Can Jesus Christ can be shown to be the Son of God

[McCulloch]

I believe that the following facets of my faith can be demonstrated by logical deduction

3. Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Can Jesus Christ can be shown to be the Son of God by logical deduction?

[jimvansage]

"How can it be said that God has free will if he always makes the right decision. God cannot be free to decide to do other that the most optimal best choice. Given omniscience, he knows the best choice, and being omnipotent, he is able to do it."

Knowing I'm going to eat cereal for breakfast Friday morning does not mean it's not a choice. There's many reasons why I should or shouldn't eat cereal for breakfast on Friday, but knowing them in advance doesn't rob me of my choice. In the end, if the only food in the house were cereal and I had no money, my option is eat cereal or not eat at all.
I'd like to think that if I was omniscient and knew the infinite outcomes of every action I took/decision I made, I would choose/act according to what was best for as many as possible. I'm not saying that's how God works or that we can know with certainty how God works, but if not then we can't assume that foreknowledge cancels out the possibility of free will.

as for "no sin...no freedom"
Even if I assume that there is no free will in heaven, that the one in heaven just continually enjoys the full reward of spiritual blessings and intimate communion with a loving God whom that one also loves, it does not diminish the importance of people coming to God by their own free will in this life.
That's like asking "why create the universe if the ideal destination is heaven?"
If Creation points man to the knowledge that God is (Ps. 19)
then that Creation serves an eternal purpose even though it is temporary.

I have personally never opposed science, only "science falsely so called" (1 Timothy 6:20), but that is another matter.

[orthodox skeptic]

is

I believe that the following facets of my faith can be demonstrated by logical deduction

3. Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Can Jesus Christ can be shown to be the Son of God by logical deduction?

With all due respect I believe the first question to be resolved is; "Can the existence of God be demonstrated by logical deduction?" Until then the question you pose must be held in Abeyance.

[instantc]

"How can it be said that God has free will if he always makes the right decision. God cannot be free to decide to do other that the most optimal best choice. Given omniscience, he knows the best choice, and being omnipotent, he is able to do it."

Knowing I'm going to eat cereal for breakfast Friday morning does not mean it's not a choice. There's many reasons why I should or shouldn't eat cereal for breakfast on Friday, but knowing them in advance doesn't rob me of my choice. In the end, if the only food in the house were cereal and I had no money, my option is eat cereal or not eat at all.

However, according to the traditional concept, God cannot do evil, there isn't that possibility. Otherwise, in some possible world, God would be evil, and that would lead to an absurdity. Therefore God has no choice but to be good.

Our good actions are praiseworthy exactly because we had a choice and we chose to do the right thing. Surely if a person had no choice but to do the right thing, we would have no reason to consider his actions morally good. That's why its hard for me to understand why actions of God would be worth praising.

[todd_vetter33]

I believe that the following facets of my faith can be demonstrated by logical deduction

3. Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Can Jesus Christ can be shown to be the Son of God by logical deduction?

The answer is Yes, but Truth must be told to back the logical deduction. What is better, if you walk in the Way Jesus walked to become the firstborn from the dead, you too could be a son of God after the same manner as Jesus (through spiritual re-birth).

[todd_vetter33]

is

I believe that the following facets of my faith can be demonstrated by logical deduction

3. Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Can Jesus Christ can be shown to be the Son of God by logical deduction?

With all due respect I believe the first question to be resolved is; "Can the existence of God be demonstrated by logical deduction?" Until then the question you pose must be held in Abeyance.

The only way all of these prophecies could come into perfect alignment to bare witness to the crucifixion and resurrection perfectly, is if God was in control of the words spoken that would fortel the future events that took place in our past.

Just because Christianity via tradition and doctrine mis-represent the perfection of Word of God does not mean word of God and God does not exist. Below is an example of word of God (truth) concerning the death and resurrection topic in comparison to the lie told by the Christian world concerning the same topic.





Prophecy will always be God's witness of God's children. Jesus was only the firstborn from the dead. Fulfill the law and you can be a child of God just as Jesus was a child of God.

[jimvansage]

is

With all due respect I believe the first question to be resolved is; "Can the existence of God be demonstrated by logical deduction?" Until then the question you pose must be held in Abeyance.

I feel the same way, but am doing my best to defend all three propositions at once.
Whether Jesus rose after part of 3 days and three nights or after an exact 72 hour period is really inconsequential at this point, though I appreciate the zeal behind it.

But the argument for the Bible and the Deity of Jesus can stand alone.
If the Bible is beyond human invention alone, it owes it's origin to a supernatural source.
If the person and work of Jesus Christ is beyond human invention, the claim of his existence and perfection must be true, which would demand the existence of a perfect being, a being who cannot lie, and a being who claimed to be the Son of God.
The knowledge that God is (or presumption of Theism) is also supported by a series of arguments.

[Danmark]

is

I believe that the following facets of my faith can be demonstrated by logical deduction

3. Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Can Jesus Christ can be shown to be the Son of God by logical deduction?

With all due respect I believe the first question to be resolved is; "Can the existence of God be demonstrated by logical deduction?" Until then the question you pose must be held in Abeyance.

The only way all of these prophecies could come into perfect alignment to bare witness to the crucifixion and resurrection perfectly, is if God was in control of the words spoken that would fortel the future events that took place in our past.

Just because Christianity via tradition and doctrine mis-represent the perfection of Word of God does not mean word of God and God does not exist. Below is an example of word of God (truth) concerning the death and resurrection topic in comparison to the lie told by the Christian world concerning the same topic.





Prophecy will always be God's witness of God's children. Jesus was only the firstborn from the dead. Fulfill the law and you can be a child of God just as Jesus was a child of God.

The answer is 'no' and I find the chart to be less than helpful. Perhaps you could make one or two points, clearly stated in your own words, then we can respond.

[Divine Insight]

But the argument for the Bible and the Deity of Jesus can stand alone.

How so? Without the existence of a God, it would be impossible to claim that Jesus was a demigod born of a virgin woman who was impregnated by God.

So the whole fable of Jesus rests entirely upon a God existing prior to Jesus. Jesus has not feet of his own to stand on. This religion only works if Jesus stands upon the shoulder of "God".

If the Bible is beyond human invention alone, it owes it's origin to a supernatural source.

That may be true, but there is no evidence that the Bible is beyond human invention alone. On the contrary that's precisely what it appears to be.

If the person and work of Jesus Christ is beyond human invention, the claim of his existence and perfection must be true, which would demand the existence of a perfect being, a being who cannot lie, and a being who claimed to be the Son of God.

Actually you're going overboard here. Even if the rumored works of Jesus could be shown to have actually happened and to have been true, (which they can't be), it still wouldn't follow that there must exist a perfect being who cannot lie. On the contrary, the Pharisees accused Jesus of basically being a witch and using the power of Satan to perform his magic. Who's to say that the Pharisees were wrong?

So it could be that there simply exist evil demons, and there is no benevolent God at all.

But even that assumes that Jesus was actually performing real magic, which would be impossible for us to determine today.

The knowledge that God is (or presumption of Theism) is also supported by a series of arguments.

What arguments?

Most arguments for the existence of a God are circular and fail to satisfy the conditions of logic anyway.

For example, the argument that there must be a God because the universe could not have just popped into existence from nothing, or that it had to have had an original cause before it could exist, is nothing short of very poor logic.

Why? Because, if by logic, we require that anything that exists must required a creator or first cause in order to exist, then we must also require this of God himself. And thus it becomes circular because God could then not exist unless he had a first cause or creator, etc, for infinity. It's a non-argument.

And if you premise that a God could exist without a creator, then there's no logical reason to no postulate the same thing for the universe itself.

The other popular argument for the existence of a God, is the design, or intelligence argument proclaiming that things had to have been designed, and intelligence cannot arise from non-intelligence. But the very same circular scenario plays out again.

If we the premise that complex things, or intelligence cannot exist without a designing creator, then we must also apply that to the designing creator as well, and once again, it become infinitely circular.

In short, there is no rational logical argument for the existence of any God.

[moment_of_faith]

I believe that the following facets of my faith can be demonstrated by logical deduction

3. Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Can Jesus Christ can be shown to be the Son of God by logical deduction?

I say take it from a demon

Mark 1:23 Suddenly, a man in the synagogue who was possessed by an evil[h] spirit began shouting, 24 Why are you interfering with us, Jesus of Nazareth? Have you come to destroy us? I know who you are"the Holy One of God!

25 Jesus cut him short. Be quiet! Come out of the man, he ordered. 26 At that, the evil spirit screamed, threw the man into a convulsion, and then came out of him.

[Danmark]

I believe that the following facets of my faith can be demonstrated by logical deduction

3. Jesus Christ is the Son of God

Can Jesus Christ can be shown to be the Son of God by logical deduction?

I say take it from a demon

Mark 1:23 Suddenly, a man in the synagogue who was possessed by an evil[h] spirit began shouting, 24 Why are you interfering with us, Jesus of Nazareth? Have you come to destroy us? I know who you are"the Holy One of God!

25 Jesus cut him short. Be quiet! Come out of the man, he ordered. 26 At that, the evil spirit screamed, threw the man into a convulsion, and then came out of him.

This may be a first, a testimonial from a demon asserted as evidence of deity.

If I had a demon on the witness stand, I think I could make a few points on the demon's lack of credibility and his reputation as a liar.

I can see it now:

Judge: "Raise your right hand and put your left hand on the Bible and ..."
Demon: "Judge, I ... uh... well ... you see, judge I can't put my hand on the Bible."
Judge: "Why not?"
Demon: "Well, judge, to tell you the truth [for a change] it hurts!"

But before we even get to the demon, we have to wonder about the accuracy of this 3d hand reporting about what this lying demon actually said, if anything.

Then of course there is the problem about whether demons exist at all.

I just did a little experiment, dangerous I'll admit. I asked demons in general, just now, to enter my body and take over my soul.

Nothing.

Now I'm the first to admit that it would take a demon of fairly low grade, a 4th class demon, just a beginner to settle for a body like mine, but all the same, you'd think there would be at least one worthless little demon out there who didn't have a better offer. Just one.

But, no. Nothing.

Perhaps I just need to be more patient.
I'll wait.

Or . . . maybe I already have a demon and don't know it. Could be. That would explain a lot. But if I do have a demon, he isn't able to get me to say
"I know who you are"the Holy One of God!

Crafty, my demon.