Theology, What is it Good For? Absolutely Nothing!

[boatsnguitars]

I am going to argue that there are few things more useless than Theology.

Definition I will be using:
Theology is the systematic study and interpretation of religious beliefs, doctrines, practices, and texts within the context of a specific religious tradition or belief system. Theology often seeks to understand and explain the nature of the divine, the moral and ethical principles associated with a particular religion, and the relationship between humanity and the divine. Theology can be seen as both an academic discipline and a form of spiritual reflection, depending on the context in which it is pursued.

Lack of Empirical Evidence: Theology is often criticized for its reliance on faith and lack of empirical evidence. Unlike fields like science, which are based on observable and testable phenomena, theology deals with abstract concepts and beliefs that cannot be proven or disproven. This lack of empirical evidence undercuts all validity of theological claims. There is not a single theological claim that can be made that either can't be proven true or false in any objective sense.

Incompatibility with Modern Scientific Methodology: The scientific method is a rigorous process that relies on empirical evidence, experimentation, and falsifiability. Theology, on the other hand, often operates outside the scope of these principles, making it incompatible with modern scientific methodology. This removes Theology from the most rigorous and useful tool we have as humans to determine truth from fiction - Theology thumbs it's nose at science and simply takes the ball and goes home. It refuses to even play the game other than by it's own rules - which change depending on the Theologian.

Fragmentation and Subjectivity: Theology is a highly fragmented field, with various religious traditions, denominations, and sects often having conflicting theological interpretations and beliefs. This fragmentation can lead to subjectivity, where theological conclusions are heavily influenced by personal biases and cultural backgrounds. As a result, theological claims lack universal consistency and credibility. Worse, they can be completely internally consistent to one religion, but completely inconsistent to another religion - the only parallel is in fiction: The Stars Wars universe is distinctly different from the Lord of the Rings universe. Only by entering into one universe can you find consistency, yet, there is nothing to objectively assess one universe from the other with religion. Islam, Mormonism, Christianity, Hinduism, etc. - they can't be proven wrong by another religion, since they all rely on supernatural and irrational beliefs; at least when viewed objectively.

Historical Conflicts and Divisions: Theology has played a significant role in historical conflicts, disputes, and divisions among different religious groups. Theological disagreements have often led to religious wars, schisms, and animosities, which can be seen as evidence of the negative consequences of theological study. It's not just that Theology is useless - it's dangerous. At least when someone brings up science and how it created the atom bomb, one can point to cancer cures and other benefits. With Theology, there seems to be no significant benefit - that is, if one points to the joy or peace religion offers, that can be done without theology, or, put another way: A ancient Polynesian found as much joy and peace in their religion as a modern Christian and theology would make no difference to that truth.

Limited Practical Utility: While theology may provide insights into the beliefs and practices of religious groups, it often has limited practical utility in addressing real-world problems and challenges. Fields like medicine, engineering, and economics offer tangible solutions and improvements to society, while theology is often seen as offering little practical guidance. Imagine all the people studying theology were to actually apply themselves to solving real problems? In truth, Theology is a massively egotistical practice of navel gazing.

Decline in Influence: In many modern societies, the influence of theology has declined significantly. People increasingly turn to secular and evidence-based approaches to address questions about the world and human existence, relegating theology to a more peripheral role in shaping public policy, education, and moral values. More and more - other than people studying theology to get rich off of old ladies - there is no demand for theologians to weigh in on any problem that faces the world. Sure, they are trotted out for a 30 second spot to comment on Halloween, or their view about another Virgin Mary statue leaking, but there are no serious people asking theologians for serious answers to serious questions.

Ethical and Moral Questions: Theological discussions around ethics and morality are often seen as arbitrary and subjective, as they depend on specific religious beliefs and interpretations. This can hinder the development of a shared moral framework that is inclusive and relevant to diverse societies. in fact, as I repeatedly say: No one understand morality less than a religious person.

Redundancy: Many philosophical and ethical questions that theology attempts to answer can also be addressed by other fields, such as philosophy, psychology, sociology, and ethics, without relying on religious beliefs. This makes theology appear redundant in the quest for knowledge and understanding. In the race case a theologian may have an actual answer that matters (I can't think of one), these are better answered by other fields; fields that have objective methods to determine the truth or falsity of the claims.

Changing Social and Cultural Norms: As societies evolve and adapt to changing norms and values, theology may find itself struggling to keep up with these shifts. Theological doctrines that were once considered absolute may become outdated and irrelevant in the face of evolving social and cultural norms. All religions die - all theologies become obsolete. Sure, current theologians believe their religion is the exception - which is exactly what all the other theologians believed before. Also, to this point, we see how religions change to meet current beliefs: Gay pastors, for example. What happened to no gays? It appears the earlier theologians were wrong - or the current ones are - and it's all just speculation and subjective opinion.

Lack of Consensus: Theological debates often lack consensus and can result in never-ending discussions without clear resolutions. This lack of conclusive answers can lead to frustration and a sense of futility in theological inquiry. There has never been consensus, never will be consensus because there are no facts to discuss. There is no "there there."

These are reasons Theology is useless. I would argue it damaging on top of it's uselessness - which makes it ultimately dangerous.

But, worse, beyond it being useless, it's so simplistic and arbitrary that it allows anyone to do it. Even the most simple-minded fool can wax on about their belief about their favorite God of the hour. They can make all kinds of proclamations about what their God thinks, want, wonders, does or does do. They can be inconsistent and claim it's us, the non-believer that doesn't understand! They can say things like "God says yes, no and maybe". They can claim God is too complex to understand - yet, they will tell us all about how they understand God. (This phenomenon isn't about how complex God is, but how poor the person is at expressing their childish grasp of a ephemeral subject that doesn't exist).

And, still worse... yes, it gets worse: Theology is a field ripe for attracting the insane; the conspiracy minded; the tin-foil hat wearing buffoons' that from their basement in Iowa have somehow discovered the answer to all questions through numbers and signs; who somehow know exactly what the government is doing, and is someone been anointed by God to understand these things and educate us all on these matters. And they are treated as divinely inspired - get that? Insane ramblings are equal to "divine inspiration" - That should tell us something of how valuable Theology is when you can't distinguish madness from inspired truth.

And still worse... Theology can be invented from whole cloth and considered respectable by the people who practice it: Think of how serious Scientologists take themselves! Mormons! Christians! They all think they all took themselves so seriously even as they were inventing the religion! Don't think for a moment that early Christians were any different from any other early religious group. They joined their little circles and told stories that made them feel good and decided it was the truth that everyone needed to hear. What ego! What profound ignorance! The blind leading the blind - and Theologians giving them cover every step of the way.

Watch the pomp and pageantry of a Church service. Watch how seriously they take the breaking of bread, or hanging from hooks, or dipping of water, or wearing special underwear, or bathing in the Ganges, or walking on coals... These were developed by Theologians to honor their imaginary gods - and there is no telling which, if any, actually does the thing it is supposed to do: God answers yes, no or maybe - remember? So, Theologians could say, "You must drink wine and eat bread to curry favor of Malosh the One-Eyed Bull God (or whatever practice or god) - but you can't know if that works because "yes, no, maybe."

In other words, a Theologian could invent ideas that they know are invented, but if he can get someone to believe them, he still gets paid. There is no QA/QC when it comes to Theology. If a school rejects some loon because they don't believe the Bible properly, that Theologian gets to go to another school and claim they are the one speaking the truth, and the old school is filled with vipers and heretics - and - as the events surrounding Marcion proved - none of it matters except that one tradition wins out over another. Not truth, mind you, just one story sounds better to more people.

Like art. Like a Hollywood Blockbuster. But, there is room in theology for the Art House films, and a host of other takes on the Supernatural Cartoon Universe in which gods can turn people into trees, water into wine, etc.

And we are supposed to take this seriously? We are to be respectful of these outrageously inane beliefs? Really? Have you seen the Pope's hat and robes? They are hilarious! It's as if they are mocking us - begging us to say something.

So, there is my argument against Theology. Would anyone like to argue in favor of Theology?

[TRANSPONDER]

I am certainly bemused (a combination of bewildered and amused) by the staggering amount of effort and complexity put into a subject which has university courses and dedicated Ashrams for teaching what is without any credible foundation. I'm not sure how it works in the funding, but my feeling is that not a single penny of public money should be put into teaching theology, religion or scripture, other than as a mythology, literature or history subject. And that applies to all religions.

[boatsnguitars]

I am certainly bemused (a combination of bewildered and amused) by the staggering amount of effort and complexity put into a subject which has university courses and dedicated Ashrams for teaching what is without any credible foundation. I'm not sure how it works in the funding, but my feeling is that not a single penny of public money should be put into teaching theology, religion or scripture, other than as a mythology, literature or history subject. And that applies to all religions.

Yep. There hasn't been one discovery or valuable contribution to the world from the field of Theology. The grand joke is that Theology is really just an Extreme Book Club - a group of Fanboys, with robes and funny hats. It's an Art - a subjective enterprise - that demands that people take them seriously. It's like that stereotypical snob that thinks Aaron Rogers is the greatest quarterback ever - never realizing they simply prefer Rogers, and when this is pointed out, they get angry and have a fit - and kill people.

I'd be embarrassed to admit I was religious.

[TRANSPONDER]

I am certainly bemused (a combination of bewildered and amused) by the staggering amount of effort and complexity put into a subject which has university courses and dedicated Ashrams for teaching what is without any credible foundation. I'm not sure how it works in the funding, but my feeling is that not a single penny of public money should be put into teaching theology, religion or scripture, other than as a mythology, literature or history subject. And that applies to all religions.

Yep. There hasn't been one discovery or valuable contribution to the world from the field of Theology. The grand joke is that Theology is really just an Extreme Book Club - a group of Fanboys, with robes and funny hats. It's an Art - a subjective enterprise - that demands that people take them seriously. It's like that stereotypical snob that thinks Aaron Rogers is the greatest quarterback ever - never realizing they simply prefer Rogers, and when this is pointed out, they get angry and have a fit - and kill people.

I'd be embarrassed to admit I was religious.

Yes. In the past I have compared it to Star Wars or Star -trek conventions. It's all good fun and community - just so long as they don't take it too seriously. Religion is a fanboy (and fangirl) club and they do take it seriously - politically and militarially seriously, always have and are still doing it. The thing that gets me is that they all peddle and push their own Theologies, but dismiss out of hand all the others. Even the same religion, different sect. Even more than atheists do. Don't they understand that they are as atheist as the atheists - except for their One belief they are fans of? I guess not, because that is hope Faith works.

[boatsnguitars]

I am certainly bemused (a combination of bewildered and amused) by the staggering amount of effort and complexity put into a subject which has university courses and dedicated Ashrams for teaching what is without any credible foundation. I'm not sure how it works in the funding, but my feeling is that not a single penny of public money should be put into teaching theology, religion or scripture, other than as a mythology, literature or history subject. And that applies to all religions.

Yep. There hasn't been one discovery or valuable contribution to the world from the field of Theology. The grand joke is that Theology is really just an Extreme Book Club - a group of Fanboys, with robes and funny hats. It's an Art - a subjective enterprise - that demands that people take them seriously. It's like that stereotypical snob that thinks Aaron Rogers is the greatest quarterback ever - never realizing they simply prefer Rogers, and when this is pointed out, they get angry and have a fit - and kill people.

I'd be embarrassed to admit I was religious.

Yes. In the past I have compared it to Star Wars or Star -trek conventions. It's all good fun and community - just so long as they don't take it too seriously. Religion is a fanboy (and fangirl) club and they do take it seriously - politically and militarially seriously, always have and are still doing it. The thing that gets me is that they all peddle and push their own Theologies, but dismiss out of hand all the others. Even the same religion, different sect. Even more than atheists do. Don't they understand that they are as atheist as the atheists - except for their One belief they are fans of? I guess not, because that is hope Faith works.

More and more, I simply can't shake the feeling that religion is not only stupid, but evil. Not all religious people (mainly because most religious people are lukewarm and not a danger - the irony that the Bible thinks they are as evil as the rest of non-believers!), but definitely the basic idea and most practices of religion. It so absurd to think you're going to commit your life to something some guy tells you is true - and when question, he just answers with riddles and snide comments like, "Oh, you think you know better than God?!"

I don't get it - and I was religious once. But I think it's because of my former belief how intensely I feel that it was always built on sand. Jesus loves me? What kind of crap is that? Who the hell is Jesus and why do I care that he loves me? What kind of low self-esteem do I have that I need the approval of some sandal-wearing dead guy? Once I shed the fear of Hell, the rest fell away like scales form my eyes.

I really don't know how people become religious in this day and age. I feel it made a little more sense in my time, since the only counter to religion was a Madelaine O'Hare book in the library that I was too afraid to open in my teens. Now, atheist information is everywhere - as are the violent horrors of religion with each new massacre or bombing.

[TRANSPONDER]

I am certainly bemused (a combination of bewildered and amused) by the staggering amount of effort and complexity put into a subject which has university courses and dedicated Ashrams for teaching what is without any credible foundation. I'm not sure how it works in the funding, but my feeling is that not a single penny of public money should be put into teaching theology, religion or scripture, other than as a mythology, literature or history subject. And that applies to all religions.

Yep. There hasn't been one discovery or valuable contribution to the world from the field of Theology. The grand joke is that Theology is really just an Extreme Book Club - a group of Fanboys, with robes and funny hats. It's an Art - a subjective enterprise - that demands that people take them seriously. It's like that stereotypical snob that thinks Aaron Rogers is the greatest quarterback ever - never realizing they simply prefer Rogers, and when this is pointed out, they get angry and have a fit - and kill people.

I'd be embarrassed to admit I was religious.

Yes. In the past I have compared it to Star Wars or Star -trek conventions. It's all good fun and community - just so long as they don't take it too seriously. Religion is a fanboy (and fangirl) club and they do take it seriously - politically and militarially seriously, always have and are still doing it. The thing that gets me is that they all peddle and push their own Theologies, but dismiss out of hand all the others. Even the same religion, different sect. Even more than atheists do. Don't they understand that they are as atheist as the atheists - except for their One belief they are fans of? I guess not, because that is hope Faith works.

More and more, I simply can't shake the feeling that religion is not only stupid, but evil. Not all religious people (mainly because most religious people are lukewarm and not a danger - the irony that the Bible thinks they are as evil as the rest of non-believers!), but definitely the basic idea and most practices of religion. It so absurd to think you're going to commit your life to something some guy tells you is true - and when question, he just answers with riddles and snide comments like, "Oh, you think you know better than God?!"

I don't get it - and I was religious once. But I think it's because of my former belief how intensely I feel that it was always built on sand. Jesus loves me? What kind of crap is that? Who the hell is Jesus and why do I care that he loves me? What kind of low self-esteem do I have that I need the approval of some sandal-wearing dead guy? Once I shed the fear of Hell, the rest fell away like scales form my eyes.

I really don't know how people become religious in this day and age. I feel it made a little more sense in my time, since the only counter to religion was a Madelaine O'Hare book in the library that I was too afraid to open in my teens. Now, atheist information is everywhere - as are the violent horrors of religion with each new massacre or bombing.

It is (especially for a former believer) easy to feel anger. But it is the sort of 'foolme once' anger than is put into not being fooled again and helping others to be not fooled once. But Religion has done a stelllar PR job (Tracie Harriss (1) in convincing people it is good, moral and necessary to stop society from falling apart. In fact I see religion as coercive, divisive, dangerous and when push comes to shove, violent (doing it - if done to them, nobody beats them for playing victim). I don't hate Christians or their religion, even though I do feel anger at the Big Lie that is being perpetrated because when I see a Christian, I do not see an enemy, fool or liar, I see a potential deconvert.

(1) a rather long but mustwatch video talk.

[boatsnguitars]

I am certainly bemused (a combination of bewildered and amused) by the staggering amount of effort and complexity put into a subject which has university courses and dedicated Ashrams for teaching what is without any credible foundation. I'm not sure how it works in the funding, but my feeling is that not a single penny of public money should be put into teaching theology, religion or scripture, other than as a mythology, literature or history subject. And that applies to all religions.

Yep. There hasn't been one discovery or valuable contribution to the world from the field of Theology. The grand joke is that Theology is really just an Extreme Book Club - a group of Fanboys, with robes and funny hats. It's an Art - a subjective enterprise - that demands that people take them seriously. It's like that stereotypical snob that thinks Aaron Rogers is the greatest quarterback ever - never realizing they simply prefer Rogers, and when this is pointed out, they get angry and have a fit - and kill people.

I'd be embarrassed to admit I was religious.

Yes. In the past I have compared it to Star Wars or Star -trek conventions. It's all good fun and community - just so long as they don't take it too seriously. Religion is a fanboy (and fangirl) club and they do take it seriously - politically and militarially seriously, always have and are still doing it. The thing that gets me is that they all peddle and push their own Theologies, but dismiss out of hand all the others. Even the same religion, different sect. Even more than atheists do. Don't they understand that they are as atheist as the atheists - except for their One belief they are fans of? I guess not, because that is hope Faith works.

More and more, I simply can't shake the feeling that religion is not only stupid, but evil. Not all religious people (mainly because most religious people are lukewarm and not a danger - the irony that the Bible thinks they are as evil as the rest of non-believers!), but definitely the basic idea and most practices of religion. It so absurd to think you're going to commit your life to something some guy tells you is true - and when question, he just answers with riddles and snide comments like, "Oh, you think you know better than God?!"

I don't get it - and I was religious once. But I think it's because of my former belief how intensely I feel that it was always built on sand. Jesus loves me? What kind of crap is that? Who the hell is Jesus and why do I care that he loves me? What kind of low self-esteem do I have that I need the approval of some sandal-wearing dead guy? Once I shed the fear of Hell, the rest fell away like scales form my eyes.

I really don't know how people become religious in this day and age. I feel it made a little more sense in my time, since the only counter to religion was a Madelaine O'Hare book in the library that I was too afraid to open in my teens. Now, atheist information is everywhere - as are the violent horrors of religion with each new massacre or bombing.

It is (especially for a former believer) easy to feel anger. But it is the sort of 'foolme once' anger than is put into not being fooled again and helping others to be not fooled once. But Religion has done a stelllar PR job (Tracie Harriss (1) in convincing people it is good, moral and necessary to stop society from falling apart. In fact I see religion as coercive, divisive, dangerous and when push comes to shove, violent (doing it - if done to them, nobody beats them for playing victim). I don't hate Christians or their religion, even though I do feel anger at the Big Lie that is being perpetrated because when I see a Christian, I do not see an enemy, fool or liar, I see a potential deconvert.

(1) a rather long but mustwatch video talk.

She's my favorite of not only the Atheist Experience group, but of all Atheist advocates. I think she is able to cut right to the main point, and isn't distracted by the Red Herrings Christians try to distract with.


edit: I'm an hour in and it's heartbreaking to hear the damage religion does. Of course, the religious people would blame the atheists for their (the religious people's) actions. They think if they demand their children believe, so it's the child's fault for being disowned if they don't believe.

[brunumb]

Theology: Making up stuff about other made up stuff.

[TRANSPONDER]

Theology: Making up stuff about other made up stuff.

That's certainly what I find in Theist apologetics. making up stuff to paper over problems in the other stuff. Just recently the Cosmic light when genesis clearly says day and night, morning and evening' and the splitting up of Mary from the others at the tomb to explain why she didn't see Jesus before she got to the disciples. There is no shred of this in the Bible and Luke even says Mary Magadalene and the others told all this, but the explanation is made up to explain away the problems with the other stuff. It's how they are able to say 'No problems; no contradictions', because they have made stuff up which doesn't always work, but they tell themselves it explains everything, no problems.

[1213]

...
So, there is my argument against Theology. Would anyone like to argue in favor of Theology?

I accept that as you opinion. I have different opinion, but people have said that opinion don't really matter here, so I think there is no way to go.

But, the idea of things being useless is interesting. I think you could as well say that about everything. In materialistic point of view everything will be destroyed, so everything is actually useless and pointless.