or in the past. genes could not have been added to the cytoplasm of the cell along with producing any gene's in the first.

Production of information or complexity by any chemical process using a polymer of amino acids is impossible according to the second law of thermodynamics. If any proteins were formed by chance they would immediately break apart.

Evolution Cannot Happen.

[brunumb]

[Replying to post 270 by EarthScienceguy]

Why would one who does not want to praise God here on Earth suddenly change and have a desire to worship God?

Praising Jesus is what heaven is all about. To a Christian that is the most wonderful thing they could think of doing.

I can't think of anything more pointless than worship. Any being desiring such a thing is clearly just on an ego trip and consequently not even worthy of people wasting their time on it for them. Faced with the reality of an eternity spent in worship of God, I think even Christians would ultimately balk. Worship and blasphemy are two of the most absurd concepts conceived by human beings.

[DrNoGods]

[Replying to post 268 by Guy Threepwood]

And that's what we see in life also; birds LOSING flight. fish LOSING sight.

And we see exactly the opposite as well ... certain fish gaining legs and lungs to become amphibians, members of the genus Homo gaining more neocortex over 2-3 million years of change to obtain a larger and more complex brain, and countless other examples of GAINING features and/or functions. No new mutations creating new genes may be required to turn fins into legs since genes already exist to produce muscle, bones, blood vessels, etc. Changes in the activation sequence and levels of various signaling proteins can build different structures, so the required changes are not necessarily mutations to create new proteins. Natural selection includes these kinds of processes as well. It has never been a one-way road where life consistently degrades and loses features based on a misapplied understanding of entropy and its role in the evolutionary process.

ToE has no theory of the generative, nothing to combat entropy with, that's why many scientists are looking for a fundamentally better explanation today.

Then how do you explain the evolution of the brain from early Homo members (habilis, erectus, etc.) to Homo sapien? Entropy doesn't apply the way you seem to think it does for this kind of process. There is no continuous increase in entropy required for any particular component within a larger system. And the percentage of scientists today looking for a fundamentally better explanation (assuming you mean an alternative to ToE) is small ... 2-3% at best. So far they are not making any progress at dethroning modern ToE.

Natural selection is NOT a creative mechanism- it merely selects what has already been created- there is no way around this.

I agree that it isn't a "creative" mechanism in that there is never an intention or plan to create something from the process. But it is not called "Natural Creation" ... it is called Natural Selection. Take the example of bacteria developing resistance to antibiotics. It is a population consideration ... not just change in one individual that then passes on that change to its offspring. If a bacterial infection in a human is hit with an antibiotic that is effective in killing off 99.99% of all the bacteria, but there is 0.01% that by random mutation are able to survive and reproduce, then that 0.01% will become a new population of bacteria that are immune to the antibiotic.

The subset of the population that happened to get lucky and have a mutation that could survive the antibiotic already existed within the larger population at some threshold level (no argument there) and therefore survived while the other 99.99% did not. But when there are millions, billions or trillions in the population, each capable of holding random mutations, the probability of some minimum threshold number of them having a survival mutation can be high enough for that population to survive. The population that survived may have very different physical characteristics than the population that didn't, depending on the nature of the mutation(s). Enough cycles of this can ultimately produce a new species or a new genus, with no predictability in whether the path is smooth and continuous, or via dramatic jumps in the changes per cycle, because the mutations responsible are random.

[Clownboat]

[Replying to brunumb]

So God tortured a decent human being just to show people his magnificence. He is one sick puppy. And to do this in partnership with the so-called father of sin makes him no better than Satan himself. You worship an immoral monster.

We call men that give their life for their country heros.

We call men that give their life for the families heros also.

Here Job was giving his life for his friends. The Bible says that no love is greater than to lay down your life for your friends.

Death is not the end of things but simply the door into eternity. Being used to save someone for all of eternity, there is no higher honor.

Sounds like your god is still the monster here and Job the hero.

Believing death to not be the end, because of faith is also unwise IMO, because we just don't know, death just might be the end. Religions all over the world are useful at getting people to risk their earthly lives for some empty promise of an afterlife. Your religion included.

Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quotes. "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."

[EarthScienceguy]

[Replying to post 271 by brunumb]

I can't think of anything more pointless than worship. Any being desiring such a thing is clearly just on an ego trip and consequently not even worthy of people wasting their time on it for them. Faced with the reality of an eternity spent in worship of God, I think even Christians would ultimately balk. Worship and blasphemy are two of the most absurd concepts conceived by human beings.

So why would you be upset about not going to Heaven, that is what we are going to do and it will be a Wonderful day.

[EarthScienceguy]

[Replying to post 273 by Clownboat]

Believing death to not be the end, because of faith is also unwise IMO, because we just don't know, death just might be the end. Religions all over the world are useful at getting people to risk their earthly lives for some empty promise of an afterlife. Your religion included.

Other religions men give their lives so they might get to heaven. Christians are already in because nothing can "pluck them from the Father's Hand". So Christians give their lives so that others may come to know the love of Christ as they know the love of Christ.

Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quotes. "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."

Many rulers tried to stomp out Christianity because Christians allegiance is to Christ and not a ruler.

_________________
You can build a man a fire and he will be warm for a day, or you can set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.

You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.

I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible being’s wrath. - KenRU

[EarthScienceguy]

[Replying to post 265 by Aetixintro]

Entropy seems to be more a theory of substances rather than fact. Some substances are incredibly stable and the actual splitting of substances due to entropy has yet to be seen or otherwise confirmed.

I am not understanding how you are connecting philosophical theory with Gibbs free energy equation that all chemical reactions have to obey. I am simply pointing out that evolution cannot follow Gibbs free energy equation. Which I have successfully done for almost 30 pages now.

[brunumb]

[Replying to post 271 by brunumb]

I can't think of anything more pointless than worship. Any being desiring such a thing is clearly just on an ego trip and consequently not even worthy of people wasting their time on it for them. Faced with the reality of an eternity spent in worship of God, I think even Christians would ultimately balk. Worship and blasphemy are two of the most absurd concepts conceived by human beings.

So why would you be upset about not going to Heaven, that is what we are going to do and it will be a Wonderful day.

I'm not upset about not going to heaven. I am quite confident that no one is going to heaven because there is no such place. It is just a religious carrot dangled in front of the gullible to keep them in line as long as they are alive.

That aside, what exactly is the point of worship?

[Guy Threepwood]

[Replying to post 271 by brunumb]

I can't think of anything more pointless than worship. Any being desiring such a thing is clearly just on an ego trip and consequently not even worthy of people wasting their time on it for them. Faced with the reality of an eternity spent in worship of God, I think even Christians would ultimately balk. Worship and blasphemy are two of the most absurd concepts conceived by human beings.

So why would you be upset about not going to Heaven, that is what we are going to do and it will be a Wonderful day.

I'm not upset about not going to heaven. I am quite confident that no one is going to heaven because there is no such place. It is just a religious carrot dangled in front of the gullible to keep them in line as long as they are alive.

That aside, what exactly is the point of worship?

What is the point of love?

[brunumb]

[Replying to post 278 by Guy Threepwood]

brunumb: That aside, what exactly is the point of worship?

Guy Threepwood: What is the point of love?

Please answer my question first. If you do not know the point of worship, just say so.

[EarthScienceguy]

[Replying to brunumb]

Again this has to do totally with being a Christian so those that are not Christians are going to have no idea what is so great about worship.

But worship is the acknolegement that there is a being greater than yourself. And in the case of a Christian they acknowledge that Jesus came and gave His life on the cross as a replacement for us. So that we would not have to be eternally separated from God.

There are actually two ideas here

1. the acknowledgement that God is greater than we.

2. That we are sinners and that Christ came and paid the penalty for that sin.

1 Cor. 1:18 "For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God."