What belifs make a Christain?

[Donray]

For me to ask a question in another topic I need to understand what beliefs a Christain must have to be called a Christian.

From my understanding in using this board, several online religious course, and my
knowledge on the bible I have come to the following:

There are only two beliefs that all Christians must have:

1: That Mary was a virgin and God created a baby in her.
2: Jesus was crucified and rose from bring dead.

It does matter if you think the bible is 100% true or 100% stories and myths.
It does not matter if ware magic underwear or not.
It does not matter if you are baptized or not.
It does not matter if your gay or not.
It does not matter what rituals you perform.
It does not matter if you belong to one of thousand Christain cults and main religions.
It does not matter if you pray or attend a church.

Nothing else matters.

Am I correct?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 34 by Tcg]

So why do you say they are Christians?

Because they are Christians. They follow what they believe to be the teachings of Jesus Christ. Nothing else is required.


Tcg

Oh, so because "they believe" that Jesus' teachings are neutral about homosexuality, that makes it so? I think the fact remains that Jesus taught certain things, and they can be determined by reading the Bible. If someone is not following his teachings, by definition they cannot be called "Christians."

I can believe that he taught that it's OK to rob a bank. Does that make it so?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 38 by Divine Insight]

What "hatred" am I spreading? You say that because I am stating what God and Christ think about homosexuality, I am spreading hatred? Your opinion of them is not very good, is it?

YHWH said that we must WARN people about what is right and what is not. This is the LOVING thing to do.

"When I [YHWH] say to someone wicked, 'You will surely die,' but you do not warn him, and you fail to speak in order to warn the wicked one to turn back from his wicked course so that he may stay alive, he will die for his error because he is wicked, but I will ask his blood back from you. But if you warn someone wicked and he does not turn back from his wickedness, he will die for his error, but you will certainly save your own life." (Ezekiel 3:18,19)

"'Do I take any pleasure at all in the death of a wicked person?' declares the Sovereign Lord Jehovah. 'Do I not prefer that he turn away from his ways and keep living?'" (Ezekiel 18:23)

[Sojournerofthearth]

[Replying to post 31 by Divine Insight]

Sojournerofthearth wrote:

A Christian follows Christ's teachings. They emulate the life He led. They have the Spirit of God in them. They do what Jesus did.

Devine Insight wrote:
No human follows the teaching of the so-called Christ. For one thing the Bible has Christ teaching:

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
'
No human can do that. So it's impossible to do as Jesus taught according to the Bible.

Also to say, "They have the spirit of God in them" is nothing short of elevating themselves to a position of divine status that is above all others. Rolling Eyes

All this amounts to is a self-brainwashing technique used to convince themselves that they can do no wrong, and must necessarily always be correct in their religious position. After all, how could they possibly continue to believe that they have the spirit of God in them and simultaneously think that they might not have realized "Perfect Moral Values".

For a person to claim that they have the spirit of God in them is actually a quite dangerous psychological position to paint themselves into. They can no longer claim to doubt, or be confused about any moral issue. For how could they possibly be confused about these things if they have the spirit of God in them?

Clearly these religions are dangerous. They cause people to start thinking that they have "God on their side" and that they cannot be wrong.

That's a very dangerous position to place oneself in. Especially when they have no choice to but also decree that the Bible cannot be literally true.

What they have actually done in this case is toss Christian dogma in the doghouse and have proclaimed divine authority in that they speak for God because they have the spirit of God in them. Rolling Eyes

This is not a good place to be, and the very reason why religions are indeed dangerous. It causes some people to basically think they are God. After all, to claim to have the spirit of God within them is hardly any different from claiming to be God. At least in terms of being able to recognize "God's Morality". So they become an "authority" on God's morality. When in reality all they are really doing is voicing their own persona moral views and opinions and psychologically convincing themselves that God backs their opinions up.

I suppose that would depend, greatly, upon whether a person was attempting to create God in their own image or to actually attempt too emulate Christ. Anyone in an arrogant, self aggrandizing, judgmental attitude, quite clearly, has lost the plot.

Be ye perfect, would be better, more accurately, translated, be ye complete; because mankind was made to receive the Spirit of God and is an incomplete creation.

You are, however, correct in your assessment, that it is impossible, with, by and through man. But with God, all things are possible. You must become converted, a process that stretches over a lifetime.

Soj

[Sojournerofthearth]

[Replying to post 37 by Tcg]

They follow [strike]what they believe to be[/strike] the teachings of Jesus Christ

My guess is that most everyone has, at one time or another, fallen into that category. People often recreate the bible in accordance with their currant morass, social acceptance or group pressure. Hence, they do not follow the teachings of Jesus Christ, but more accurately, follow what they believe to be the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Soj

[Donray]

So, according to JWs you must hat homosexuality because God and Jesus hated it. So to hate is a Christain thing.

So no homosexuals can be Christians not anyone that tolerates them. You must 5think all homosexuality, is a sin and evil.

[onewithhim]

So, according to JWs you must hat homosexuality because God and Jesus hated it. So to hate is a Christain thing.

So no homosexuals can be Christians not anyone that tolerates them. You must 5think all homosexuality, is a sin and evil.

Yes, homosexuality is.

The Bible tells us to hate what is bad. Is it not right to hate things that God tells us are not beneficial for us? He hates lying, murder, stealing....."Hate" of certain things is something that is OK to have.

"There are six things that Jehovah hates; yes, seven things that he detests: Haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart plotting wicked schemes, and feet that run quickly to evil, a false witness who lies with every breath, and anyone sowing contentions among brothers." (Proverbs 6:16-19)

So it's alright to hate bad things.

[Divine Insight]

What "hatred" am I spreading?

If someone claims to be a Christian and you decree that they are not a Christian, I say that this is a very hateful act on your behalf.

You say that because I am stating what God and Christ think about homosexuality, I am spreading hatred? Your opinion of them is not very good, is it?

Sorry but you don't speak for God and Christ.

Besides, the scripture didn't tell you to accuse people of anything. All it asked you to do was to warn them of what you believe to be a sin, and if they aren't interested in your warning you are supposed to walk away. You're not supposed to be accusing them of anything.

[Divine Insight]

Be ye perfect, would be better, more accurately, translated, be ye complete; because mankind was made to receive the Spirit of God and is an incomplete creation.

This is just your opinion. Besides if our creator created us as an incomplete creation then he would be totally responsible for our predicament and we could have no responsibility for being in the predicament at all. So that apology doesn't fly. All it does is relieve us from having any responsibility entirely.

You are, however, correct in your assessment, that it is impossible, with, by and through man. But with God, all things are possible. You must become converted, a process that stretches over a lifetime.

Again a failed apology. It can't stretch over a lifetime as many humans die young.

These apologies that you have been buying into and regurgitating don't make any sense if you really take some time to stop and think about them.

In fact they make absolutely no sense at all. You say a person must be converted. But converted from what? A decent loving person needs no conversion. And only the most hideous evil God would condemn decent loving people.

There's even a very good reason to ask you why you believe these apologies? Were you at one time an evil hateful person who choose evil over good? And then became converted to become a loving person who prefers good over evil?

It would seem to me that this would necessarily be true if you actually believe the apologies you give. Otherwise why would you believe such a thing?

But for some of us these kinds of religious theological "hooks" are clearly nonsense.

It makes no sense that a decent loving person needs to be converted into a decent loving person when that's what they already are.

[onewithhim]

What "hatred" am I spreading?

If someone claims to be a Christian and you decree that they are not a Christian, I say that this is a very hateful act on your behalf.

You say that because I am stating what God and Christ think about homosexuality, I am spreading hatred? Your opinion of them is not very good, is it?

Sorry but you don't speak for God and Christ.

Besides, the scripture didn't tell you to accuse people of anything. All it asked you to do was to warn them of what you believe to be a sin, and if they aren't interested in your warning you are supposed to walk away. You're not supposed to be accusing them of anything.

That is true. However, if I remember correctly, someone ASKED me if two gay men were indeed Christians. I answered as truthfully as I knew how.

[Sojournerofthearth]

[Replying to post 48 by Divine Insight]

Apology? Perfect, Strong's Definition: From G5056; complete (in various applications of labor, growth, mental and moral character, etc.); neuter (as noun, with G3588) completeness: - of full age, man, perfect... it's s not my opinion. The word means complete.

I'm lost with the whole apology bit.

Soj