Think about what He taught His apostles.
I don't know of any Church that He would enter.
Okieshowedem
Would the Hebrew Messiah attend your Church?
Moderator: Moderators
-
Okieshowedem
- Banned
- Posts: 110
- Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 7:32 pm
- Location: Abilene, Texas
-
ken1burton
- Apprentice
- Posts: 228
- Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2007 8:33 pm
Post #2
Okieshowedem.
This is very general, With many reasons, possible to list on either side, I think you should list things you are seeing as what Jesus would object to. As you felt this should be a topic. Dig a little deeper as to where you are standing on this.
Ken
This is very general, With many reasons, possible to list on either side, I think you should list things you are seeing as what Jesus would object to. As you felt this should be a topic. Dig a little deeper as to where you are standing on this.
Ken
-
Okieshowedem
- Banned
- Posts: 110
- Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 7:32 pm
- Location: Abilene, Texas
Post #3
Sure will Ken.
First thing that comes to mind is that the Real Messiah would be on a river bank fishing on Sunday not in any Church..;o)
What goes on in all the Churches I know about is what the Scriptures calls Devil worship.
By that I mean they do away with the Laws as was taught by the Hebrew prophets and the apostles of Yahshua. Isayah 8:20 Matt. 19:17
They follow the traditions of men and do not teach or instruct the people the benefits of studying the Laws that was inspired to be written by all the prophets and apostles. Deut. 6:1-25.
Remember what the man after Yahweh's own heart wrote about thos "OLD LAWS" that the Christian religion has nailed to a cross? In Ps.119....
Okieshowedem
First thing that comes to mind is that the Real Messiah would be on a river bank fishing on Sunday not in any Church..;o)
What goes on in all the Churches I know about is what the Scriptures calls Devil worship.
By that I mean they do away with the Laws as was taught by the Hebrew prophets and the apostles of Yahshua. Isayah 8:20 Matt. 19:17
They follow the traditions of men and do not teach or instruct the people the benefits of studying the Laws that was inspired to be written by all the prophets and apostles. Deut. 6:1-25.
Remember what the man after Yahweh's own heart wrote about thos "OLD LAWS" that the Christian religion has nailed to a cross? In Ps.119....
Okieshowedem
-
Okieshowedem
- Banned
- Posts: 110
- Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 7:32 pm
- Location: Abilene, Texas
Post #5
Ken
You must believe that the English translation of the Scriptures are correct.
Other wise you would not be so mixed up in your understanding of what the Law and the prophets taught.
Remember what Yahshua said in Luke 24:25.
Okieshowedem
You must believe that the English translation of the Scriptures are correct.
Other wise you would not be so mixed up in your understanding of what the Law and the prophets taught.
Remember what Yahshua said in Luke 24:25.
Okieshowedem
-
ken1burton
- Apprentice
- Posts: 228
- Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2007 8:33 pm
Post #6
Okieshowedem.
That is Cute. I do understand what the Prophets spoke. I go by what the Prophets spoke, Daniel is a prophet, He said that He would make an end of sins, and bring in everlasting righteousness, Hosea is a prophet, He said after two days will He revive us, in the third day He shall raise us up. Zechariah is a prophet, He said as for Thee also, By the blood of Thy covenant, I have sent froth THY prisoners out of the pit where in is no water, Isaiah is a prophet, He said They dead men shall live, Together with My dead body shall they arise.
Jesus is a Prophet, He said Till heaven and earth pass, that not one jot or tittle would pass from the law till all is fulfilled. He also told the Disciples that they would go up to Jerusalem and all things written by the Prophets concerning the Son of Man would be accomplished. It is also written in:
John 19:28 After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst.
29 Now there was set a vessel full of vinegar: and they filled a spunge with vinegar, and put it upon hyssop, and put it to his mouth.
30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.
He just needed to drink of the Fruit of the Vine, new with them in the Kingdom (VINEgar fulfills this, and allow Himself to die, and all prophecies are fulfilled, and established as truth.
Now with sin having ended as accountable unto men, Where are you coming from? As Jesus brought in everlasting righteousness, Where is the Church coming from? For you have not believed the prophets. You believed Peter, Paul. Etc, and Even Jesus was sealed by the Father from seeing all that was fulfilled.
Isaiah 42:19 Who is blind, but my servant? or deaf, as my messenger that I sent? who is blind as he that is perfect, and blind as the LORD'S servant?
20 Seeing many things, but thou observest not; opening the ears, but he heareth not.
21 The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.
Now where are you coming from? What Prophecy do you feel you believe? Rapture concept is Old Testament prophecy, New Heaven and Earth is old Testament prophecy, end of sin is old Testament prophecy, Everlasting righteousness is old Testament prophecy. Hell ceasing to exist is old Testament Prophecy.
Ken
That is Cute. I do understand what the Prophets spoke. I go by what the Prophets spoke, Daniel is a prophet, He said that He would make an end of sins, and bring in everlasting righteousness, Hosea is a prophet, He said after two days will He revive us, in the third day He shall raise us up. Zechariah is a prophet, He said as for Thee also, By the blood of Thy covenant, I have sent froth THY prisoners out of the pit where in is no water, Isaiah is a prophet, He said They dead men shall live, Together with My dead body shall they arise.
Jesus is a Prophet, He said Till heaven and earth pass, that not one jot or tittle would pass from the law till all is fulfilled. He also told the Disciples that they would go up to Jerusalem and all things written by the Prophets concerning the Son of Man would be accomplished. It is also written in:
John 19:28 After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst.
29 Now there was set a vessel full of vinegar: and they filled a spunge with vinegar, and put it upon hyssop, and put it to his mouth.
30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.
He just needed to drink of the Fruit of the Vine, new with them in the Kingdom (VINEgar fulfills this, and allow Himself to die, and all prophecies are fulfilled, and established as truth.
Now with sin having ended as accountable unto men, Where are you coming from? As Jesus brought in everlasting righteousness, Where is the Church coming from? For you have not believed the prophets. You believed Peter, Paul. Etc, and Even Jesus was sealed by the Father from seeing all that was fulfilled.
Isaiah 42:19 Who is blind, but my servant? or deaf, as my messenger that I sent? who is blind as he that is perfect, and blind as the LORD'S servant?
20 Seeing many things, but thou observest not; opening the ears, but he heareth not.
21 The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.
Now where are you coming from? What Prophecy do you feel you believe? Rapture concept is Old Testament prophecy, New Heaven and Earth is old Testament prophecy, end of sin is old Testament prophecy, Everlasting righteousness is old Testament prophecy. Hell ceasing to exist is old Testament Prophecy.
Ken
-
Okieshowedem
- Banned
- Posts: 110
- Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 7:32 pm
- Location: Abilene, Texas
-
ken1burton
- Apprentice
- Posts: 228
- Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2007 8:33 pm
Post #8
Okieshowedem.
First of all, God is the one speaking through the Prophets. So any problem with the Validity of the Message has nothing to do with the Prophet.
Ezekiel 14:9 And if the prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the LORD have deceived that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand upon him, and will destroy him from the midst of my people Israel.
As far as the Apostles, They were blinded from seeing as in deep sleep. They did not even know they spoke a lot of error which contradicted the Truth which the Old Testament Prophecies foretold.
The Apostles and Paul, Even Jesus did not know the Truth of the Prophecies, And the Churches have not searched out the Matter to get it correct. So, regardless, What is Truth is worth the search. All the dead rose with Christ. Now it is we go to heaven as we die. And we all go to Heaven with the Righteousness of Christ. Daniel 9:24 was fulfilled the day of the Cross as all the prophecies were:
Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy
Isaiah 26:19 Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.
Isaiah 45:8 Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.
I do not care who lied (Let God be true, and every man a liar), or how difficult God has made this, I do care what the Truth of the Matter is. And I have no doubt it is well worth all the effort to find out.
Ken
First of all, God is the one speaking through the Prophets. So any problem with the Validity of the Message has nothing to do with the Prophet.
Ezekiel 14:9 And if the prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the LORD have deceived that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand upon him, and will destroy him from the midst of my people Israel.
As far as the Apostles, They were blinded from seeing as in deep sleep. They did not even know they spoke a lot of error which contradicted the Truth which the Old Testament Prophecies foretold.
The Apostles and Paul, Even Jesus did not know the Truth of the Prophecies, And the Churches have not searched out the Matter to get it correct. So, regardless, What is Truth is worth the search. All the dead rose with Christ. Now it is we go to heaven as we die. And we all go to Heaven with the Righteousness of Christ. Daniel 9:24 was fulfilled the day of the Cross as all the prophecies were:
Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy
Isaiah 26:19 Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.
Isaiah 45:8 Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.
I do not care who lied (Let God be true, and every man a liar), or how difficult God has made this, I do care what the Truth of the Matter is. And I have no doubt it is well worth all the effort to find out.
Ken
-
McCulloch
- Site Supporter
- Posts: 24063
- Joined: Mon May 02, 2005 9:10 pm
- Location: Toronto, ON, CA
- Been thanked: 3 times
Post #9
Okieshowedem, it is the convention in debate to back up your assertions with evidence. Your argument would be stronger if you would cite a few examples of where the prophets and apostles taught against the doctrine of the rapture.Okieshowedem wrote:If the raptures teaching is true then all the prophets and apostles lied!
Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
-
Okieshowedem
- Banned
- Posts: 110
- Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 7:32 pm
- Location: Abilene, Texas
