The Almighty Afterthought

[William]

'You shall surely die"

Genesis 2:15...
And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.
And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Given there were no other options made available on the breaking of this commandment, and with the Christian claim that the biblical God [BG] is the perfect parent-figure;

QFD: Is withholding/not providing other options [such as the possibility of forgiveness through repentance] really to be considered the perfect way to do parenting?

[William]

QFD: Is withholding/not providing other options [such as the possibility of forgiveness through repentance] really to be considered the perfect way to do parenting?

I think neglecting to have options or neglecting to give information about any options, is not a healthy way for parent/child relationship to develop on a healthy responsible platform.

I think it is a form of control and abuse.

I also think that the use of fear and guilt makes any relationship lopsided and harmful, and benefits neither the parent or the child.

[William]

[onewithhim]

[Replying to William in post #1]

What do you mean? God was very forthright with Adam and, after untold years of talking with him, strolling in the Garden in the breezy part of the day, and clearly explaining what would happen if Adam took fruit off that one tree. Adam was no innocent dummy. He knew exactly what would happen if he took the forbidden fruit. There were many other trees to eat from that Adam and Eve could've sated themselves with. Nothing good was being held back from them.

Of course Jehovah would've forgiven an innocent mistake. But A&E didn't commit a "mistake".....it was deliberate and willful, and that is why they died.

.

[nobspeople]

[Replying to William in post #1]

QFD: Is withholding/not providing other options [such as the possibility of forgiveness through repentance] really to be considered the perfect way to do parenting?

I'm not sure anyone has said or been able to show, there to be 'the perfect way to do parenting'.
Seems with billions of people alive, there are various good and better ways to parent. At least for humans.

If we consider 'the perfect being', I'm not sure there's any analogy that would be apt, as nothing that any human can demonstrate is perfect. I cringe at the comparison of 'god to humanity' and 'parent to child'. It's not remotely an apples-to-apples comparison, as no parent is perfect.

If we consider god isn't (wasn't?) perfect, then that opens the idea up to other options, I suspect, making the 'god/parent' analogy much more palatable and more apt.

At this point, we have to ask: for this discussion, is god to be considered perfect or not?

[William]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #4]

God was very forthright with Adam and, after untold years of talking with him, strolling in the Garden in the breezy part of the day, and clearly explaining what would happen if Adam took fruit off that one tree.

It is best to stick with what is written. Tammy has already tried to add to what was written, so her investment in the beliefs she has, remain undisturbed. You are also adding things which have no bearing on the idea that YHWH acted like a good human parent would, by making sure the child was not abused through meaningless commands which serve only to glorify the commander through fear and guilt placed into the commanded. [parent/child dynamics]

The fruit was not the poison which caused the death. I won't go into any more detail on that, than I have already argued.

If you want to engage in debate about it, then address those arguments.

[William]

At this point, we have to ask: for this discussion, is god to be considered perfect or not?

The Christian belief is that yes - the god of the garden is not only to be considered perfect, but also to be considered a parent re biblical Jesus use of the word "Father".

The question asked pertains to that.

QFD: Is withholding/not providing other options [such as the possibility of forgiveness through repentance] really to be considered the perfect way to do parenting?

[Tcg]

The Christian belief is that yes - the god of the garden is not only to be considered perfect, but also to be considered a parent re biblical Jesus use of the word "Father".

You are using Jesus' use of the word "Father" to support your claim that the god of the garden should be considered a "Father?"

You are aware of the time difference? That the tales of Jesus came many centuries AFTER the tale of the garden?


Tcg

[onewithhim]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #4]

God was very forthright with Adam and, after untold years of talking with him, strolling in the Garden in the breezy part of the day, and clearly explaining what would happen if Adam took fruit off that one tree.

It is best to stick with what is written. Tammy has already tried to add to what was written, so her investment in the beliefs she has, remain undisturbed. You are also adding things which have no bearing on the idea that YHWH acted like a good human parent would, by making sure the child was not abused through meaningless commands which serve only to glorify the commander through fear and guilt placed into the commanded. [parent/child dynamics]

The fruit was not the poison which caused the death. I won't go into any more detail on that, than I have already argued.

If you want to engage in debate about it, then address those arguments.

Of course it wasn't the fruit itself that was poison. The tree represented God's right to make laws and principles to guide humans in their day-to-day lives. If A&E took the fruit, they would be saying that they wanted to run their own lives without Him and decide for themselves what was good or bad. They turned their backs on God, willfully and deliberately.

.

[William]

[Replying to Tcg in post #8]

You are using Jesus' use of the word "Father" to support your claim that the god of the garden should be considered a "Father?"

Nope. I am using the common Christian claim that the god of the garden was the same entity that biblical Jesus was referring to as 'The Father'.