If there is an afterlife

[pleinmont]

In the unlikely event of there being an afterlife what will it be like? Would we be the same people we are here on earth or totally different? If someone passes into the afterlife as a child, will they stay as such, not growing into an adult? If a person has a disability or illness will they continue to suffer from it?

What do others think?

[William]

[Replying to post 39 by ]

Menotu: I've always thought it would be whatever you wanted it to be.
If you like nature, it would be a endless world of nature
If you like fashion, it would be an endless world of fashion

If there is a punishment of evil, the 'bad' people would go to a place where it's their worse fear forever.

William: I think that overall, if some kind of justice must be meted, this is the best way to have it done.

Menotu: But eternal punishment seems a bit of an overreach for an (assumed) all knowing and all powerful creator

William: Indeed. But as you say, if our next experiences are created by our selves, then we are the creator of said experience - even if we do not realize it - and thus have assumed it was created by an all powerful monster-god which - incidentally - we also created.

Fortunately there are aspects of the stories on afterlife I have studied, which have what are called 'Soul Retrievers' who have been freed from their own illusions through realization that they had actually created those illusion for themselves and these entities are tasked with helping to fix a problem that they helped create. (The Belief in Hell and a monster-god.)
Many of those have been freed from heavenly experiences.

They move into the individuals self-created nightmares and attempt to convince the individual that the whole experience is the individuals own creation and only the individual can stop the nightmare by waking up to it and no longer investing belief into it.

Surprisingly there are stories of individuals who actually refuse to end their suffering, because they believe they deserve it.

I guess they do, until such a time as they don't.

[William]

[Replying to post 38 by ]

bluegreenearth: How would you be able to rule-out the possibility that this perceived after-life wasn't just another holographic simulation?

William: Not only don't I rule that out, but I specifically call it The Hologram Dimensions.

[Diagoras]

[Replying to post 37 by William]

I did start reading Act 1 of that topic, but didnt want to have to continue through many, many posts in three Acts to piece together the ideas you just summarised.

I did find this in a Sticky thread explaining the Mother idea though:

Wiremu created The Hub of Hologram Dimensions based upon his understanding that when an individual human completes their life and death sentence in the Physical Universe, they will then experience "The Next Phase/Level" and the experience of that level will be determined and unfold based upon the individuals own expectations, beliefs and attitudes which they nurtured in The Physical Universe Prison.

It does seem to me that you have created (imagined) something called the Hub of Hologram Dimensions as a kind of stage for thinking about things. If Im interpreting things correctly, then you believe that after death, youll somehow go to this same Hub.

That seems entirely consistent with what Menotu said:

I've always thought it would be whatever you wanted it to be

Because your Hub appears to draw from areas I presume youre interested in: Maori mythology, the Patupaiareh, unicorns and cats (to name a few).

As a thought experiment: do you believe that someone else who expected, believed and nurtured their attitudes towards an afterlife modelled on a vastly different canvas to the exact same extent as you do, would in fact go to their own created afterlife?

To ask it rather more facetiously, Can I get ice cream in heaven?

[bluegreenearth]

[Replying to post 43 by Diagoras]

Fork no! Only frozen yogurt in the Good Place!

[Diagoras]

This will be achieved by means of a miracle from Almighty God.

Reminds me of a famous cartoon:

[William]

[Replying to post 43 by]

Diagoras: I did start reading Act 1 of that topic, but didnt want to have to continue through many, many posts in three Acts to piece together the ideas you just summarised.

I did find this in a Sticky thread explaining the Mother idea though:

• Wiremu created The Hub of Hologram Dimensions based upon his understanding that when an individual human completes their life and death sentence in the Physical Universe, they will then experience "The Next Phase/Level" and the experience of that level will be determined and unfold based upon the individuals own expectations, beliefs and attitudes which they nurtured in The Physical Universe Prison.

William: Yes..I was looking for that but forgot where I put it.


Diagoras: Because your Hub appears to draw from areas I presume youre interested in: Maori mythology, the Patupaiareh, unicorns and cats (to name a few).

William: Yes. Obviously you either are already acquainted with some of the names or did a quick research.

Diagoras: As a thought experiment: do you believe that someone else who expected, believed and nurtured their attitudes towards an afterlife modelled on a vastly different canvas to the exact same extent as you do, would in fact go to their own created afterlife?

To ask it rather more facetiously, Can I get ice cream in heaven?

William: The intricacies are far more subtle than that when it comes to Human Thought and the Tabula Rasa.
To example, one might know oneself as a decent enough human being on a conscious level, but be unaware and disconnected from knowledge which could be garnered from the subconscious level - and 'if there be demons' hiding in those shadows, they will have their effect...which is to say, it isn't just what you believe at conscious levels...any hidden but active attitudes of badness will surface...

If one were to google 'Facing One's Demons" one can also acquaint ones self with that aspect of the game...as it were...but those demons can still appear angelic in one's hereafter...which is pleasant to the general senses and experience...but eventually will still have to be dealt with.

If one has a dark side then best one deals with that on this side of the black stump...in slow motion rather than instant manifestation....

[William]

[center][/center]

[Diagoras]

[Replying to post 43 by]Diagoras: As a thought experiment: do you believe that someone else who expected, believed and nurtured their attitudes towards an afterlife modelled on a vastly different canvas to the exact same extent as you do, would in fact go to their own created afterlife?

William: The intricacies are far more subtle than that when it comes to Human Thought and the Tabula Rasa.
To example, one might know oneself as a decent enough human being on a conscious level, but be unaware and disconnected from knowledge which could be garnered from the subconscious level -

<bolding of would mine>

Its a thought experiment. We can therefore dispense with the subtleties. Thats why I italicised exact to stress that this hypothetical other person is subject to the same conditions as you in every respect - other than his or her afterlife being vastly different. Maybe I should have said could instead of would.

Youve earlier claimed people will have some form of afterlife, and also that each will experience something of their own creation, so I dont think Im asking much that hasnt already been at least alluded to, if not answered outright.

Is the process (of nurturing, believing, etc - all of it) going to work for all cases? Those that pass the test get their personalised heaven, and those who dont get - well, Im not sure. Their own Hall of Judgement? Your version? Being cast into the Outer Darkness?

If so, that joins the everyone gets their own school of thought. If not, then Im interested to hear how its different.

[William]

[Replying to post 48]

Diagoras: Is the process (of nurturing, believing, etc - all of it) going to work for all cases? Those that pass the test get their personalised heaven, and those who dont get - well, Im not sure. Their own Hall of Judgement? Your version? Being cast into the Outer Darkness?

William: I don't see it as some kind of 'test' but rather as a natural ongoing relationship one is having with their experience of individuate self.
The Realm of Judgement is specific to those who require justice in whatever form they understand that to being.
There is no "pass the test get their personal heaven" because those experiencing their personal heaven are under the same category as those who require justice, thus all those "personalised heavens" are within the very same Realm as the "personalized hells"
They too require saving from their own self created illusions, in order to be able to leave The Realm of Judgement, much as a prisoner is reformed and then - through the act of reformation - is able to leave that realm and explore/be creative within the greater aspect of The Hologram Universes which are not suppressed by fear and judgement.

Diagoras: If so, that joins the everyone gets their own school of thought. If not, then Im interested to hear how its different.

William: I am unclear as to what, if any point, you are trying to make here.

[sleepyhead]

Or, of course, you get allocated some new body (reincarnation) - bringing all sorts of other questions and a wide range of answers, depending on whom you ask. Where have all these new bodies been stored beforehand, ready to receive your soul? I dont expect anyone to know (how could they?) but theres no harm in speculating, if thats your thing.

Hello bjs,
Just like to clear up the reincarnation part of your response. We are originally souls. As souls we figured out how to inhabit physical bodies. The physical bodies come about through biology so there not stored somewhere. After the body dies the soul leaves the body. After being encased in the body for several years when it leaves there may or may not retain some physical characteristics of the body it just left for some time afterwards but that's just speculation on my part.