Religion is Placebo

[Mr.Badham]

Placebo administered through injection is more effective than placebo administered through pill form.

Placebo administered by someone dressed as a doctor is more effective than placebo administered by someone dressed as a nurse.

By that rationale, placebo administered by what you believe to be the creator of the universe could explain any personal experience you have ever had with said creator.

It doesn't matter that an actor dressed like a doctor injected you with a saline solution, you'll feel better. With that said, tell me something that has happened to you personally, that I cannot explain away as placebo.

And here's some homework for you. If you haven't had any experiences with the creator, ask yourself why you believe in him. It might be someone else's experience with placebo.

[Moses Yoder]

We're all lucky to have an opportunity to experience the universe. No god required.

I believe God created the universe. Apart from Him, how could there be anything good in it if it had not been created? Sure, I can look at a car and say "This thing just happened to explode into this form, and I am lucky to have it." But wouldn't the experience of owning the car be much more meaningful if I had an intimate, personal relationship with the woman who built it?

[Goat]

We're all lucky to have an opportunity to experience the universe. No god required.

I believe God created the universe. Apart from Him, how could there be anything good in it if it had not been created? Sure, I can look at a car and say "This thing just happened to explode into this form, and I am lucky to have it." But wouldn't the experience of owning the car be much more meaningful if I had an intimate, personal relationship with the woman who built it?

'Good/not good' is a subjective opinion.... and while man might project 'good and not good' onto the world, it merely is projection.

[Mr.Badham]

We're all lucky to have an opportunity to experience the universe. No god required.

I believe God created the universe. Apart from Him, how could there be anything good in it if it had not been created? Sure, I can look at a car and say "This thing just happened to explode into this form, and I am lucky to have it." But wouldn't the experience of owning the car be much more meaningful if I had an intimate, personal relationship with the woman who built it?

I think your analogy would make more sense if you allowed the car salesman to tell you what the woman who built your car expected of you, and your car. Would you let that woman tell you how fast to drive the car? Where to drive it? What you can do in it? What station to play the radio, and how loud? Would you let her tell you who can ride in it with you and for how long?

I'm not sure how having a personal relationship with one of the people on the line at the plant, where your car was assembled, would make owning the car "much more meaningful". My brother-in-law works in the Honda plant not far from where I live. He's an alright guy, but it doesn't give him any authority over the people who buy Hondas.

Your car, like your life, is yours. You don't owe anyone at the plant anything, and don't let the car salesman tell you otherwise. Use it as you wish (without hurting anyone of course), have some fun, enjoy it. It's the only one get.

[Moses Yoder]

We're all lucky to have an opportunity to experience the universe. No god required.

I believe God created the universe. Apart from Him, how could there be anything good in it if it had not been created? Sure, I can look at a car and say "This thing just happened to explode into this form, and I am lucky to have it." But wouldn't the experience of owning the car be much more meaningful if I had an intimate, personal relationship with the woman who built it?

'Good/not good' is a subjective opinion.... and while man might project 'good and not good' onto the world, it merely is projection.

In a prior post in another thread, I think it was you bemoaning the fact that I believed a "good" person could go to hell for not knowing Jesus, while a child molester, which you seem to think is "bad", could go to heaven. You seemed to think this belief had negative connotations. Now you say there is no good or bad. Do you have something in which you believe, or not?

[Dokimas]

We're all lucky to have an opportunity to experience the universe. No god required.

I believe God created the universe. Apart from Him, how could there be anything good in it if it had not been created? Sure, I can look at a car and say "This thing just happened to explode into this form, and I am lucky to have it." But wouldn't the experience of owning the car be much more meaningful if I had an intimate, personal relationship with the woman who built it?

'Good/not good' is a subjective opinion.... and while man might project 'good and not good' onto the world, it merely is projection.

If you had a choice between living near a cannibal and a NT Christian, which would you choose to live near? Where the one you'd choose and why not the one you'd choose against? Remember it's your flesh involved.

[Oldfarmhouse]

The placebo effect plays a strong role in relation to religion in general. The placebo effect is very powerful. that is why it is taken into consideration in medical treatments when they are tested.

A typical scenario that is heard from people who convert to a religion -- bot so much with born-ins -- is:

I was (criminal behavior, addiction, sexual misconduct, greedy and superficial, angry with life, lost and looking for answers, or some other kind of life problem.)

I came to see the light and find meaning through ____.

Now everything is peachy.

Being that the specific religion, doctrine, beliefs, etc. is interchangeable in this scenario -- it's clearly the placebo effect working.

[Goat]

We're all lucky to have an opportunity to experience the universe. No god required.

I believe God created the universe. Apart from Him, how could there be anything good in it if it had not been created? Sure, I can look at a car and say "This thing just happened to explode into this form, and I am lucky to have it." But wouldn't the experience of owning the car be much more meaningful if I had an intimate, personal relationship with the woman who built it?

'Good/not good' is a subjective opinion.... and while man might project 'good and not good' onto the world, it merely is projection.

In a prior post in another thread, I think it was you bemoaning the fact that I believed a "good" person could go to hell for not knowing Jesus, while a child molester, which you seem to think is "bad", could go to heaven. You seemed to think this belief had negative connotations. Now you say there is no good or bad. Do you have something in which you believe, or not?

No, it wasn't me. Nor, did I say there is no 'good' or 'bad', but 'good' and 'bad' are subjective, and the belief of what is 'good' and 'bad' will change from person to person, and from society to society. I don't bother with the whole 'who goes to hell' business, because I don't think hell exists. I personally stay away from the criticisms about the implications of claims of 'who goes to hell', because that has a tendency to start getting personal, and I rather address issues, and not people.

[Dokimas]

The placebo effect plays a strong role in relation to religion in general. The placebo effect is very powerful. that is why it is taken into consideration in medical treatments when they are tested.

A typical scenario that is heard from people who convert to a religion -- bot so much with born-ins -- is:

I was (criminal behavior, addiction, sexual misconduct, greedy and superficial, angry with life, lost and looking for answers, or some other kind of life problem.)

I came to see the light and find meaning through ____.

Now everything is peachy.

Being that the specific religion, doctrine, beliefs, etc. is interchangeable in this scenario -- it's clearly the placebo effect working.

If I look, as you are, from the outside, I see your point. However, as in medicine, a the placebo effect often is short lived because it's not doing anything but helping the emotions temporarily. A true 'medicine' works longer. Much of religion most likely is placebo, and doesn't last. The real thing lasts AND is NOT a 'feel good' thing. As a Christian, all is NOT peachy. The point of Christianity is not 'peachiness'. Take a look at the NT characters: many early Christians were martyred which is far from being a peachy experience I'd guess (never being martyred myself).

[Moses Yoder]

No, it wasn't me. Nor, did I say there is no 'good' or 'bad', but 'good' and 'bad' are subjective, and the belief of what is 'good' and 'bad' will change from person to person, and from society to society. I don't bother with the whole 'who goes to hell' business, because I don't think hell exists. I personally stay away from the criticisms about the implications of claims of 'who goes to hell', because that has a tendency to start getting personal, and I rather address issues, and not people.

Excuse me for mixing up your posting with another one. I must reflect on this idea that "good" and "bad" exist, but are subjective, which means they would have to vary from person to person. Jeffrey Dahmer at one time thought it was good to rape people then eat them. Do you also think that is good, or what? Is there anyone posting here who thinks that is good? If so, are they willing to admit it? If they do, there would probably be an investigation followed by a possible incarceration into a mental hospital.

You see, in my world good and bad are absolutes. If they can change, then they don't exist.

[Mr.Badham]

The placebo effect plays a strong role in relation to religion in general. The placebo effect is very powerful. that is why it is taken into consideration in medical treatments when they are tested.

A typical scenario that is heard from people who convert to a religion -- bot so much with born-ins -- is:

I was (criminal behavior, addiction, sexual misconduct, greedy and superficial, angry with life, lost and looking for answers, or some other kind of life problem.)

I came to see the light and find meaning through ____.

Now everything is peachy.

Being that the specific religion, doctrine, beliefs, etc. is interchangeable in this scenario -- it's clearly the placebo effect working.

If I look, as you are, from the outside, I see your point. However, as in medicine, a the placebo effect often is short lived because it's not doing anything but helping the emotions temporarily. A true 'medicine' works longer. Much of religion most likely is placebo, and doesn't last. The real thing lasts AND is NOT a 'feel good' thing. As a Christian, all is NOT peachy. The point of Christianity is not 'peachiness'. Take a look at the NT characters: many early Christians were martyred which is far from being a peachy experience I'd guess (never being martyred myself).

I think if the religion were like real medicine and lasted you wouldn't have to go to church every week. Read the bible over and over, pray to god every night, come on websites to spout your religious beliefs.

You're taking this placebo over and over. It's almost as if you're a placebo junkie. You're actually addicted to the placebo. You can't live without it.

I'm saying; Let go. Stop going to church. Stop praying. Don't read the bible any more. Don't listen to what others say and see if anything actually changes in your life.